Agave, what would be the high and low end of plywood install, and what would the contractor cost be approximately if it was just material and labour? Also is 44 sheets right for the square footage in my post? I rounded it up to 50 for losses and cut offs. Would it be more than that? Cheers.
Roofing cost question
- Thread starter jc100
- Start date
Agave, what would be the high and low end of plywood install, and what would the contractor cost be approximately if it was just material and labour? Also is 44 sheets right for the square footage in my post? I rounded it up to 50 for losses and cut offs. Would it be more than that? Cheers.
Just to be fair to the roofer, all the factors of your particular job need to be factored in here.
As mentioned by someone, the height / pitch of the roof, equipment needed, job location, etc... all needs to be considered.
First of all, what kind of plywood did he use?
Did he just slap down regular plywood? Particle board? What thickness?
Or did he actually buy the correct tongue and groove plywood?
Did they nail it down or use screws?
Find out what wood is up there, and the quantity used first.
Then go to Rona and find the price of it.
Obviously he gets a cheaper contractor price, but we won't even consider that for now.
It takes about 90seconds to install a full sheet, plus delivery to the roof, it isn't rocket science.
Let's say add 20-25$ to each sheet for installation just to be fair.
See what that comes out to and let us know..
Here's a tip for anyone getting a roof done.
Research products / installation techniques yourself before you call anyone.
Pick the correct shingles for your needs!
A crappy 3 tab shingle is like a moped, a nice storm shingle is like a ducati. The cost difference is important.
When you find a roofer that seems honest, be very, very clear as to the products you want used, and how you want it installed.
There's a huge difference in quality between minimum code, and a real professional install.
Here's an example.
Typical roof >
Any rotten plywood gets replaced with a rough patch, nailed down.
3ft of ice and water shield from the edge, tar paper the rest of the way.
Shingles nailed down as per min requirement. (amount depends on shingle type)
That's pretty much what every roofer does. They save a fortune, make a killing.
Because i am a person of integrity, i will sacrifice extra time to make sure any job i do is of the same quality i would expect in my own house. I inform the customer of their choices.
We're talking about a small amount of time and money to ensure perfection, how hard is that.
Agave's roof >
Ensure surface is straight, solid, true and properly screwed down.
Full drip edges all around.
Full ice and water shield, it's only 60$ a roll, tar paper is garbage.
Every shingle carefully nailed as per manufactures instructions. If option is given to use extra # nails for that type of shingle depending on wind conditions, i will do so.
Pitch lines under both edge rows of shingles to ensure wind never lifts it.
Final pitch fill of any potential areas of leakage. (vents, chimneys etc..)
regular plywood by the looks of the scrap. Not sure what thickness but I read that if nailed over existing shake roof then it doesn't have to be that thick. I heard lots of banging so I think it was nailed down. I don't have a problem with the workmanship, everything looks fine. Original contract had the ice and water shield, magnetic clean up of site, they were tidy, chimneys flashed all looks great. It's just this plywood problem...the cost for the plywood installation is nearly the same as for the reshingling job itself and that doesn't strike me as right at all.
Update: the manager called my wife today and spoke to her and said that the cost of plywood installation hasn't been near the $2 per sq ft in Kingston for 15 years and that he would "drop the quote to $3800 or maybe even $3500" and that he's not making any money at that price. This sounds very fishy now to me...first of all I was told that they would only charge me to cover costs anyway, now it drops by $1500 suddenly. I'm going to call Home Depot and Rona to get their costs for plywood covering but if anyone has anything else they can add I'd be grateful. I want to sort this out in a week and the thought of possibly being taken for a ride makes me damn angry.
I'm reluctant to say much more jc100, because my directness might be insulting to you, but i'm gonna do it anyways. :razz:
#1- With all due respect in the world, if you were prepared to spend thousands of dollars, you should have done more research and gotten more estimates and opinions.
#2- Whats under the shake shingles? Why didn't you strip the whole roof down? If theres more asphalt shingles under that, imagine how heavy it is allready. How rotten is it under there? Was it leaking?
#3- Never in a million years would i lay a sub-roof over any shake cedar, or whatever it is you have.
It's a simple fact dude, roofing is easy, they can charge a fortune, and they hire all kinds of flying monkeys.
In your case, it's alot easier and faster to slap a makeshift roof over your old one, this way they dont have to do any hard work, or get a dumpster, or have to worry if any of your under roof is rotten as hell.
They know most people only call a roofer when there's a leak, putting you in a position to make quick decisions.
If you really want to be sure, spend a few bucks and call one of the companies thats Holmes or Baeumler approved, ask them to come inspect it and give you the approx cost.
