United Taxi Workers Association

[nobbie48]

Forum Sponsor

And you're covered in a taxi? Tell that to the woman in Toronto last week that was injured when the taxi she was in rear ended another cab. Needed emergency dental work, the driver won't give her his insurance information, and Beck's says it's not their problem, they only dispatch the cabs.

Who owns the vehicle? Aren't they responsible or is taxi insurance different?

The way you describe it Beck is no different than Uber but Uber has better cars and usually rates.

Is there some deal where the cab driver has to compensate the cab owner for claims and is therefore trying to dodge the issue by hiding under a rock?

 

[FullMotoJacket]

The way you describe it Beck is no different than Uber but Uber has better cars and usually rates.

That's the point. If you're going to have to play 3 card monty with a cab or Uber if you get into an accident while using either*, why would you get into a ranked out rolling death trap with a driver with a questionable psychological profile at a higher rate?

* A Beck spokesperson finally agreed to "look into the problem", but only after the woman went to CITY and they ran a story on it. Prior to that they told her to pound salt. Driver refused to return her calls, and it's unknown if the car was insured by him or he was leasing it from the owner and he held the insurance.

 

[nobbie48]

That's the point. If you're going to have to play 3 card monty with a cab or Uber if you get into an accident while using either*, why would you get into a ranked out rolling death trap with a driver with a questionable psychological profile at a higher rate?

* A Beck spokesperson finally agreed to "look into the problem", but only after the woman went to CITY and they ran a story on it. Prior to that they told her to pound salt. Driver refused to return her calls, and it's unknown if the car was insured by him or he was leasing it from the owner and he held the insurance.

Back to the insurance angle, if a passenger in my car is injured they are covered (Pathetically) by the medical benefits. I, as the owner, suck up the premium increase if I'm at fault. I suck up the increase if I loaned the car to someone else who is at fault. So what's with Beck and their driver?

Someone was injured so police presence was mandatory. Therefore a police report exists. How is the woman dropping through the cracks?
Why did she have to go to the media hoping they'd air her story?

Some other points:

If Uber gets insurance that somewhat levels the playing field.

Uber doesn't have taxi plates. So what value does a taxi plate give the passenger? What service does the taxi sheriff provide for the passengers? Or is it more like extortion where you have to payola city haul to run a business. Sorta "You have to pay for a plate to compensate the city for making the plates."

Uber uses flex rates. With cabs if a low wage worker has to work late they can budget their trip home. If it's a peak time Uber chokes them.
Uber isn't the only one to do it. Chinese buffets charge extra on holidays, motels can triple rates if there is a major event nearby. Premium fares are one thing but predator pricing is another. Some limits are needed.

 

[yodude]

Legal status of Uber's service

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_status_of_Uber's_service

Uber is involved in at least 173 lawsuits.[SUP][1][/SUP] As of mid-2015, protests had been staged in Germany, Spain, France, and the United Kingdom, among other nations, and dangerous incidents involving passengers have been documented.[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][3][/SUP] Uber executives were arrested in France in June 2015. In December 2014, Uber was banned in Spain and in two cities in India. Uber continues to be involved in disputes with several governmental bodies, including local governments in the U.S. and Australia.

old news
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...r-taxi-app-drivers-don-t-correct-permits.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/09/02/1409651790500_wps_2_Taxi_drivers_gather_next_.jpg

 

[Delboy]

Is the insurance question not moot?

Ontario No Fault - What “no-fault” means is that regardless of who is to blame for the accident, any injured persons may receive some compensation, the compensation available is referred to as accident benefits. Therefore these benefits are available to any injured party in a car accident regardless of their role in the accident, be it a driver, a passenger or even a pedestrian. Accident benefits are claimed from your own insurance company, therefore a driver, passenger or pedestrian will make a claim from their respective insurance companies." - http://zvulony.ca/2012/articles/personal-injury-law/car_accidents/

I guess you would only have a claim against the uber or taxi driver If you did not have any policy of your own for accident benefits, or it were a Tort action. Can one of the brokers on here confirm this?

 

[PrivatePilot]

Don't care about taxi thing but I still think if your the passenger that pukes you should be the one to pay to clean it or you clean it.

If you did it in my personal car then those would be the only 2 options you would have to choose.

Chicago has a $100 puke fee for cabs. The cabbie I was talking to said even that was too low. Getting the car cleaned at 2am costs him a few hours of prime earning time.

