The "Official" Watch Thread and all Things Horological

FullMotoJacket said:
WR ratings are done in a controlled environment under specific conditions. Most companies throw in an asterisk and say that their watches aren't guaranteed at the rated depth under all real world conditions. That said, I don't buy 1,000M from a company that is trying to distance themselves from selling on Alibaba/Ali Express not so long ago.
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On the upside, other than as a talking point (and honesty), 1000m water resistance likely doesn't matter for anyone on gtam. I just want to be able to use watches and don't plan on diving with a mechanical so 100m or 200m should be more than enough for me to have no worries about drowning it.

Now, on the honesty front, I would much rather have them label it 200m if that's what it can pass instead of 1000m. I'd be more likely to buy it with a real rating. Who knows, maybe it passes 1000m. If you don't care about size and weight, sealing a small volume against external pressure shouldn't be that hard.
 
crankcall said:
I did some poking around looking for a Baltic blue on the used market . If they are around they are well hidden.
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There's one on Chrono24 from a private seller without the bracelet but with some aftermarket straps:

chrono24.app

Baltic Aquascaphe for C$794 for sale from a Private Seller on Chrono24

Baltic Listing: C$794 Baltic Aquascaphe, Steel; Automatic; Condition Very good; Year 2022; Watch with original box; Watch with original
chrono24.app chrono24.app

Price is $794, which is hardly a bargain considering what one costs new, but I guess the scarcity means they hold value. Having a look for sold ones on the Watch Exchange Canada Subreddit, somewhere around $800-850 seems to be the going asking rate for a used one on rubber.

Considering a new one on rubber is ~$870 CAD, and the bracelet gets you to ~$990, I'd be paying the small premium and be willing to wait for a new one, myself...

FullMotoJacket said:
WR ratings are done in a controlled environment under specific conditions. Most companies throw in an asterisk and say that their watches aren't guaranteed at the rated depth under all real world conditions. That said, I don't buy that you're getting Sea-Dweller specs from something that probably sells on Ali Express with a different brand name/dial for around $100-150.
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Agreed, though I'd guess the less consistent the manufacturing, the less reliable the rating gets, as they're not testing every watch that leaves the factory floor at lower price points, even for more well-known brands. The more variable the tolerances from watch to watch, the more likely one is to get through that leaks like a sieve, hence the conservative guarantees for actual use I think. I see depth ratings like that as similar to brands like Marathon that wank a lot about being 'military grade' and 'US Army Issue'. Anyone who has actually been in the military knows that most issued gear is absolutely garbage (I wasn't, but my wife was, as were a few buddies). I still love Marathon, but it's not the sales pitch they think it is...

Not that it matters much, as nobody who is diving to even a true 100m is relying on a 100m or even 300m rated mechanical watch. My Longines Conquest is not even a dive watch, and is rated to 300m. At Longines level, I don't doubt that's accurate, but it's kind of a meaningless metric beyond knowing that should make it REALLY safe to swim or snorkel with.
 
Because I’m in water most of the summer , and occasionally winter I put a lot of effort into learning about WR with watches , the pressure you generate with a fast front crawl swim can supposedly have the same pressure effect as 100ft of diving . Falling off a surfboard at 15kph can be like 200ft in a very short time . Falling water skiing is crazy pressure for a short period. It’s that momentary blast of 150psi water that worries me more than sitting on the ocean floor at 300ft .


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FullMotoJacket said:
THIS is why I can't take Citizen seriously.

OH NO, (boomers know the rest)
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To be fair, Godzilla has a different place in Japanese culture than it does ours, and Citizen is extremely Japanese. I actually like that as a branding thing, partly BECAUSE of the BOC song.

For me, it's the Marvel superhero and Disney princess watches that make me roll my eyes, but if they get a few people into watches, what's the harm?
 
 
Priller said:
To be fair, Godzilla has a different place in Japanese culture than it does ours, and Citizen is extremely Japanese.
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That was exactly what I was thinking. I like sushi, Citizen watches, and I ride a Jap bike, but that's as far as it goes. IMO, they've followed the Swatch example and jumped the shark. Well, OK, they (Japs, not Citizen) make some nice cars too.
 
