PCV vs. Bazzaz ???

M

Mina

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Trying to decide on which tuner to go with for my track bike.
A lot of people say that Bazzaz is the **** but I can't justify spending 1000$+ all in one shot.
I know I can buy the Z-Fi TC + Dyno time and later add the Z-AFM if I wanted to.
With PC I can add things slowly as I improve. (i.e. Quickshifter, AutoTune, etc.)

I'm not racing so I don't need state of the art technology, but I always prefer quality.
The only other difference between the two is that Bazzaz has the Traction Control option when PC doesn't.
Is it really necessary?

I guess money wise, at the end of it all, Bazzaz is slightly more expensive.
I just wanted to get some opinions on which you guys prefer and why?
 
What exhaust do you have on your bike?

It's a GSXR, correct? If so you can get the stock ECU reflashed to work pretty well with an supermarket exhaust. Then you don't need any type of fuel management hardware at all.
 
They both work well in their own way (PCV auto tune makes live changes while riding according to how your AFR table is set up; Bazazz will store data and allow you to accept/reject recommended changes based on your AFR table).

They advantage Bazazz has is the traction control (that many people will swear by).

As Caboose said, you can get your stock ecu reflashed (Suzuki Yosh Box, I think it's called) - I know Rider's Choice did this in the past. Anything else is a REALLY nice to have vs need to have. If you go this route, you can get a stand alone quick shifter.

This stuff is only necessary if you have the hardware that needs it, like a full aftermarket/race exhaust OR you want to squeeze every bit of horsepower out of what you have on the bike already. Since you're not racing, I would say go with Caboose's recommendation (if you need a tune for aftermarket parts).

Use the $1,000 for seat time. To me, it doesn't sound like you need any of this yet. If you really want a quickshifter now, get a stand-alone.
 
Last edited:
The bike is a 2005 CBR600RR, full Yoshimura exhaust (on the way), stock air filter.
 
Not a Honda..... so you'll have to decide paying what you want to have in the future vs what you want to pay for now.

AT is a "nice to have" because it accommodates for elevation changes/air density based on where you're riding. But if you have a solid enough tune I would say you don't need it at this point if you're riding locally. Try downloading one of the base maps (you might experience some lean/rich results) and if needed, go with a custom tune at a shop. Your AT can run off that if you decide to get one in the future.
 
I've seen more jammed up and sputtery bazzaz units than pc5s but Donald says warranty coverage is very good for bazzaz. I like my pc5/autotune, no issues whatsoever
 
TLDeano said:
I've seen more jammed up and sputtery bazzaz units than pc5s but Donald says warranty coverage is very good for bazzaz. I like my pc5/autotune, no issues whatsoever
Click to expand...
I've heard of a similar issue as well.
I currently have a PCV and AutoTune on my 750, I was just curious if the difference in $$ was worth it.
I guess I'll be using the same set up on my track bike.
Thank you guys for your input, much appreciated as always.
 
Last edited:
The way I look at things is to do it once because it will cost you more in the end if you dont. You mentioned that you could get the PCV then slowly add to it later on but that will end up costing you more even though it doesnt hit the bank all at once. I have had both PCV with Autotune and Bazzaz ZFi-TC and I would go with the Bazzaz ZFI-TC, its an awesome unit.
 
TLDeano said:
I've seen more jammed up and sputtery bazzaz units than pc5s but Donald says warranty coverage is very good for bazzaz. I like my pc5/autotune, no issues whatsoever
Click to expand...


I have actually heard the oppoisite and a lot of tuners prefer the Bazzaz over PC but this is in comparison for the Track.
 
Mina said:
I've heard of a similar issue as well.
Click to expand...
It's the same for power commander too. It's usually from people using T-taps to tap into the factory wires. Solder is your friend.

They can do 2007-2011 CBR 600's and 2008-2011 CBR 1000's now.

-Jamie M.
 
$1000 with dynojet gets you: fuel tuning, ignition tuning, and quick shifter.
$900 with Bazzazz gets you: fuel tuning, ignition tuning, quick shifter, and traction control.
A no brainer as far as I am concerned. The quick shifter and traction control are the only things I would even bother spending money on. A 10 hp gain isn't worth much to me......The bike is already very fast, but the quick shifter and traction control help me with the part of my setup that needs the most work- I am the weak link in my setup.
 
So...
If I pick up the Bazzaz Z fi Tc and Z-AFM, who can set up a map/tune for me??