I'd like to know how they collect on that. If you're so trashed that you puke in a cab chances are suddenly demands for an extra $100 could escalate into bad things quickly. Either that, or a giant middle finger.

Not saying that offenders shouldn't pay nor be responsible...just wondering in that situation how often offenders either tell the driver to get stuffed, or threaten to put his dentist into a higher tax bracket and the driver backs down.

 

[nobbie48]

Is the insurance question not moot?

Ontario No Fault - What “no-fault” means is that regardless of who is to blame for the accident, any injured persons may receive some compensation, the compensation available is referred to as accident benefits. Therefore these benefits are available to any injured party in a car accident regardless of their role in the accident, be it a driver, a passenger or even a pedestrian. Accident benefits are claimed from your own insurance company, therefore a driver, passenger or pedestrian will make a claim from their respective insurance companies." - http://zvulony.ca/2012/articles/personal-injury-law/car_accidents/

I guess you would only have a claim against the uber or taxi driver If you did not have any policy of your own for accident benefits, or it were a Tort action. Can one of the brokers on here confirm this?

If the policy isn't valid because of commercial use of the vehicle there is no coverage. Our accident medical benefits suck and with a commercial policy one would expect higher standards but that may be wishful thinking.

 

[Irocian]

My point was it's mostly the customers that make the cab filthy and think not my problem to clean it.

People these days could care less about others but if the cab rode in your car and did the same things hold on the your hat as the they would scream how wrong it is to happen to them.

 

[nobbie48]

Commercial insurance can be complicated.

The following bit is about an 18 wheeler crash that severely injured a friend of mine. Everyone was saying it was the other guys insurance that should have paid. Forget about getting it out of the truck driver. The truck hit the guardrail and jolted him against the cab roof breaking his neck. He is apparently a quadriplegic.

So who carries the insurance with a taxi?


Penske owned the truck, it had just left a Penske repair shop for brake failure only 10 minutes before it hit me. Yet the Accident Investigators proved, that the truck still had major ABS issues on one wheel, and that indirectly caused the accident, ergo Penske & Co are at fault.

The truck was leased to Company 'A' who then sub-leased it out to Company 'B', who then hired a local driver to go get the truck and bring it to their yard.

That driver's logbook showed him in Seattle, WA twelve days prior to the accident, and not a single entry since then.... so, that begs the question of how he got from Seattle to Phoenix AZ ??

 

[j2]

Is the insurance question not moot?

Ontario No Fault - What “no-fault” means is that regardless of who is to blame for the accident, any injured persons may receive some compensation, the compensation available is referred to as accident benefits. Therefore these benefits are available to any injured party in a car accident regardless of their role in the accident, be it a driver, a passenger or even a pedestrian. Accident benefits are claimed from your own insurance company, therefore a driver, passenger or pedestrian will make a claim from their respective insurance companies." - http://zvulony.ca/2012/articles/personal-injury-law/car_accidents/

I guess you would only have a claim against the uber or taxi driver If you did not have any policy of your own for accident benefits, or it were a Tort action. Can one of the brokers on here confirm this?

I believe you are correct in that you claim off your own insurance company, even if your car was not involved. That's the point of no fault. Even if the other party is not covered you are still protected and the pool of premiums is divided up at the end of the year.

I was rear ended in an uber. Ironically it was by a taxi. My co worker injured her shoulder and had to claim from her own insurance AFTER she exhausted her company benefits, but that's another story

 

[nobbie48]

I believe you are correct in that you claim off your own insurance company, even if your car was not involved. That's the point of no fault. Even if the other party is not covered you are still protected and the pool of premiums is divided up at the end of the year.

I was rear ended in an uber. Ironically it was by a taxi. My co worker injured her shoulder and had to claim from her own insurance AFTER she exhausted her company benefits, but that's another story

I assume your coworker had an auto policy somewhere as it would have covered her in any situation where the injuries were caused by a vehicular collision. What if she didn't have that coverage? ie an environmentalist who didn't have a car.

Point 2 is that your co worker used up her benefits due to a situation she didn't create. I assume the benefits were physio. With her benefits used up she would have to pay if she needed physio due to issues related to her personal life, twisting an ankle while hiking, back ache from moving furniture etc.

I can't believe the pathetic insurance coverage we are getting here and they're making it worse. Thank you Dalton and Kathy.

