Shared Driveway, 3 Vehicle Accident - Who's at Fault?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bigevildoer
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Bigevildoer

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Scenario is as follows:
Truck and Trailer, one side of driveway, facing out to street. Trailer end at garage.
Motorcycle, on property line at rear quarter panel of truck, facing out to street.
Neighbour's mini van, on other side of driveway, near his garage.

Neighbour backs out without looking. Hits motorcycle. Motorcycle gets pushed forward and into truck.
Damage to motorcycle makes it a possible write off - adjuster to determine. Damage to truck is gouged paint, 6" crease dent.
Damage to van is discoloured bumper from where it flexed. Neighbour now claiming additional previous damage as being motorcycle's fault.

Van owner claims motorcycle more on his side (maybe completely) of driveway.
Motorcycle owner claims motorcycle on property line.
Brake fluid stains on driveway show large puddle on his side of line. Stains occured after motorcycle was picked up and moved over so owner could assess damage to truck.
Initial brake fluid stains from before bike being moved (and still lying against truck) are on property line.

Accident reporting centre notes the motorcycle as not being illegally parked.

Several trains of thought occur here as to fault:
1) Motorcycle owner completely at fault for being parked on property line.
2) Van owner and motorcycle owner both at fault, majority falling on motorcycle owner (75/25 maybe?)
3) Van owner and motorcycle owner both at fault, majority falling on van owner (75/25 maybe?)
4) Van owner completely at fault.

1 witness to accident. Agrees motorcycle parked on property line.
 
IMO

The person driving 100000%.

Why should it matter where the bike was parked? He hit a stationary object. It's his fault for not looking. Hate to say this but...... what if it was a kid that was standing there, does it really matter what property the kid was on?
 
Location of where the bike was parked doesn't matter. Buddy drove his van into a parked vehicle. He is 100% at fault. It's up to the operator of the vehicle to insure the path is clear. Generally people do this by using their eyes but not always it would seem.
 
What Torren said seems bang on according to determination rules. The only way for the bike owner to be at fault is if he/she was illegally parked.
 
Well here we go... private property. What do you bet it is a saw off at 50/50. Sucks but make a claim to your insurance company. You do have insurance don't you?
 
DoubleJ said:
Well here we go... private property. What do you bet it is a saw off at 50/50. Sucks but make a claim to your insurance company. You do have insurance don't you?
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Insurance had by both parties. Hope it's not a 50/50.
 
The driver is responsible for hitting a stationary object. That's an opinion with no legal status.
 
Ontario Fault Determination Rules;

http://www.ibc.ca/en/car_insurance/documents/brochure/on-fault-determination-rules.pdf

17. (1) If automobile “A” is parked when it is struck by automobile “B”, the driver of automobile “A” is
not at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is 100 per cent at fault for the incident.
(2) If automobile “A” is illegally parked, stopped or standing when it is struck by automobile “B” and if
the incident occurs outside a city, town or village, the driver of automobile “A” is 100 per cent at
fault and the driver of automobile “B” is not at fault for the incident.
O. Reg. 276/90, s. 17.
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Guess the question is, was the bike illegally parked? If the details are disputed they'll likely go 50/50 on this.
 
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mugwug said:
Guess the question is, was the bike illegally parked? If the details are disputed they'll likely go 50/50 on this.
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Collision reporting centre officer replied that the motorcycle was not illegally parked as it is a shared driveway.

Read link posted, here's some more rules which may fall into effect:
4. (1) If more than one rule applies with respect to the insured, the rule that attributes the least degree of fault to the insured shall be deemed to be the only rule that applies in the circumstances.


5. (1) If an incident is not described in any of these rules, the degree of fault of the insured shall be
determined in accordance with the ordinary rules of law

19. The driver of automobile “A” is 100 per cent at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is not at fault for an incident that occurs,
(a) when automobile “A” is backing up;

Using that logic:
1) collision reporting centre said the motorcycle was not illegally parked.
2) insurance laws say claimant should receive least amount of fault (Rule 4)
3) van was backing up

Therefore: van should shoulder 100% fault (Rule 19).
 
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Collision reporting centre was not at scene obviously so the insurance companies will fight it out.... all heresay! 50-50 will be the outcome.
 
mugwug said:
Ontario Fault Determination Rules;

http://www.ibc.ca/en/car_insurance/documents/brochure/on-fault-determination-rules.pdf



Guess the question is, was the bike illegally parked? If the details are disputed they'll likely go 50/50 on this.
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It doesn't matter if the bike was illegally parked or not.

2) If automobile “A” is illegally parked, stopped or standing when it is struck by automobile “B” and if
the incident occurs outside a city, town or village, the driver of automobile “A” is 100 per cent at
fault and the driver of automobile “B” is not at fault for the incident.

If happened in a shared driveway therefore it was clearly in a town or city

And Private property does not matter for insurance purposes. FDR's are the same on public roads or private property. This is not a 50/50 claim. The van is 100% at fault. Period.
 
There is no basis for 50/50. Think about it. If I am fully parked in your driveway it doesn't give you the right to smash into my car just because it's on the way.
 
23 years of insurance claims experience tells me this 100% not at fault.

The other vehicle hit your parked vehicle. They're at fault.

No worries, call your insurance company and all will be good.
 
Platinum Cycle said:
23 years of insurance claims experience tells me this 100% not at fault.

The other vehicle hit your parked vehicle. They're at fault.

No worries, call your insurance company and all will be good.
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Hahaha I've only got 7. But OP - that's a combined 30 years telling you you're good.
 
Platinum and Wasted -- thanks so much for your answers.
Truck insurer called today and was completely flabbergasted that Van driver felt he was 0% at fault.

Now, hopefully the bike will be fixed soon so the rest of the season isn't lost.

Another question for both of you -- at what point does a company tend to write a motorcycle off? A percentage of value? Are buy-backs with a branded title still possible?
 
Bigevildoer said:
Another question for both of you -- at what point does a company tend to write a motorcycle off? A percentage of value? Are buy-backs with a branded title still possible?
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I no expert like the other 2, But as long as there is no frame damage or parts that could be unsafe to repair you should be able to "buy it back" unbranded.

When my bike was backed into last year they offered me $4,900 and write it off or $3,700 cash and repair it myself unbranded.

They used the market value ($4,900) minus what they could get for it from salvaging it ($1,200) and cut me a cheque for $3,700.
 
jeffjones said:
I no expert like the other 2, But as long as there is no frame damage or parts that could be unsafe to repair you should be able to "buy it back" unbranded.

When my bike was backed into last year they offered me $4,900 and write it off or $3,700 cash and repair it myself unbranded.

They used the market value ($4,900) minus what they could get for it from salvaging it ($1,200) and cut me a cheque for $3,700.
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That's bang on. As long as there is no brand than you can buy back a write off. You can buy a branded vehicle but honestly it's not worth all of the hoops to get it back on the road. Look at kijiji and trader to get a ball park value for your bike. The appraiser will be doing the same thing.
 
Wasted said:
That's bang on. As long as there is no brand than you can buy back a write off. You can buy a branded vehicle but honestly it's not worth all of the hoops to get it back on the road. Look at kijiji and trader to get a ball park value for your bike. The appraiser will be doing the same thing.
Click to expand...

Problem with my bike is that it's an odd-ball. Nobody really wants them anymore. Kijiji is showing them between $7-9K, which is ridiculous. On the other other hand, they are models with exceptionally low mileage (under 3000 km etc).

Thanks again for all the help guys!

T.
 
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