This is why security guards don't do squat when your bike is stolen!

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This happened a couple of hundred metres from where I work, not long before I left. Multiple ambulances at Dundas Square and Victoria, and police driving through the pedestrian mall at Ryerson. I worry about our security guys, because of scum like these.
 
kellen said:
my point was minumum wage, minimum effort. fast food or security.

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Of course and I agree. I would just add that it is an industry accepted standard, we shouldn't be surpised or fault them too much for condo thefts. They are doing their best under the circumstances.

I must say though, I have never had a problem with chewed up wires! Damn proud of their work keeping the bunnies away.
 
Kuro said:
So effort should be based on how much you feel you should be paid for the job?
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No but compensation should be a reflection of risk, demand, and factors invested in delivering a specialty service.

The higher the demand, the higher the pay.
The higher the risk, the higher the pay.
The higher the specialization / training / materials / intellectual investment, the higher the pay.

Conversely...
the lower the pay, the lower the demand (i.e. you wont have the creme de la creme lining up, and the lower importance put on aspects of the job).
the lower the pay, the less risk is taken on.
the lower the pay, the less materials, training, and intellectual investment.

Take is as less "effort". As compensation / money / credit is an abstract representation of "effort / work", if you give little, you get back little in return.

$10 / hr is $16.5k per anum. Call it $14k after tax. That's a so so 1 bedroom apartment in the city with $2k left over for food, transportation, and forget about a life. So why would a guard risk his life for your posh toy in the garage?

Hell he probably despises you for it!

In the end there are 3 types who become security guards for that kind of pay:
1) dead beat failures
2) students who utilize the downtime for study and see the job as an interim step.
3) immigrants who are augmenting their qualifications and can't wait to move onto to a job as a doctor in line with their previous job in whatever country they came from and the already 7 years of study they invested.

Why would any of them give a toss about your / my operpriced luxury vehicle or toy?
 
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awyala said:
No but compensation should be a reflection of risk, demand, and factors invested in delivering a specialty service.

The higher the demand, the higher the pay.
The higher the risk, the higher the pay.
The higher the specialization / training / materials / intellectual investment, the higher the pay.

Conversely...
the lower the pay, the lower the demand (i.e. you wont have the creme de la creme lining up, and the lower importance put on aspects of the job).
the lower the pay, the less risk is taken on.
the lower the pay, the less materials, training, and intellectual investment.

Take is as less "effort". As compensation / money / credit is an abstract representation of "effort / work", if you give little, you get back little in return.

$10 / hr is $16.5k per anum. Call it $14k after tax. That's a so so 1 bedroom apartment in the city with $2k left over for food, transportation, and forget about a life. So why would a guard risk his life for your posh toy in the garage?

Hell he probably despises you for it!

In the end there are 3 types who become security guards for that kind of pay:
1) dead beat failures
2) students who utilize the downtime for study and see the job as an interim step.
3) immigrants who are augmenting their qualifications and can't wait to move onto to a job as a doctor in line with their previous job in whatever country they came from and the already 7 years of study they invested.

Why would any of them give a toss about your / my operpriced luxury vehicle or toy?
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Bang on. I was in category 2 when I worked contract security, and that pretty accurately sums it up.
 
short stop said:
Bang on. I was in category 2 when I worked contract security, and that pretty accurately sums it up.
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I was 2) also back in my time.

I wrapped up many a 5,000 or 10,000 word thesis on the job!
I also used to take skinny dips in the condos pool and hot tub on my 2am rounds!
 
awyala said:
No but compensation should be a reflection of risk, demand, and factors invested in delivering a specialty service.
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Yeah I understand that. My issue was more with the attitude towards jobs that don't pay more than min wage.
The job description should outline your tasks before you're hired. If its too much work for the amount of pay, then don't agree to it and then do jack all spouting "I'm not paid enough for this".

The company hiring is at partially at fault for maybe putting too much duty on the worker, but also conversely, you're agreeing to do that work by taking the job. Some people just sound too entitled to "work" for min wage.
 
Kuro said:
Yeah I understand that. My issue was more with the attitude towards jobs that don't pay more than min wage.
The job description should outline your tasks before you're hired. If its too much work for the amount of pay, then don't agree to it and then do jack all spouting "I'm not paid enough for this".