 

[-D-]

We get what we accept and vote for.
There are some smart people here with the time to actually do something e.g. start a FB movement and try to get social media traction, gather the motorsports hobby community to start and simply highlight the insurance issue and vote politicians in/out.

Wishful thinking here, if a large amount of ppl switched to one carrier (listed on stock exchange) then we can make money from the stock and force change by basically deciding who will stay in business...compete or die...capitalism at work

 

[FullMotoJacket]

Best unicorns and rainbows post I've read this month.

 

[-D-]

or do nothing and keep complaining...
fortune teller moment
2017 insurance increase...why? grumble grumble, whatever just pay it

 

[nfq]

I live in a somewhat rural area east of Oshawa. A few weeks ago I needed to arrange a ride for a family member and I pulled up the Uber app and was surprised to see several available cars that would have covered the trip. Seems coverage is pretty good.



I think a key thing to remember is that Uber drivers are using their *personal* vehicles. Accordingly, it's in their best interest to keep them clean for two reasons: One, because it's their personal vehicle..and most people have some pride in ownership..and #2, because of the rating system that is a big part of Uber. Filthy smelly car full of garbage? That last passenger (and probably every one afterwards) is going to note it in their post-trip review, and next thing you know, nobody wants to ride with you anymore. So, it's very self-harming and gives Uber drivers a very strong incentive to make their car a pleasant place to be.



Fair enough, but the taxi industry would do the same thing if they could. It would be incredibly naive to think otherwise. Perhaps part of the road ahead for the taxi companies is deregulation that allows them to do it as well, and the drivers could make a decent living as a result - it would level the playing field which is what most of them are crying about, right? In the end, nobody is forcing you to utilize their services in such situations, despite all the crybaby stories of "Uber charged me $1000 to get home!"...after they acknowledged it several times on their phone before hailing the car. Drunk is no excuse - if they can navigate their phone well enough to open the app, operate it, and push all the required buttons to hail the ride...they are apparently able to freakin' read still.



Aviva is coming out with a supplementary Uber coverage option in Ontario reportedly by the end of this month and Intact was looking at it as well. That soon removes that as an issue. I agree though, part of the regulation should be ensuring that proper commercial insurance is carried - yes, Uber claims to have self-insured their drivers, but when it comes time to make a claim that seems foggy.

Aviva will cover you for up to 20 hours/week Uber-ing:
http://business.financialpost.com/n...ays-ride-sharing-insurance-coming-in-february

 

[FullMotoJacket]

or do nothing and keep complaining...

What you're suggesting is is an almost ad verbatim cut and paste of the usual "Boycott (Shell, Esso, Petro Can, Husky - pick one), we can bring them to their knees" emails that get circulated every time there's a significant spike in oil prices........and we all know how successful those are.

 

[Bermuda]

I have heard that they increase prices in high demand times. Other than hotels what businesses can do this?

How about the business which manages the most essential of services - Hydro One. You want (read: need, because it's not 1900) electricity, you pay premiums depending on the time of day you use it.

I would say there is a difference here, which is that, despite being variable across a 24 hour period, electricity prices are constant. Uber surge pricing comes and goes based on an arbitrary definition set out by Uber, as it sees fit.

 

[j2]

I assume your coworker had an auto policy somewhere as it would have covered her in any situation where the injuries were caused by a vehicular collision. What if she didn't have that coverage? ie an environmentalist who didn't have a car.

Point 2 is that your co worker used up her benefits due to a situation she didn't create. I assume the benefits were physio. With her benefits used up she would have to pay if she needed physio due to issues related to her personal life, twisting an ankle while hiking, back ache from moving furniture etc.

I can't believe the pathetic insurance coverage we are getting here and they're making it worse. Thank you Dalton and Kathy.

Yes. She had car insurance. I would imagine if you had no insurance you would have to try and claim through the taxi company and/or Uber driver.

Point 2 is insane but it has also happened to me in the past. I broke and arm and a leg in an auto accident and TD wouldn't pay for any physio until I had exhausted my work benefits. I argued with them and FSCO but got nowhere as the insurance act states that you must claim from your corporate coverage first. I actually didn't end up exhausting all my benefits so TD didn't have to pay anything.

Its a nice break for the insurance companies while my employers insurance had to pick up the tab. Fortunately I didn't need physio again in 2011 otherwise I would have been out of pocket and you know TD won't cover that.

 

[yodude]

uber driver shoots people in between fares

https://www.google.ca/search?q=uber...57.6073j0j4&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

Forum Sponsor