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Ultralight "group flight"

Yes. When you get your sailpane licence you get far more meteorology and very little navigation.
Enjoyed this last week.
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Maybe one has to be a pilot but the language is wonderful.
Somehow I manage to wheel the DC-2 around and at least aim it at the field with reasonable accuracy. My feet are actually shuddering on the rudder pedals as I ease back on the throttles and begin the descent. McCabe frequently calls off the air speed, which is, maddeningly, always too fast or too slow. When he drops the flaps, I shove the nose down so violently that our attitude becomes nearly a straight dive. McCabe moans in protest. I haul back on the control wheel. We instantly balloon upward and hang ridiculously in a half stall. I shove the nose down again and repeat the entire sequence of ugly gyrations until we swoop over some telephone wires and wobble down toward the black cinder field.

This time I am determined there will be no more bouncing. I will astonish McCabe with the featherlike touch of our wheels.

As the edge of the field slides beneath the nose, I pull back on the throttles. The engines sputter and backfire. I wait, holding the glide nicely. I do not see McCabe’s hands creep forward along his legs until they are only a few inches from the control wheel. He must allow me actually to make the landing or the whole session is meaningless—but he too has a strong sense of self-preservation.

I have not reckoned with the powerful psychological aftereffect of the previous landings. Now, suddenly, fear of repeating the debacle dominates my reactions. Earth-shy, I level off a good thirty feet above the swiftly passing cinders. Even McCabe is robbed of time to avert the crisis. The DC-2 hesitates as if bewildered by this giddy height and, abandoning all hope, stops flying instantly. Luckily I have kept the wings level, for the descent is as direct as an elevator’s. There is no energy left for bouncing. We hit on all three points with a soul-shattering thump.

I am quite defeated. The sound of the landing is still echoing in my ears as I struggle at least to keep the ship rolling in a straight line. The sound was like a very bad accident in a large hotel kitchen.

“That,” says McCabe, massaging his back, “was not a landing. It was an arrival.”
It was fun sneaking up on unsuspecting powered singles lumbering along and zooming by at 200KPH with negative flaps....heavy 17 meter sailpane but a killer if you stalled a wing.
IAR IS-28B2 Lark - Untitled | Aviation Photo #1458561 | Airliners.net
The newer sailplanes you can't spin and can barely stall.
Loved flying that plane ....was whistling along a wonderful cloudstreet west of Pearson right at cloud base in perfect lift and had to duck as what looked like baseballs coming at me in dozens.o_O
Monarch butterflies using the same lift to migrate ....bit of a shocker that was.
 
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there is no sense of speed unless you hedge hop (Not good).
When some of the long distance sailplane flights are made they fly ridge lift starting in upper New York state and then tree top at 300 kph to jump the gaps on the way to Georgia....insane.

Lots of crazy low altitude flying in Fate is the Hunter
High-performance Eta:
The basic parameter of a glider relevant to this question is its glide ratio. Say, a club glider has a finesse of 40 (that is can glide for 40 km starting at an altitude of 1 km above ground in stagnant air), while the best designs approach incredible glide ratio of 70:1.
There are some insane performances from the specialized sailplanes with longer wings...they also carry water ballast for energy storage and then release it later as lift deteriorates so they can still climb in lighter air.
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You can easily hit high gees in a sailplane and blackout ...ask me how I know. :rolleyes:

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Now, while this parameter does not translate directly to your question of one-hour-distance, it is the most important one, since the higher it is, the better will be glide ratio at higher speeds. Eta’s max speed is 280 km/h, so assuming its GR will decrease to say 50 at this speed, we can say it will cover said 280 km, starting at an altitude of 5600 m, which is still kind of realistic.

Nevertheless, that is the best case scenario of (highly unprobable) flying in a straight line starting at high altitude. In real life when gliding you have to spend certain amount of time on finding and circling the thermals to gain altitude (a standard glider has no engine of its own), thus on a cross-country flight your performance depends on your ability to do that efficiently. In a typical cross-country competition in thermal conditions best mean speeds achieved will reach 140 km/h (which is also an extreme case, since the weather rarely is that good).
 
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good article
I always advise anyone who wants to learn to fly an airplane, to first learn to fly a glider competently. You learn the real essence of flight when you don't have an engine to provide power for you to sustain flight.

The quietness (no engine) and the smoothness of gliding through the air (no engine) allow you to really feel the glider as part of you. Every gentle control input you make, you can feel it in the seat, in the shoulder harness, on your heels, in your gut; and you can see the slightest yaw change in that little tuft of wool in front of your windshield.

