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Pedestrian flashing red countdown = don't cross?
- Thread starter FiReSTaRT
- Start date
So what happens if a motor vehicle is making a right turn on green and a pedestrian begins to cross during countdown?
FLSTC
Well-known member
Yielding to pedestrians
(7) When under this section a driver is permitted to proceed, the driver shall yield the right of way to pedestrians lawfully within a crosswalk. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (7).
Pedestrian crossing
(22) Where portions of a roadway are marked for pedestrian use, no pedestrian shall cross the roadway except within a portion so marked. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (22).
Pedestrian – green light
(23) Subject to subsections (24) and (27), a pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal showing a circular green indication or a straight-ahead green arrow indication and facing the indication may cross the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (23).
Pedestrian – stopping at flashing green light
(24) No pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal and facing a flashing circular green indication or a solid or a flashing left turn arrow indication in conjunction with a circular green indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (24).
Pedestrian – stopping at red or amber light
(25) No pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal and facing a red or amber indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (25).
Pedestrian control signals – walk
(26) Where pedestrian control signals are installed and show a “walk” indication, every pedestrian facing the indication may cross the roadway in the direction of the indication despite subsections (24) and (25). R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (26).
Pedestrian control signals – don’t walk
(27) No pedestrian approaching pedestrian control signals and facing a solid or flashing “don’t walk” indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (27).
Pedestrian right of way
(28) Every pedestrian who lawfully enters a roadway in order to cross may continue the crossing as quickly as reasonably possible despite a change in the indication he or she is facing and, for purposes of the crossing, has the right of way over vehicles. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (28).
(7) When under this section a driver is permitted to proceed, the driver shall yield the right of way to pedestrians lawfully within a crosswalk. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (7).
Pedestrian crossing
(22) Where portions of a roadway are marked for pedestrian use, no pedestrian shall cross the roadway except within a portion so marked. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (22).
Pedestrian – green light
(23) Subject to subsections (24) and (27), a pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal showing a circular green indication or a straight-ahead green arrow indication and facing the indication may cross the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (23).
Pedestrian – stopping at flashing green light
(24) No pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal and facing a flashing circular green indication or a solid or a flashing left turn arrow indication in conjunction with a circular green indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (24).
Pedestrian – stopping at red or amber light
(25) No pedestrian approaching a traffic control signal and facing a red or amber indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (25).
Pedestrian control signals – walk
(26) Where pedestrian control signals are installed and show a “walk” indication, every pedestrian facing the indication may cross the roadway in the direction of the indication despite subsections (24) and (25). R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (26).
Pedestrian control signals – don’t walk
(27) No pedestrian approaching pedestrian control signals and facing a solid or flashing “don’t walk” indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (27).
Pedestrian right of way
(28) Every pedestrian who lawfully enters a roadway in order to cross may continue the crossing as quickly as reasonably possible despite a change in the indication he or she is facing and, for purposes of the crossing, has the right of way over vehicles. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (28).
FLSTC
Well-known member
Then the MV has the right of way.
Thanks! That's what I basically assumed but with so many pedestrians getting up in arms when I'd give'em some Stebel Nautilus (or Chinese knockoff thereof) lovin', I wanted to be 100% sure I was legally in the clear
zeta_immersion
Well-known member
damn straight son! ... i threw my keys on the ground and stomped on them for them cagers to know i mean business. no1 f@s around when i jwalk.
on a side note i do hate entitles pedestrians, cyclists and motorists but at some point in time we all did it so i try to keep that in mind.
also, did you know that our current legislation prohibits a MV to make a left/right turn if the last pedestrian did not set foot on the sidewalk?
Your last statement is incorrect. Many people believe the recent legislative changes apply to "crosswalks" at intersections, it doesn't it applies to TRUE pedestrian crosswalks, (the ones generally mid block with the yellow flashing lights and the Ped X signs). due to the number of people confused by the new rules Toronto Police ran an "education program" on it a couple of months ago, but it was only in media for one day so many missed the message.
slowbird
Well-known member
I've lived in Toronto the past 7-8months and this **** really bothers me. They'll start crossing with like 5 seconds left and there is a whole line up of cars waiting to make a left and can't because of them.
There is also the numpties that are busy chatting or on their phone at the corner by the curb. You stop to see if they're gonna cross (cause they have the WALK signal)...they don't. So you start to make your turn and then they step off the curb in your way!
There is also the numpties that are busy chatting or on their phone at the corner by the curb. You stop to see if they're gonna cross (cause they have the WALK signal)...they don't. So you start to make your turn and then they step off the curb in your way!
statsman
Well-known member
Pedestrians always have the right of way. Even if they are crossing mid block or on a red.
A motor vehicle must always yield to a pedestrian.
Now, the law quoted may say something different, but the driver will almost always be charged with something if they hit a pedestrian regardless of what they were doing.
A motor vehicle must always yield to a pedestrian.
Now, the law quoted may say something different, but the driver will almost always be charged with something if they hit a pedestrian regardless of what they were doing.
slowbird
Well-known member
It falls back to priority rule number one: Don't hit anything!
Always a fun left turn on a red here: https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.6503...4eceNEtCYnOHDP4aEA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
Always a fun left turn on a red here: https://www.google.ca/maps/@43.6503...4eceNEtCYnOHDP4aEA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
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You're having too much fun with the horn. You got a hammer everything feels like a nailThanks! That's what I basically assumed but with so many pedestrians getting up in arms when I'd give'em some Stebel Nautilus (or Chinese knockoff thereof) lovin', I wanted to be 100% sure I was legally in the clear
Yeah, they are getting as bad as cyclists. They don't even want to use those wide, beautiful, unobstructed sidewalks that we have in Toronto. I moved here decades ago from a European city where the sidewalks are less than half the width and are used for parking. No, those ****tards walk or roll their fatwagons down the road like they own it. I even had some uhmm,.. "lady" of the Wal Mart shopping kind (pretty stereotypical WM shopper) punch my hood for giving her a very short blip of the horn because she and her friend were obstructing the roadway and I couldn't get by them safely.
zeta_immersion
Well-known member
think is is only managed crosswalks (with a traffic/pedestrian light). the rule does not apply to unmanaged (stop signs and such)
slowbird
Well-known member
That's a Taxi though. They're all wreckless, non-signaling, awfully ****** drivers anyways.
there's a standard of reason. There is a significant difference, in both law and common sense (thankfully they coincide) between:
"The driver is always at fault", and "The driver must take reasonable steps to avoid a collision". If a ped runs into the street or crosses unlawfully and a driver, acting reasonably, tries and fails to avoid them they are not likely (for those of you that start offering scenarios) to be at fault.
Just because you're "in the right" or have the right of way doesn't mean you can mow someone down - whether it's a vehicle, motor vehicle or pedestrian. But if that other person entered the roadway or executed some other action that did not afford you reasonable opportunity to avoid the collision, they're at fault.
I've also ended up sitting on two car trunks, who decided not to wait for me to cross the sidewalk in front of them, and then backed up while I was passing behind them.
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