85K100 said:
That was exactly what I was thinking. I like sushi, Citizen watches, and I ride a Jap bike, but that's as far as it goes. IMO, they've followed the Swatch example and jumped the shark. Well, OK, they (Japs, not Citizen) make some nice cars too.
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I think Citizen lost the plot for 'interesting' (i.e. for watch nerds, not for mass sale) watches quite a while ago, but seem to have reconnected over the past few years and recaptured some flair. Seiko has both dropped in quality and gone way up in price, leaving Citizen to be by far the best value watch brand, I think.

One recent example is the Tsuyosa, which has gotten a lot of attention. Having tried a few on (at the mall, naturally), they punch way, way above their price bracket. The dial, case and integrated jubilee bracelet are all really well done, comparing very well to any of the lower-tier Swatch brands (Hamilton, Mido, Tissot, etc.) at less than half the price, even less than a quarter if you hunt around online. It's definitely not the 'Rolex killer!' that hyperbolic YouTube click-chasers will scream in their thumbnail, but it's a very nice watch at an insanely low price. The only detail that let it down a wee bit is the pressed steel clasp, but those worked for Rolex back in the day, and it's one of those things you don't really notice with day-to-day wear. The new one with the blue textured fumé dial is really pretty (many other colours are available):

1000011463.png

I think it's actually a nicer and more restrained take on the integrated bracelet sports watch than the lauded PRX, for a third of the price. In fact, I'd better stop looking at these or I'm going to end up buying one. Creation Watches has them with free shipping for $300 CAD, for crying out loud...
 
So the Citizen clearance center at the Toronto premium Outlet Mall ( Trafalgar rd ) has the Bulova ‘moon watch chrono) as worn by Dave Scott on Apollo15 , quartz @ $1022.00 after discount , quartz watch.
Same watch is on Amazon for $549.00 . That’s not criminal , but it sure inspires zero confidence.i think it’s nicely styled but has zero value long term .


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Since the plebeian end of the spectrum needs more representation, I picked up one of these: (Casio MRW-200H).

I've pulled the strap off and replaced it with a belt clip, since it's going to live on the arm of my camp chair for trackdays. I bought it specifically for the functional rotating bezel so that I can estimate when they'll announce first call for each track group.
 
crankcall said:
So the Citizen clearance center at the Toronto premium Outlet Mall ( Trafalgar rd ) has the Bulova ‘moon watch chrono) as worn by Dave Scott on Apollo15 , quartz @ $1022.00 after discount , quartz watch.
Same watch is on Amazon for $549.00 . That’s not criminal , but it sure inspires zero confidence.i think it’s nicely styled but has zero value long term .
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The Archive Series is all over the map. The standard one on sailcloth is $580, "Snoopy" is $900, Meteorite $1,500 direct through Bulova.
 
crankcall said:
So the Citizen clearance center at the Toronto premium Outlet Mall ( Trafalgar rd ) has the Bulova ‘moon watch chrono) as worn by Dave Scott on Apollo15 , quartz @ $1022.00 after discount , quartz watch.
Same watch is on Amazon for $549.00 . That’s not criminal , but it sure inspires zero confidence.i think it’s nicely styled but has zero value long term .
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I haven't compared the Bulova prices in that store, as their watches mostly aren't to my taste (except the Devil Diver), but for Citizen automatics, I'd say their pricing is fair but unexceptional. Almost everything can be found cheaper online, especially if bought from Europe or Asia, though shipping and import fees can sometimes make the difference negligible. For most watches, the outlet is basically fixing the mark-down from MSRP that you could probably negotiate at your typical mall jeweller.

For example, the Tsuyosa noted above has an MSRP of $595 CAD per the Citizen website. The Citizen outlet has a typical mark-down of 25%, which works out to $446. That's exactly the offer price I got from the independent jeweller where I tried one on at the Lime Ridge mall before Christmas. Online, they can be had from the grey market for $300-350 CAD, but then you obviously don't get to try it on and see the actual one you're getting.

As for the Bulova Lunar Pilot, as @FullMotoJacket says, the pricing is very weird. The website lists MSRP pricing between $800 and $1200 CAD for standard editions, and from what I can tell, the only difference is the strap. After the 24% off 'Lunar New Year Sale' (I suspect there's always a sale), the pricing is between $600 and $900 CAD. The only ones north of $1000 are Limited Editions, not on sale...
 
At a $500 spread between rubber strap and metal bracelet, I’ll go out on a limb I can get a nice ( if not original) bracelet for less than $500 .
Being honest with each other , the only one here making sense is @Ash with a $34.00 Casio. But that’s not the game …..


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