Reliability

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My 2010 WRX STi has been extremely reliable.

Same deal with my wife's 2005 Mazda 6. Only problem of note it's had is a sticky "Bendix" in the starter due to clutch dust build-up.

My former car, a 2002 VW GTI, was also super reliable. The 1994 Probe GT that preceded it was okay too; never left me stranded.

I think most modern cars are fundamentally well designed and built but they still need regular maintenance and, given where we are, they need proper rustproofing. My Subie and the wife's Mazda have been Rustchecked since new and their bodies are mint, something that can't always be said about Mazdas from the oughts...
 
Brian P said:
The second generation GM U vans were notorious for taillight problems. Back when those were still on the road, it wasn't uncommon to see one with the backup lights come on with the brake lights at half brightness, etc ... Rust was killer on those, too. (Rocker panels!) Those were definitely "old GM" vehicles. Much has changed.

Bear in mind that if you go back that far, plenty of otherwise well regarded Japanese brand vehicles have had their share of rust issues, as well. When is the last time you have seen any of the first three generations of Honda Civic on the road? Or any Toyota before the late 1990s? I had a 1984 Toyota pickup for a long time. It was a good vehicle mechanically, but the box was biodegradable, and it's been nearly 20 years since mine biodegraded!
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The problem is that this wasn't the first time that GM messed up and didn't come forward and/or fix the issue.

Father in law had an Astro van. Remember the suicide passing gear on that thing? You'd floor the accelerator, and then you could count to two or three before it would kick in. I think it was an anti stall feature.

Why buy yourself into that kind of attitude?


If 2,800+ people are dying per year due to car accidents . . . How long should you wait until you know they've cleaned up their act?

Honda Civics went through a bit of the same thing, although it wasn't as safety related. My brother sold a 25 year old civic that was still running years ago.
He was a sales rep. so it had a lot of k's on it. The later ones didn't last nearly as long.
 
Had a 10 year old Pontiac Montana minivan. Loved the capacity, didn't care it was a minivan.....but it died with 150k km only. Got more $ selling the seats and parts than the trade in.
 
Baggsy said:
Father in law had an Astro van. Remember the suicide passing gear on that thing? You'd floor the accelerator, and then you could count to two or three before it would kick in. I think it was an anti stall feature.
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that was the deepest, darkest wilderness era of GM quality
4.3 L V6 with a 3 speed automatic
no power
no economy
no reliability
perfect failure
 
nobbie48 said:
If someone asked me to describe the most reliable two wheel motorized vehicle my description would be...
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From what I hear, it would be an Oset electric bike.
 
JavaFan said:
that was the deepest, darkest wilderness era of GM quality
4.3 L V6 with a 3 speed automatic
no power
no economy
no reliability
perfect failure
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Really?
I'm working on my fifth or sixth Astro/Safari van. This one is at about 350,xxx km. The last one lasted 550,000 km. Pulled a super stock race car all over Canada with that one.
AFIK they never had a 3 speed trans. Didn't they start with a 700 (3 speed with overdrive and lockup) and ended with a 4L60E ? (There was a 4 on the floor manual and a 4 cylinder offered in other markets).

Deepest darkest GM would be late 70s, early 80s. After the gas embargo, everybody PANICKED.

I have a '84 Cutlass as a daily driver, just recently went over 100,000KM.
Built in Quebec, 305 cid, T350c trans, 10 bolt diff. sounds pretty normal.

The heads are actually really cool... sort of. They have a 66cc chamber with GREAT swirl... mated with tiny valves and no compression (about 7 1/2 to 1, 35 years ago) Oh well.
Came stock with a 660 cfm Quadrajet.
Every wiring diagram I have ever seen says there is a 02 sensor on the car... I can't find it, but there is a catalytic converter (I have never seen a motor with a cat that didn't have a o2 sensor) and there IS a throttle position sensor on the carb... that feeds a ECU... on a motor with a carb and a distributor with vacuum and centrifugal advance.
T350c was the first GM trans to have a torque converter lockup. (In '85 the G body got a T200. 3 speed with overdrive and lockup).
The 10 bolt final ratio is something like 2.25/1.