#1- With all due respect in the world, if you were prepared to spend thousands of dollars, you should have done more research and gotten more estimates and opinions.
#2- Whats under the shake shingles? Why didn't you strip the whole roof down? If theres more asphalt shingles under that, imagine how heavy it is allready. How rotten is it under there? Was it leaking?
#3- Never in a million years would i lay a sub-roof over any shake cedar, or whatever it is you have.
It's a simple fact dude, roofing is easy, they can charge a fortune, and they hire all kinds of flying monkeys.
In your case, it's alot easier and faster to slap a makeshift roof over your old one, this way they dont have to do any hard work, or get a dumpster, or have to worry if any of your under roof is rotten as hell.
They know most people only call a roofer when there's a leak, putting you in a position to make quick decisions.
If you really want to be sure, spend a few bucks and call one of the companies thats Holmes or Baeumler approved, ask them to come inspect it and give you the approx cost.
I'm trying to understand something. So this roof has the rafters, then plywood (or something else of that nature), then either singles (either cedar shake things, or asphalt) and the roofer just put plywood ON TOP of the singles??? Wouldn't the roofer strip the roof down to the original boards, then shingles? I know that some will put up to three layers of shingles (or more for the true 'tards), but this plywood and shakes kind of has me confused.
padu
Well-known member
All I have to say is no one works for free ( At Cost ) Second you can call home depot or who ever you want to find out the price of plywood but you still have to factor in the labour and the insurance and wsib etc etc. Not saying te price is good or not but I hate when customers say go ahead and after the work is done is when people start with all the questions,
padu
Well-known member
the roofer must have stripped the house down to the wood deck, Seen the boards are all full or gaps or uneven, He put down plywood to make sure the surface is smooth. if the surface isnt smooth it will show once the roof is done, Black shingles are bad for this, The he reshingled the house. Im in the industry, Flat roofing, we dont do house at all, scope of work seems right, prices I dont know as we dont price shingles, any guy with a hammer and a pickup turck can be a roofer, for that reason Im out
JC, try talking to Ed. He roofs on weekends to make extra money. I'm also confused about exactly what they did regarding removal and why plywood was needed. On the flat roof, they shouldn't have used shingles anyway, so surely they were aware of the slopes when they priced it and would have accurately measured.
Hey Agave, no harm no foul. I appreciate blunt talk better than double talk so it's all good. In my defense I hired one of the best outfits in town, I know my original roof quote for the reshingling is a little higher than others but I'm OK with that. After the work started I was presented with this plywood covering issue and had to make a quick decision. I absolutely didn't realise it would be an issue before the phonecall. The work had already started and was continuing, a quarter of the roof had already been stripped, and my only other option was to call off the roofers. I felt like I was put over a barrel and I suspect the company knew this. In their phone call to me they assured me that the quote would be at cost, just to cover material and labour for that part of the roof as I was a repeat customer from a previous big job. So this thread is just about finding out if what they are now charging me is indeed at cost, or a lot more. From what I see, it's a lot more.
I take agreements seriously whether they are verbal or written, and I agreed to work being performed at cost. I expect the company to take me at my word for this part of the contract and I expect the company to do the same.
If I had the time beforehand I would definitely have done a lot more research but I didn't which is why I went for one of the top outfits in Kingston that I had used before. I did this so I wouldn't have to deal with this arguing back and forth but it seems I still am.
I take agreements seriously whether they are verbal or written, and I agreed to work being performed at cost. I expect the company to take me at my word for this part of the contract and I expect the company to do the same.
If I had the time beforehand I would definitely have done a lot more research but I didn't which is why I went for one of the top outfits in Kingston that I had used before. I did this so I wouldn't have to deal with this arguing back and forth but it seems I still am.
Cheers Lyndsay. Off to see him now.
gwelfmike
Well-known member
Dumb question, but the contrator go up on the roof to find out how many layers of shingles where up there before he gave you a quote?
I know you can estimate the amout of material you need from the ground , but when ever I gave a quote for a roof I would always at least put a ladder up to see what will be needed to be removed and give two quotes, one if no new underlayment is needed and one if underlayment is required. If you had wooden shakes on the roof, the roof has not been striped for quite a long time.
It may seem like a high cost per hour to get this done, but remember when it rains, snows, high winds, these guys are not working.
I know you can estimate the amout of material you need from the ground , but when ever I gave a quote for a roof I would always at least put a ladder up to see what will be needed to be removed and give two quotes, one if no new underlayment is needed and one if underlayment is required. If you had wooden shakes on the roof, the roof has not been striped for quite a long time.
