True or false

[sircastic]

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changing your oil often is not detrimental to the life of an engine. Not changing it often enough is. simple fact.

Unless you're filling your filter with oil prior to installation and building pressure before the engine fires you could very well be doing more damage changing your more often than necessary.



On the synthetic vs. dino topic ... synthetic doesn't break down as quickly as dino oil; it retains it's cushioning and lubrication qualities longer. If you're changing your oil on a severe duty schedule (cars / trucks) then synthetic in most cases is overkill as dino oil won't have broken down during the period between changes.

Synthetic does become contaminated exactly the same as dino oil. If your engine is works hard on a regular basis, is older or out of tune then you would want to change it on a severe duty schedule.

 

[Brian P]

There are a few higher end brand cars that have no dipsticks for the owners to check.

I HATE THAT

They're trying to make the cars non-user-serviceable and non-corner-garage-serviceable. They have an oil level sensor and you have to read the oil level using the diagnostic system. There is SO much potential fail built into a system like that.

At least for VW/Audi, there is a very good aftermarket on-board diagnostic tool that works on any laptop (comes with a cable to the OBD-II port) and only costs a couple hundred bucks. But my VW has a dipstick.

I doubt if I'll ever own a high-end vehicle of the sort that doesn't have a good old-fashioned dipstick. If BMW starts doing that on a 3-series BMW then I ain't buying one.

More and more vehicles are coming equipped with an on board maintenance reminder systems, so the 3,000 mile or 3 month sales pitch will eventually vanish.

That's if people pay attention to them, rather than just taking the car in every 3000 mi regardless.

 

[Wingboy]

Lol.My Wing has a dipstick.I think i even used it once.I ride it for about 8k..dump 4l and fill with 4l of fresh dino oil.
Can anyone show me an engine failure that was caused by oil fail in a street vehicle?

 

[braveheart]

Wow, so much fail..

just going to leave it at that ? would you like to inform us on whats right ?

 

[fastar1]

i change my oil when I feel i want it changed.

To those that think that 3 or 5 k might be too early to change it, think about this...

changing your oil often is not detrimental to the life of an engine. Not changing it often enough is. simple fact.

another thing to think about, are the people who use synthetic oils... if you bought your bike used, and the previous owner didnt use synthetic oil, and didnt change it regularly, then the damage has already been done, and you're just wasting your money.

Straight from the school of "if a little bit is good, more is better".

Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't you a type II diabetic? I'm asking because you'd think someone with the condition would learn something from that experience.

 

[daught]

just going to leave it at that ? would you like to inform us on whats right ?

The opposite

You might wanna change your tires every 10K, to ensure you have maximum grip.

 

[braveheart]

Straight from the school of "if a little bit is good, more is better".

Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't you a type II diabetic? I'm asking because you'd think someone with the condition would learn something from that experience.

i have no idea what you are talking about.

show me where it says changing oil too often can damage your engine.

will it cost more $$$ to change it more often, of course. but from anything i have ever heard, changing your oil often does not damage your engine. not changing it enough, does.

 

[S500K]

So oil colour is a better indication of usage than mileage?

Maybe? Depending on the conditions and how you drive or ride, the oil will breakdown quicker? even though you only put low km on it.....No references, just a thought.

 

[CruisnGrrl]

on the bike i base it on the consistancy of the oil. if it doesn't feel slippery when i check the dipstick or when i'm shifting it gets changed.

 

[fastar1]

i have no idea what you are talking about.

show me where it says changing oil too often can damage your engine.

will it cost more $$$ to change it more often, of course. but from anything i have ever heard, changing your oil often does not damage your engine. not changing it enough, does.

It doesn't do any harm to change it every day either, that doesn't make it a reason to do so.

Premature oil changes waste time, money, oil, and the environment. Plus, every time you perform service on a vehicle you increase the chance of something going wrong.

But it shouldn't even be a question of pointing out all the downsides one by one, there's one of life's simplest principles that directs us to the right course of action in a case like this, and that is balance. It's something we should have learned when we were five and heard the stoy of goldilocks, "this one's too hot, this one's too cold, this one's just right". There is an oil change interval that is too short, and one that is too long, and while we can never get it exactly right, 3000km for a daily driver is clearly too short, there's just no way around it. I shake my head that adults actually need this explained to them.

My favourite quote of all time is "all movements go too far" and I find there are more and more examples of this in the very minutea of our daily lives. This same cognitive defect that leads to premature oil change intervals also explains the greater part of human suffering throughout history. Sorry for the drama but people are pissing me off more and more every day and you, sir, are acting like a person.

 

[NP6000]

i have no idea what you are talking about.

show me where it says changing oil too often can damage your engine.

will it cost more $$$ to change it more often, of course. but from anything i have ever heard, changing your oil often does not damage your engine. not changing it enough, does.

Lube oil analysis as a function of time (or mileage) shows a large initial spike in wear metals at the early hours/miles of the lube oil life - the units are wear metals concentration versus unit time. It will then trends downward with time/mileage until it levels off for a period of time until the additives are depleted and the wear metal per unit time/mileage ascends.

There are numerous studies floating around on the internet. The lab work I have done matches this general wear metal profile as well. Based on this you can establish that changing engine oil too frequently can be harmful to an engine.