If you're not into "car" that was a whole bunch of good ideas that didn't really pan out... all rolled into one car.
The car is reliable as a hammer.
It's kinda weird to drive till you get used to it (it LOVES the highway. With that rear gear it's idling a 100kmh).
The gas mileage kinda blows but it's a BIG ol car (if you don't keep on top of that big carb it can get a lot worse).
I have a fleet of bikes, the newest is a '93 900SS, which did 1.41 laps at Mosport and hours in the wailing rain this year. The bike gets ridden, it is no trailer queen.
The bike I ride the most lately is a '88 Honda RC31. I put gas in it, I change the oil regularly and I ride it.
No drama, push the start button and ride.
The oldest I have is a '56 Norton. The thing is much more maintenance intensive than any more "modern" bike, but it's pretty reliable.
I want a weeks notice to start the thing, but I know it will start and run(even with a dead battery), and go ... and keep going(even with a dead battery)(It has a magneto).

Reliability is easy.
Emissions and mileage are the problems.
 
I put it back on the road in May 2015 with 52000km on it, 16000 a year for the last three years.

I am second owner. First owner was a very nice little old lady that drove it 7 km to work, on nice days for 25 years.
I have been maintaining it since '98. it was 100% original when I got it.

I have put a couple of million kms on Astro/Safari vans... which you said was "the deepest, darkest wilderness era of GM quality"
... but then I have also put more than 900,000 km on '86 K car (3 motor rebuilds, the body/frame was the worst part. I was forever welding and patching that thing. It was my wife's favorite car. The kid cried when I scrapped it).
I have put millions of km on late 70s to early 90s Chev Caprices and Dodge Diplomats.
You see, I used to own a small fleet of taxi cabs.

So I know that having a reliable car that averages 3000 km per year over 35 years is notable.
Keeping a car reliable that gets miles piled on it is easy, it get maintained or it dies.
It is, in a lot of ways, harder on a car to let it sit.


...we were talking about the reliability of what you guys consider an old vehicle, weren't we?
You guys were saying they were awful and I was disagreeing, strongly, citing actual experience.
Wasn't that the conversation?
 
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JavaFan said:
that was the deepest, darkest wilderness era of GM quality
4.3 L V6 with a 3 speed automatic
no power
no economy
no reliability
perfect failure
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I had a 97 and an 04 and I didn't over maintain either one. They had numerous problems but more annoying than fatal. GM would redesign things that didn't need redesigning and redesign things that weren't a problem. They were more suited to the commercial van thing than the family soccer scoot. Weight and capacity plus tow.

QC sucked in that both had regular trips to the dealer at the beginning to resolve things that should never have left the factory.
 
sburns said:
Toyota or Honda.
Last car was an Accord and I am driving a Toyota Camry currently. You might have to pay a little more up front but you recover this with the extra time not being, or going in for service. The Camry all I have spent on this car is oil and gas. Runs great no hiccups. They make life simple and you can spend time on real priorities, like motorcycling.

I have had GM and VW, never again. Maybe they might have improved. VW are or were over engineered junk. Ford or Chrysler no experience. Ford must have done something right though as they didn't need bail out money. Chrysler, I dunno every mini van on the street seems to run with a rubber ban screech. Anyhow at some point you might have to go to a dealer and those experiences will matter as well.
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Listen to this man, esp the first line.


Honda (and soon Toyota) introduced the world to the innovation of Hybrids way back in 1999 long before the other automakers even had a clue. fuel economy and environmental concerns certainly wasn't on their minds at the time. just unreliable polluting beasts.

The same thing will happen again with Hydrogen cars.
 