It may seem like a high cost per hour to get this done, but remember when it rains, snows, high winds, these guys are not working.
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Ok, the picture is a little more clear now.
In your original post, you said they simply slapped a layer of wood over existing shake shingles. so which is it?
If you say the roof was stripped, the price sounds slightly better now.
100$ a sheet is still overpriced though.
gwelfmike, are you suggesting roofers make extra money in the summer and don't work in the winter?
None of the ones that i know of.
The workers don't reap the profits, the owner does, and when it snows, he fires up his plow and makes even more money.
In your original post, you said they simply slapped a layer of wood over existing shake shingles. so which is it?
If you say the roof was stripped, the price sounds slightly better now.
100$ a sheet is still overpriced though.
gwelfmike, are you suggesting roofers make extra money in the summer and don't work in the winter?
None of the ones that i know of.
The workers don't reap the profits, the owner does, and when it snows, he fires up his plow and makes even more money.
rbjeepthing
Well-known member
Something just doesn't seem right as pointed out. Currently I am nearing the end of a massive renovation of an 80 year old cottage. We added 600 sq feet at the back of the house which obviously required roofing. Since the old roof was questionable and 10 years old we replaced the entire thing including completely stripping the existing roof to framing and replacing sheathing with new OSB 3/4". Overkill and above code for our application. Shingles were IKO Cambridge AR's installed using high wind requirements do to my proximity to the lake. From what I have researched these are on the premium side of residential shingles. Total cost of the job? Just under $4000 with taxes if I remember correctly but I will check when I get home. Here is a pic for reference as it's not really a complicated roof structure one peak and one valley.
so what is the going cost of a roof / sq foot ? I'm just curious now if my parents got ripped off or not last fall ...
facts :
- they paid a guy roughly 13-14k for the roof to get done
- they were at the house for 3 or 4 days if I remember right
- the roof is NOT easy, there's angles everywhere on the roof
- they only did shingles and that rubber material on the edges ~ no plywood done here
- the roof is approx 5000-5500 sq ft
opinions ?
facts :
- they paid a guy roughly 13-14k for the roof to get done
- they were at the house for 3 or 4 days if I remember right
- the roof is NOT easy, there's angles everywhere on the roof
- they only did shingles and that rubber material on the edges ~ no plywood done here
- the roof is approx 5000-5500 sq ft
opinions ?
slope? height? what type of shingle used? (regular vs premium), access to the roof? metal required? (valleys, step flashings, etc) venting? plumbing flashings?
Lots of factors. Yeah a lot of people say it's easy (and it is, when you know what you're doing) but there's more to it than just hammering in a nail.
They didn't put anything over exisiting shingles. When they removed what was up there they saw slats (I thought they were called shakes) which they said would invalidate the warranty on the shingles if they nailed them ino just slats. Hence adding the plywood. Sorry if my terminology wasn't correct.
The original quote was for tear off of shingles, ice/water barrier, tar paper elsewhere, new chimney flashing, dumpster and waste removal and addition of 25yr warranty 3 tab shingles. Just the addition of the plywood is the extra and they installed that straight onto the slats.
The original quote was for tear off of shingles, ice/water barrier, tar paper elsewhere, new chimney flashing, dumpster and waste removal and addition of 25yr warranty 3 tab shingles. Just the addition of the plywood is the extra and they installed that straight onto the slats.
My original quote for tear off and reshingling with flashing, barrier and tar paper for 1382 sq feet was $5600 (this is in Kingston which may well be slightly higher than the GTA). Low to medium pitch roof (side split house).
$100 a sheet is very expensive even in Kingston. Unless it was 3/4" good both sides birch plywood..lol.
Ice and water shield first 3' and valleys then they use a synthetic underlayment instead of tar paper.
3 tab shingles are the lowest quality now....everyone is using the architectural shingles IKO Cambridge or Owens corning trudefinitions shingles
Ice and water shield first 3' and valleys then they use a synthetic underlayment instead of tar paper.
3 tab shingles are the lowest quality now....everyone is using the architectural shingles IKO Cambridge or Owens corning trudefinitions shingles
gwelfmike
Well-known member
Hi,
I would question him why he did not climb on the roof to see what was under there. Why he did not give you two one with one without new underlay.
Also, roofing is not an easy job contrary to what anyone tells you. Even if you own the business. Some people are ex roofers for a reason.
I would question him why he did not climb on the roof to see what was under there. Why he did not give you two one with one without new underlay.
Also, roofing is not an easy job contrary to what anyone tells you. Even if you own the business. Some people are ex roofers for a reason.