Your judgment becomes sharpened each time you descend to land; especially in the old fabric Schweitzer that I flew in with a glide ratio of 13:1. If you're coming in too high or too fast, then you need to bleed some of that speed (energy) off before you over-shoot your landing strip. You do that by bringing up the spoilers from the wing to "spoil" the airflow on top of the wing, which decreases lift, or you can slip the plane in. Slipping is to yaw the glider’s nose away from the direction of flight to increase drag with the side of the fuselage and to mess up the air over the wings. If you're not careful, you can stall the trailing wing in the wake of the fuselage.

My flight instructor would put two road cones out for me to land and stop between them. The distance between the cones would decrease each time I land. Most glider training uses grass or dirt strips, so there's more friction to slow down, although there are brakes on the one wheel in this trainer glider. After a while, you can land and stop within 50 meters.

I got my glider training and license after I got my power license, and I noticed a big difference in my landings in a power plane after glider training. They were always very smooth, quiet, and no bouncing.

The German Luftwaffe pilots were some of the best pilots in WWII. One reason was because they started out in gliders (Treaty of Versailles); at least those who trained before 1940.

In a powered airplane, you cannot circle up in a thermal with a hawk on the opposite side of the thermal with you without a little power. The quiet peaceful serenity in a sailplane is perhaps analogous to a sailboat. You need to learn about mother nature's forces, your sail craft, and your own capabilities.

When soaring, you look for thermals, circle up to gain altitude, and then look for another. The longest glider flight was 1,015 miles.

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Warning: do not fly in a high-performance sailplane on a hot sunny day with lots of thermals around without a large empty bottle. Some of my friends could not come down for many hours from too many thermals around.

May the Thermals be with you.....
One time on my ( successful) 5 hour endurance flight I was really part of the plane chasing a seagull through thermals. Fond memories.
 
I've had a glider / sail plane flight on my wish list since I was a 13 YO cadet at an airshow at Oshawa. The usual noisy stuff was impressive but then a sailplane took off and did its silent dance in the sky. He came in to land downwind and fast, pulled up, did a wing over and back down. He touched down as soft as a feather and about as quiet as a coasting bicycle.

A half brother in New Zealand is an instructor but he's a bit reclusive and the noisy ride down there isn't cheap.
 
Well if you've got $3k and two weeks free you can get solo at York starting now.
I've had wonderful flights in September as the atmosphere is often unsettled and that's what you want
You have a string of nice days coming

At the very least get a demo flight at York or SOSA. Go early so you can get a flight around noon with some lift.
Best days are just after a storm front.
You want a day looking like this, fluffy clouds.
Nearing the end of the lesson we caught some thermals and extended the flight to get some much needed practice circling, eventually getting to cloud base. Shows climb from 1800' to 3900', then 2550' to 5100'.
I pulled off my tow at 900' in Estrella and cleared 10,000' in very short order and there might have been 10,000 more if I had oxygen. Got my diamond climb tho.
That clip is very accurate as to sound tho he has his window open.
When he gets to cloudbase the temp can drop ten degrees or more at the thermocline.
Do that for 5 hours and you are very tired but exhilarated.
Those are very typical Ontario flying conditions. Highest I got in Ontario was just over 9,000' but that was exceptional.
 
Earlier in the thread but .....
Mind the rattle snakes on landing.
 
came across this article
How much harder is it to fly a glider than a light aircraft? Is glider flying much more dangerous?
Flying gliders is considerably harder than flying a GA airplane… There is a false sense of “simplicity” in gliders, usually put forward by GA aviation pilots who do not have a clue about gliders, because there is no engine and the instruments are minimal. But these same factors make flying much more complicated:
  • You need a lot more physical and mental stamina to fly a glider - on average, you would be doing around 90-120 360° turns per hour; often these turn can become tight, so you would be flying with small extra G-force, which wears you out.
  • You need a lot more brain to stay in the air. You do not have the engine, so you have to think where the air goes up…
  • You have to fly close to ground (mountain ridges, mountain slopes) or close to clouds; in both cases you would experience strong turbulance, and you often about 2–4 seconds from ground contact if you make a mistake.
  • You fly often close to other gliders; it is quite common to have 2–4 gliders within 100 meters and sometimes as close as 50 meters; for GA this would be considered near miss.
  • You have just one go for the landing; there is no go-around…
  • Many countries have glider training as part of fighter pilot training, not so GA training.
  • Just to reinforce the point, the spin training is mandatory; most GA pilots never experienced a spin…, and you fly with a parachute by default.
The Czech designed Blanik is one of those
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I have many fond memories of flying the club one...full flaps, retractable landing gear, mostly all aluminum ....rattled like a tin can fill of rocks if you approached stall while climbing in a thermal. Superb visibility and fully aerobatic as befits an older military trainer.
On your training progression you first fly passengers in the rear seat and then move up to flying passengers in the front seat.
The L-13 Blaník is a two-seater trainer glider produced by Let Kunovice since 1956. It is the most numerous and widely used glider in the world. In United States Air Force Academy service, it is designated TG-10C and was used for basic flight training up to 2012.
learned a few things too

