Red Light Camera Ticket - Not in Photo | Page 3 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Red Light Camera Ticket - Not in Photo

If you roll a right-on-red WITHOUT noticing the big grey boxes and sign that says RED LIGHT CAMERA (with a red light and a camera icon) then you deserve the ticket...
 
You say the time stamp is the same (I can't read on blurry pic)? Do they only stamp these to the whole second, or partial seconds?
 
Rob MacLennan said:
The burden of proof is, however, somewhat flipped in such cases.
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I was waiting for you to weigh in on this matter. But, that's it? I was expecting more...

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Joe Bass said:
I was waiting for you to weigh in on this matter. But, that's it? I was expecting more...
Click to expand...

There's not much else to say on the matter. With an absolute liability offence all that needs to be proven is that the act took place. You can't even use a defence of necessity.
 
griff2 said:
They time-stamp to the minute, no further.
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Some of the numbers on edge of the photo will be the time from the start of red to the photo, in tenths of a second - the difference will be the time between photos, in tenths of a second... The red light camera evidence regulation gives the digits order/meaning for each of the two camera systems.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
There's not much else to say on the matter. With an absolute liability offence all that needs to be proven is that the act took place. You can't even use a defence of necessity.
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I apologize for my ignorance, but I'm a little lost here. 'Absolute liability offence'?

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FLSTC said:
Some of the numbers on edge of the photo will be the time from the start of red to the photo, in tenths of a second - the difference will be the time between photos, in tenths of a second... The red light camera evidence regulation gives the digits order/meaning for each of the two camera systems.
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Yes, the time from red to photo is shown in 10ths of a second, but the timestamp (actual time at which each photo is taken) is shown only to the minute as per regulation S3.1 (1) http://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/990277
 
Joe Bass said:
I apologize for my ignorance, but I'm a little lost here. 'Absolute liability offence'?
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An absolute liability offence is one for which simply performing the act is enough for conviction. There is no defence of necessity or due diligence possible. Speeding is one of those. By the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, based upon case law, such a charge cannot carry the possibility of jail time. That's the basis upon which the 50+ Kmh over portion of HTA 172 was successfully fought.

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/2010/03/18/court_of_appeal_overturns_stunt_driving_ruling.html

It's similar to a Strict Liability offence for which the act itself is enough for conviction, but a defence of due diligence is possible. As you can see from the article I linked the 50+ Kmh portion of HTA 172 was declared to not be an Absolute Liability offence but a Strict Liability offence, allowing a defence of due diligence.
 
Thanks @RobMacLennan

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REeSIvDEiNTl said:
valid, but you are assuming the car made a right turn. Could have reversed. The 38 km/h also doesnt make any sense since the 2nd photo shows no car yet the speed still says 38 km/h.

the red loght camera must take 1 photo of the vehicle entering an intersection at a certain speed which triggers the camera, then follow up with 1 or more photos of the car proceeding through the intersection (which id it not). They are assuming my car proceed through the intersection based on a still photo.

http://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/990277

i dont know if that is valid but it is what i found through a quick google search.
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The second photo shows 38 km/h because the regulations require all photos taken by a TraffiStar system to show the speed at which the vehicle entered the intersection, and that would be the speed in the first photo.

http://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/990277

3. (1) A photograph taken by a red light camera system may show or have superimposed on it any of the following information:
1. The date when it was taken.
2. The municipality where it was taken.
3. The time of day when it was taken.
4. The length of time that the indication was showing red before the photograph was taken.
5. The length of time that the indication was showing amber before the photograph was taken.
6. The speed at which the vehicle shown in the photograph was travelling when the first photograph in a series of photographs was taken. O. Reg. 345/04, s. 1 (1).
 
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