The explanation I have received is that the initial high levels of detergency interfere with the lubricating qualities during early hours/miles of operation.

This is also the reason why racing oils have low levels of detergency - there are inherently designed to cope with frequent change intervals, high shearing loads, fuel dilution, excessive temps, etc.

 

[daught]

Lube oil analysis as a function of time (or mileage) shows a large initial spike in wear metals at the early hours/miles of the lube oil life - the units are wear metals concentration versus unit time. It will then trends downward with time/mileage until it levels off for a period of time until the additives are depleted and the wear metal per unit time/mileage ascends.

There are numerous studies floating around on the internet. The lab work I have done matches this general wear metal profile as well. Based on this you can establish that changing engine oil too frequently oil changes can be harmful to an engine.

The explanation I have received is that the initial high levels of detergency interfere with the lubricating qualities during early hours/miles of operation.

This is also the reason why racing oils have low levels of detergency - there are inherently designed to cope with frequent change intervals, high shearing loads, fuel dilution, excessive temps, etc.

Could it be because high initial detergent levels clean all the deposits?

 

[NP6000]

Could it be because high initial detergent levels clean all the deposits?

It could be, but I can't get a straight answer from the chemical engineers that know the product and the answer to your question. I have my own thoughts on this, but it is purely speculation so I won't comment here.

 

[boarder360]

Kind of off topic, but what are your guys thoughts on high mileage oil? My Acura RSX has about 129000km on it and now they keep trying to push the high mileage on me. My car doesnt burn any oil and the oil isnt really that dirty when i change it. I think they are just trying to suck more money out of me cause i change my own air filter and cabin air filter.

 

[GayManLoveIsOK]

I'm usually 10-12K between oil changes on the cars, for the bike, i have a little glass window to look through, if i can't see the markers i change it or every 6K'ish...never had a problem, and hopefully never will...worked with a lady once that complained her engine seized and the dealership was giving her trouble because she never changed her oil in 27K since buying it knew...her old car told her when to bring it in for oil change, the minivan didn't...the funny part was her husband worked for a dealership, and the manufacturer changed their engine for them for free...squeaky wheel gets the grease i guess...

 

[NP6000]

Kind of off topic, but what are your guys thoughts on high mileage oil? My Acura RSX has about 129000km on it and now they keep trying to push the high mileage on me. My car doesnt burn any oil and the oil isnt really that dirty when i change it. I think they are just trying to suck more money out of me cause i change my own air filter and cabin air filter.

I wouldn't worry about it, K20 motors are reliable. HM oil contains seal swelling agents in the additive pack, but "if it ain't broke don't fix it." Stay on top of change intervals, use the correct oil as per manufacturer recommendation, and keep it topped off - your good to go

 

[Jinster81]

I wish they did a comprehensive side by side test on vehicles with different oil change intervals. Have multiple cars of the same make, model, and mileage. Then, do a test. One car with manufacturer's service interval, one with earlier than, and one with later than. Have the cars driven side by side at all times at the same conditions for a long term, all while recording the fuel mileage and emissions data on each car. After a long term. Have the cars in a shop, and do a complete tear down of the engine. Record all visual signs of wear and tear on each car's engine, and measure all clearances.

The data gathered this way would be the most telling right?

 

[invictus43]

I wish they did a comprehensive side by side test on vehicles with different oil change intervals. Have multiple cars of the same make, model, and mileage. Then, do a test. One car with manufacturer's service interval, one with earlier than, and one with later than. Have the cars driven side by side at all times at the same conditions for a long term, all while recording the fuel mileage and emissions data on each car. After a long term. Have the cars in a shop, and do a complete tear down of the engine. Record all visual signs of wear and tear on each car's engine, and measure all clearances.

The data gathered this way would be the most telling right?

I'm trying to find an article from a while back, Car and Driver took two identical cars, ran them for 100,000 miles and then tore down the engines. One had mfg service interval oil changes, one had no oil or filter changes except for keeping it topped up. The tear-down revealed no significant difference between the engines. YMMV...

 

[Riceburner]

lol... According to the link in the article... http://www.checkyournumber.org/ ....my minivan should have the oil changed every 3k miles. The owners manual states more than that.

 

[NP6000]

I wish they did a comprehensive side by side test on vehicles with different oil change intervals. Have multiple cars of the same make, model, and mileage. Then, do a test. One car with manufacturer's service interval, one with earlier than, and one with later than. Have the cars driven side by side at all times at the same conditions for a long term, all while recording the fuel mileage and emissions data on each car. After a long term. Have the cars in a shop, and do a complete tear down of the engine. Record all visual signs of wear and tear on each car's engine, and measure all clearances.

The data gathered this way would be the most telling right?

The data gathered from such a test probably won't have much signifigance. The unique characterisitics of each engine, each drive cycle, each lube oil will be different for every individual on the road. Completing such a test would give you a very small data set relative to the total number of data points needed to characterize all of the parameters that will influence engine life and lube oil life.

Manufacturers spend a great deal of time with "Design of Experiment" studies to characterize all of these parameters. Vehicles with engine oil life monitors are pretty good in this regard - if your drive cycle is "hard" on the lube oil the service interval becomes shorter, and vice versa. The problem lies when the end user doesn't adhere to the manufacturers recommendations and there is a serious failure as a result.

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