Military operators[edit]​

Australia Australia
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Estonia
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Italy Italian Air Force operated 2 LET L-13 Blaník from 1977 until 1999[7]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LET_L-13_Blaník#cite_note-7
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Lithuania
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Soviet Union
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Spain
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United States United States Air Force Academy from 2002 until 2012
 
I’ve flown in several different gliders and done aerobatics in them. Lots of fun. Less fun was manhandling one back down a runway. Most memorable flight was in an open cockpit side by side. Just the wind whistling by. If there was a glider club nearby I’d consider spending a summer getting wings but I think my closest is Hawkesbury. We have a powered flight club nearby but I don’t have the disposable income to consider that route.
 
I’ve flown in several different gliders and done aerobatics in them. Lots of fun. Less fun was manhandling one back down a runway. Most memorable flight was in an open cockpit side by side. Just the wind whistling by. If there was a glider club nearby I’d consider spending a summer getting wings but I think my closest is Hawkesbury. We have a powered flight club nearby but I don’t have the disposable income to consider that route.
How much is avgas these days. I can barely afford the car stuff. $1.599 / L @ Costco today. Still planes it could be argued are in some ways cheap on fuel. 15 MPG @ 120 MPH, better if down wind.
 
How much is avgas these days. I can barely afford the car stuff. $1.599 / L @ Costco today. Still planes it could be argued are in some ways cheap on fuel. 15 MPG @ 120 MPH, better if down wind.
100LL is 2.50-3.00. MoGas is over 2 at the airports.

Being able to go relatively straight to your destination does help. A buddy is 6 hours at ~15 mpg in his truck or 1.75 hours in the plane to get to the cottage (also close to 15 mpg). Plane route has many less miles (but does incur some driving miles at each one to get to/from airfields). Plane maintenance is far more than truck maintenance per mile though.
 
JC100
You can do it at York or SOSA in 2-3 weeks by staying at the airfield. There are trailers to rent.
Towards the end of the training you can score up to 4 x 1000' tows a day to finish off the requisite numbers. ( 40 fights).
There plenty of places to fly just south of you as well as Hawksbury.

It's not a bad fleet either

The Grob Twin is a lovely safe plane to learn in they have two trainers in that class.
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100LL is 2.50-3.00. MoGas is over 2 at the airports.

Being able to go relatively straight to your destination does help. A buddy is 6 hours at ~15 mpg in his truck or 1.75 hours in the plane to get to the cottage (also close to 15 mpg). Plane route has many less miles (but does incur some driving miles at each one to get to/from airfields). Plane maintenance is far more than truck maintenance per mile though.
When had my plane at Brampton I speculated a race at reasonable speeds from my house to Parliament Hill.

For me it would be a drive to the airport and preflight, planning and possibly fuel. If the pumps were closed I'd be screwed. If fuel was good it would be about an hour from leaving home to wheels up. Ottawa would be about 2 hours flight probably having to land at Rockcliff. Then arrange ground transportation with a arrival time at the hill about four hours after leaving home.

I have driven to Ottawa in four hours in my young and foolish days but would allow four and a half to five now.

Any disturbance in either vehicle could tilt the figures.

Sault Ste Marie would be diffierent. While the wheels up to down would be about the same the car, not being able to effectively pass over Manitoulin Island would have about an eight hour drive.

The killer for the pilot would be weather, getting grounded midway until it cleared. The car just turns on the wipers.
 
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Are you saying that i could make my childhood dream come true? :oops:
JC100
You can do it at York or SOSA in 2-3 weeks by staying at the airfield. There are trailers to rent.
Towards the end of the training you can score up to 4 x 1000' tows a day to finish off the requisite numbers. ( 40 fights).
There plenty of places to fly just south of you as well as Hawksbury.

It's not a bad fleet either

The Grob Twin is a lovely safe plane to learn in they have two trainers in that class.
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Yup - it was on my bucket list as well after skipping Airline Flight School in the 60s to go to uni instead. Took untill my mid 30s to tackle it and did it in 5 weeks starting early August.
Several satifying years ensued. 🌈
 

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