The company hire is at partially at fault for maybe putting too much duty on the worker, but also conversely, you're agreeing to do that work by taking the job. Some people just sound too entitled to "work" for min wage.
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When I was hired, my boss was a realist, yet he was in the security business for his entire life and took his job seriously.

He told me "I know what this job entails on paper, but I also know the reality of the job...it's 7 hours of pure boredom and 1 accumlative hour of activity. What I cannot accept is sleeping on the job, it's a problem, so do what ever it takes to stay awake. I encourage you to do your studies as that keeps you mentally alert, just keep it discreet so the residents don't see you"

I did the graveyard shift through university and it was a great job, given how practical my boss was.

In the end, I did my job well, when it was expected of me to do so. On the flip side, it was a gated community in Oakville gaurding pensioners. The gate house was the front line against thieves and we logged all visitors in or out, and I had to personally speak with them before they entered and assess who invited them. Only residents with a badge got a pass, and I ****** off many residents who I didn't recognize and were too cocky to show their badge to me.

The physical set up of that kind of security did more than 5 patrols can ever do.

As I said you pay for what you get. Pay a student decent money ($9.50, when minimum wage was $6.85), lay down some practical expectations, front up cash for proper physical defence systems, and don't throw the employee into high risk life and death situations and you have a recipe for success.

But may minimum wage, toss them into the fire, and expect Robocop? Nah! Even Robocop got messed up!
 
Kuro said:
So effort should be based on how much you feel you should be paid for the job?
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get your head out of your ass. real talk.

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Macs said:
And the guys at work ALL make fun of me for wearing a stab/spike plate in my vest. Good luck to the guard. Only pathetic cowards would come from behind with a knife.

Kevlar only vests will actually do very little to stop a knife.
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Keep at it. Stupid macho people that underestimate the importance of protection. I get made fun of for wearing a respirator and goggles if there's dust around. I'm sure in the end il be laughing for many more years than them.
 
Don't those guys carry batons?
 
short stop said:
When it comes to contract security, you're usually gonna get the bottom of the barrel. First off, the client will take the lowest bidder, and when it comes to overall budget cuts security is the first place they'll cheap out. Second, the contract company needs a cut in order to maximize profit. Hence, the guards themselves get minimum wage.

It's a crap job and unduly risky for those who work at certain locations.
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Sites do exist that pay top dollar for well qualified guards...far more common is a site that wants to pay no more than minimum for a body to claim they have "security".

Shameless self plug: I've never worked at a site for less than $15.50 an hour. My last permanent posting was $20.75 an hour + Benefits as a Supervisor. I'm only 20. It's all about demeanour and attitude. I'm trying to get into the interview stream for North York General Hospital as a guard right now.
 
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kellen said:
get your head out of your ***. real talk.
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You know well what I'm talking about. Maybe I'm giving you too much credit or you're intentionally making stupid comments?

awyala said:
But pay minimum wage, toss them into the fire, and expect Robocop? Nah! Even Robocop got messed up!
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Yes this last statement I'm fully aware of what the reality is, which kellen seems to thinks he's the only one that understands this for some reason. My thought is that its also what breeds more entitlement attitude. Obviously you can't expect the world for min wage and thats where the employers are at fault. There are going to be people who need a job and will take it even though they know the expectations aren't realistic so they end up doing nothing at their job because they feel like they deserve more. If their expected role was to give a false sense of security.... thats not so hard now is it?

In reality, this is a broken model.

awyala said:
Pay a student decent money ($9.50, when minimum wage was $6.85), lay down some practical expectations, front up cash for proper physical defence systems, and don't throw the employee into high risk life and death situations and you have a recipe for success.
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This is what I'm getting at. Laying down some practical expectations and have the employee do them.
Bottom line is, you agreed to these terms, you do the work. If the employers doesn't set practical expectations, don't agree to the job!
 
Kuro said:
This is what I'm getting at. Laying down some practical expectations and have the employee do them.
Bottom line is, you agreed to these terms, you do the work. If the employers doesn't set practical expectations, don't agree to the job!
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I agree with what you've said. But having some experience in this particular field, let's just say that the initial job description and employer expectations aren't always in line. The terms that you agree to are one thing, but the job description and client expectations vary depending on job placement. Of course it's every individual's right to refuse unsafe work, but for people who are depending on that meager paycheque, saying 'no' to a client usually results in 'there's the door'. There will *always* be someone else behind you willing to do that work.
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