Tires, warmers and a cold track | GTAMotorcycle.com

Tires, warmers and a cold track

YellowDuck

YellowDuck

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Help me get some perspective here....

I am running Pirelli Superbike Pro tires (the "red stripe" track day slicks), which I understand to be essentially performance street tires without sipes. Mine have about 10 track days on them. Outings 8 and 9 (TMP and GB) they were awesome - got them really hot and they stuck like glue.

More recently at TMP (late September) is was quite cold, windy, and there was no direct sun all day. Tires were slippery in the morning, making me very nervous. I reduced pressures and they did get a little better in the afternoon, but were still giving me spooky slides at pretty moderate cornering loads, preventing me from running at my normal pace. Not fun.

So, my question: Is it likely that these tires are just shot and need to be replaced? They seem to have a fair bit of depth left judging by the indicators. Or is it more likely that they sucked because of the temperatures, and I will love them again next time they are on a warm track? If the latter, then would tire warmers have made my day more enjoyable this last time out?

For reference, I am typically doing about 1:29.0 at TMP, with maybe 90 hp on tap (Ducati Sport Classic). So, mid pack-ish Intermediate group.
 
Re: tire warmers. The three people in the pit beside me were complaining they couldn't keep heat in their Dunlop 211GP slicks. The first lap out they'd be OK then degrade from there. I think in 7 degree C ambient temps with no sun out at all it'd be super hard to keep heat in them even with tire warmers.

I didn't seem to have a problem getting my Bridgestone S20's a little melty that day, no warmers, lots of fun :)

Are you going to TMP this weekend? 5 degrees C on Sat, should be interesting :D

-Jamie M.
 
From the John Bickle tire warmer thread above ^^^^


Cayuga and Shannonville will not build heat under 15 Celcius. So if your tires are 80 C going out and you ride for 10 laps you will propbaly come in at 55-6-C,ish. Calabogie and Mosport,Tremblant you will maintain heat. Calabogie at 10 C you will maintain heat.
You can see evidence of this in a race on a very cold day when guys crash on the last lap or so and are not going faster. The tire just lost heat. So racing on a cold day,,be a hero in the first laps!
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What is proper operating temp for the Superbike Pros? It won't be as hot as true race tires.

You don't want to over heat the tires by using warmers that are set for race tires. Getting them 'warm' would help and it might even be easier to keep them 'warm' at TMP since they aren't true race tires.

Or maybe they are just shot.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk 2
 
I'm going to go ahead and say that the tires are shot. My friend used the Pros for a season and while he got a lot of wear out of them, they got progressively less grippy as he went. Following him was easy, he'd leave a black line out of every corner on his line.
 
You got 10 days out of slicks?

Dont know much about Pirelli slicks, but damn thats alot of track time on those tires.
 
infernobuster said:
You got 10 days out of slicks?

Dont know much about Pirelli slicks, but damn thats alot of track time on those tires.
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They aren't the Diablo Superbike slicks, they're meant for trackday.riders.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk 2
 
Yeah, the Pros are really thick (and heavy), with a harder compound in the center. Like I said, they wear a long time but their grip levels go way off.
 
infernobuster said:
You got 10 days out of slicks?

Dont know much about Pirelli slicks, but damn thats alot of track time on those tires.
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These guys claim to have done 1,400 track miles without warmers on the superbike pros.
http://canyonchasers.net/reviews/tires/pirelli-redstripe.php

I have 5 days on a set (no warmers) and there is still tons of meat and grip is still acceptable for track riding. I did notice a bit of sliding starting to happen on my last day though.
 
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dricked said:
1,400 track miles on one tire....damn they're slow lol.
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Its not supposed to be a race tire... imo they are quick enough for their intended customer *edited* when used for a "reasonable" mileage - i.e. probably a lot less than 1400 miles!
 
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dricked said:
840 laps around Shannonville with one tire is rediculas.
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Yep. My buddy clocked about 1400km on his, too. And at that point the tire had material still left - but it wasn't sticking as well as a street tire, he said.
 
1400km is a big difference from 1400mi. I'm sure they're ok for their intended purpose, going slow for a long time.
 
im no expert, but i ran street tires on warmers and had tons of grip even in the early morning sessions and i sit around a 1:26 at tmp, what ive learned from guys who go fast, with a slick, the more times it goes cold the harder it gets, so they keep them on warmers constantly and at the end of the day theyll leave the warmers on but unplugged and let them gradually cool off rather than just un covering them and letting them get cold fast. seems to save the rubber a bit that way and you extend the life a bit. still 10 track days is pretty good for a set of tires.
 
Thanks for all the replies. Okay, new tires for sure then, and maybe also warmers and a generator if I can scrape up the funds by next spring.
 
FWIW, the Dunlop slicks last quite awhile, not as long as the hockey puck Pirelli obviously but they have a lot more grip.
 
I get a day and a half at Calabogie at an average 2:15 pace before a medium Dunlop NTEC starts to spin coming out of 2, 4, 7, 10, 13, 14, 20.... :D I can stretch it out to two days but only if I short-shift and plan for wheelspin, especially through 4 and 10 where I have had some long power slides in fourth. Shannonville is a spin/wheelie/hop/weave #$^&show no matter how good the tires are, so why worry, be happy...

...on the other hand, the higher your corner speeds, the longer the rear lasts. Lap times go down, tire wear improves... who'd have thunk it...
 
I got a set of these from Gary Harrison...He had 6 trackdays at Calabogie on them and they still looked mint. He is a faster rider than I am.

We put them on our endurance bike and rode one endurance race and they worked good, right off the warmers.....and we were only 10 seconds off the win. After the endurance race they looked the same as they did before...no discernible wear. I think they have 80-90% of the grip of a race tire, with at least twice the lifespan.

Next round, we flipped both the front and rear and won our endurance race on them. They worked good for the first two hrs, but by the last hr I could spin the rear up almost at will exitting any corner I wanted, sliding sideways on an old carbed R6......That was the last time we used them....funny thing is that they still look pretty good as far as tread wear,LOL.......We did 350+ laps on them, after they already had 6 trackdays on them....... Alot of tire for the money. If I didn't race and just did trackdays, this would be my tire of choice if I was only buying new tires and no scrubs.
 
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