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bitzz said:
I put it back on the road in May 2015 with 52000km on it, 16000 a year for the last three years. I am second owner. First owner was a very nice little old lady that drove it 7 km to work, on nice days for 25 years. I have been maintaining it since '98. it was 100% original when I got it. I have put a couple of million kms on Astro/Safari vans... which you said was "the deepest, darkest wilderness era of GM quality" ... but then I have also put more than 900,000 km on '86 K car (3 motor rebuilds, the body/frame was the worst part. I was forever welding and patching that thing. It was my wife's favorite car. The kid cried when I scrapped it). I have put millions of km on late 70s to early 90s Chev Caprices and Dodge Diplomats. You see, I used to own a small fleet of taxi cabs. So I know that having a reliable car that averages 3000 km per year over 35 years is notable. Keeping a car reliable that gets miles piled on it is easy, it get maintained or it dies. It is, in a lot of ways, harder on a car to let it sit. ...we were talking about the reliability of what you guys consider an old vehicle, weren't we? You guys were saying they were awful and I was disagreeing, strongly, citing actual experience. Wasn't that the conversation?
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The difference there is that you have 10+ years of history on the cars. Brand new vs ten year old is an apples and oranges thing. I've had older cars too. My first vehicle was a '73 Plymouth Volare, of which I was the fourth owner. It was adequate for us, as long as we avoided large puddles.
 
bitzz said:
...we were talking about the reliability of what you guys consider an old vehicle, weren't we?
You guys were saying they were awful and I was disagreeing, strongly, citing actual experience.
Wasn't that the conversation?
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What facts have you given to back up your claim of reliability? Other then owning a 84 Cultlas and trailing around the country, and a fleet of bikes? Providing anecdotes and high mileage number doesn't cut it.

So only oil changes for those 500K then?
 
I’ll take just about any modern make for a reliable vehicle over a low mileage old vehicle.

If that is the criteria.

If nostalgia is the criteria, I’ll take the old vehicle. But it will need more maintenance to keep it going. It will deteriorate from rust over a winter or two despite whatever methods to prevent it from happening.

A fair weather vehicle? The oldie but goodie is the deal.

For reliable transportation, new anything is the way to go.


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I've had 2 Toyotas - a 2005 Matrix (5 Speed) and 2010 Corolla (auto). They both reached 170k+ but both died prematurely due to transmission failure and my mechanic said they should have lasted. So I'm through with Toyota. And no, it's not my driving!
I currently ride an '09 Dyna Super Glide Custom with over 50k on the clock. It has been the most trouble-free bike of the more than 20 (mostly metric) that I've owned. Gas, oil, tires; ride.
 
Everyone has experience with their own brands....but when push comes to shove....look at the brands with the highest resale. If no one wants to touch your car with 200k it will be worth nothing. Yes there are Corolla/Civic owners with bad experiences, but they are outweighed by the average which says they are above average in terms of reliability.

And expectations play a huge role. I had a guest trade in a Caravan with 200k that said "It was the best vehicle I've ever owned...I've only had to replace the tranny twice" Meanwhile Kruzuki is done with his Toyotas because of two failed trannys..(which I would be ****** about as well).

While new vehicles are much better...Japanese/Korean brands on the average are better than the domestics. Exeptions are obviously out there.
 
kruzuki said:
I've had 2 Toyotas - a 2005 Matrix (5 Speed) and 2010 Corolla (auto). They both reached 170k+ but both died prematurely due to transmission failure and my mechanic said they should have lasted. So I'm through with Toyota. And no, it's not my driving!
I currently ride an '09 Dyna Super Glide Custom with over 50k on the clock. It has been the most trouble-free bike of the more than 20 (mostly metric) that I've owned. Gas, oil, tires; ride.
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Get a manual. Stronger, more fun, better.
 
Our 2004 Accord at 235k had every part replaced except for engine and trans internals and body. Pretty much anything that bolted or glued (including all door seals) to the car broke or failed. Car engine and trans were excellent but it was a money pit. The maintenance records from new were bible sized.

My 01 Pontiac Sunfire GT did 267k with only brakes and a timing chain.

My 08 Mazda CX7 (that I still drive) is at 236k and it's only had brakes and two rear swaybar links. I replaced the oem battery last winter just as a precautionary. Rust checked yearly and is spotless.

I've had roughly 20 bikes starting in 1976. None stand out as unreliable.

I had a ccm mountainbike that had a garbage gearset so I guess that's the most unreliable wheels I've had.
 
Funny I should post about how reliable my Subie is when today it developed a misfire I've traced (99.99% sure...) to a bad ignition coil. :)
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