Edit: I was watching some youtube videos on how to play with the Bazzaz Z-AFM, is this how I tune the bike and set up a base map from the get go?
Or do I download the slip-on map and build up from that?
The bike has a full exhaust, would it matter if I download the slip-on map and built on that or is that irrelevant?

[video=youtube;y7d6FQ8hiDM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7d6FQ8hiDM&feature=related[/video]
 
Last edited:
TLDeano said:
I've seen more jammed up and sputtery bazzaz units than pc5s but Donald says warranty coverage is very good for bazzaz. I like my pc5/autotune, no issues whatsoever
Click to expand...

i've seen two bikes - this year - that haven't worked after a pile of attempts with the bazzaz auto-tune

i've told them both to go to the dyno but they're both too p1ssed to go
 
My auto tune worked fine all weekend, it's easy. Just follow the directions for the software and you'll be fine. My bike already has a Dyno tune and this just helps fine tune everything. There's also a forum on the bazzaz site and they'll walk you through any problems, great customer service. The TC is excellent on the track too.
 
You need a decent amount of ride time if you want to auto-tune it yourself... go for a trackday, and don't expect it to run 100% smooth for the first few sessions. The unit will need to acquire enough data to make a reasonable calculation on what trims you need to accept.

Remember: Bazazz requires you to pull in, view the trim changes and apply it before you notice anything... it does not make live tuning. PCV does both: makes live changes based on the AFR and you can apply the trims if you like what you see/feel so the AT doesn't have to work as much to obtain those changes.
 
That's great, but what does it do for partial throttle at low rpms? That's where my friends have had trouble. One took the unit right off his bike and it runs much better for it (but lean, so the pipe is still causing him issues), the other is so frustrated that he's talking about selling the whole bike.

I think some dyno time and a guy with clue might help, but that costs money.
 
Shaman said:
I think some dyno time and a guy with clue might help, but that costs money.
Click to expand...

I highly recommend getting a custom dyno tune and letting the auto tune make those temp/live changes as you ride. That's what I use the PCV for.... get a SOLID base and run the AT off that.

It can be done yourself but you'll need a lot of ride time and reasonable experience and understanding in doing it. Sounds like your friends tried to DYI?
 
Shaman said:
That's great, but what does it do for partial throttle at low rpms? That's where my friends have had trouble.
Click to expand...
Same with the few I've installed too. At low RPM and/or part throttle I assume it doesn't get a steady enough exhaust flow (or it's getting reversion, etc.) Checked that the AIS/Smog/Pair system was disabled (oh boy does that ever mess with AutoTune!) and everything was sealed up tighter than a Nun on Sunday, no exhaust leaks.

I ended up only enabling AutoTune for the 20% throttle column and over. Worked totally flawless after that, other than it's not saving you any fuel cruising down the highway :(

And Azim, even if you get your bike dynotuned, the autotune will totally mess the dyno tuned map up in very short order (at low rpm/low throttle that we're talking about). The only usefulness of a dyno tune is for the areas where you will NOT be autotuning (which is usually nowhere, but sometimes it's the part throttle/cruise range).

I spent hours on the phone with dynojet, and Dusty even connected in remotely to my laptop while it was connected to the bike. His only guess was that the autotune is slightly laggy at low RPM/low throttle. He enabled the tracer so we could watch live, see what autotune was doing. It was skipping cells and adding fuel to the cells that don't need it (i.e. at 2500rpm it's super lean, but as the rev's are climbing and by the time the autotune figures that out *omg I'm lean* the RPM's have climbed to 2750RPM so it adds fuel to that cell instead of 2500 where it needs it!). It does this over and over until your bike runs like absolute garbage, almost undriveable!! It might not sound like a big issue, but when your map ends up looking like this, the bike is a bucking bronco!

christina_autotune_problem.png


Look at the 5% column, +37, -10, +40, -9, +40, etc. That doesn't feel very nice :(

-Jamie M.
 
toysareforboys said:
And Azim, even if you get your bike dynotuned, the autotune will totally mess the dyno tuned map up in very short order (at low rpm/low throttle that we're talking about).

-Jamie M.
Click to expand...

Low RPM? What's that... You're talking about below 10,000 RPM right? Race/Track bike here.... it's full on or off in quick or smooth succession. No constant cruising.

AT does what I set it up to do. It isn't an effective stand-alone tuner... It can be to a certain reasonable degree. It's mostly enhancement for saving to re-tune based on location or other parts (like a race-style air filter).

It never has decreased the bike's performance when I ride it, but who am I to say.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom