One step at a time...

Re: Accidents

CB Rider said:
+1 on that.
Best advice I received last year was "google, bike fails". I got a crash(pardon the pun)course in why we(bikers) crash
1)we are not visible
2)we, like everyone lose focus now and then or are not experienced and practiced enough for the conditions we find our selves in. The consequences for that, with out a cage to protect us are far more severe.
3)some squidiot out rides his/her skill level doing something fast or dumb or both.
Yes ...I know I just repeated what was said in the quote, like I learned in the M1x course, repetition, repetition, repetition. Get why crashes happen into your head and make a habit out of looking for and avoiding those situations
Click to expand...

I have to agree. I've watched hundreds of bike crashes on youtube and you definitely start to notice a pattern. There are some very common scenarios. Not saying it helps predict danger, but it helps you understand some of the common causes that lead to crashes. Most are the 3 reasons mentioned.
 
Re: Accidents

These are the kind of incidents that freak me out...
http://www.motorsoul.ca/groups/moto.../why-taking-motorsoul-courses-is-a-good-idea/
The Youtube video is linked off that page.

The thing is, the guy wasn't even going that fast, and the turn wasn't even sharp. He brakes in the turn (the handbook says not to do that) and then seems to randomly drift to the right, right off the road. Is this what you mean about focusing on something and crashing into it? It just doesn't make sense to me why he wouldn't just continue trying to turn to the left, but its probably one of those things you only 'get' once you start riding.

Definitely one of those crashes you could say "could have been a lot worse". Luckily there was a guard rail, and the following bike didn't hit the bike that spun out.

Frightening stuff. Very. Not going to let it stop me at this point though.
 
That's #2 100%. There is no reason he couldn't have made that turn. It does look like he's going pretty fast, but its hard to tell with the fisheye.

Just like the example in TOTW, the big ones are:

- He froze. If he had of kept counter steering he could have turned much more sharply before something bad happened.

- He got on the brakes. This may slow you down a bit, but the bike stands up and runs even more wide.

- He stared at the edge of the road where he was worried about going off. That's where he went.

He also charged that corner from the start, setting him up for a wide exit. One too many mistakes.
 
Seller pulled out...dealerships?

Oh boy, I am miffed at the moment. I spent the last couple of days viewing bikes, put down an offer with deposit, and after all the effort, the seller decided to refund my deposit and go with another offer. We had decided where we were going to meet, how I'd pay, certification, etc. And he pulled out.

I am so put off by the experience now, I kind of want to just go to a dealership and not deal with this crap.

Can anyone please recommend any places that would have a good selection of used Hondas in Toronto, or perhaps slightly just north of Steeles? Anywhere else is just too far, unless they come highly recommended. I am hoping someone can also suggest dealerships to _avoid_...........

damn. But I guess everything happens for a reason. It's only a bike.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

Dang... So sorry to hear about that. Unfortunately my familiarity is with places west of you. I know that Sturgess in Hamilton is highly regarded but I do not know of any places out your way.

Which bike were you going to buy? I hope some other members will be able to help you. Season is not yet upon us so time is still on your side.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

I was going for the Honda CBR250RA.
I did shoot an email over to Can North. I heard decent things about them on this board. A little far but not as bad as Hamilton.

Based on what I have read here, I will try to avoid VOS motors.

when you say..."season not yet upon us"... What is typically the time people start shifting bikes, is it right about now or closer to April? I am interested to know how the yearly cycle works...I.e. Will the boards start getting flooded with ads with sellers willing to drop a few bucks off to outsell the other bikes posted? Or do prices actually tend to go up because so many people start looking?

the thing is, in the deal I had, we had agreed on a place for certification and the numbers for the UVIP. He bailed claiming that he changed his mind on getting it certified and wasn't comfortable with the UVIP details we agreed to, so he let it go to someone else as-is.

i am new to this, but please tell me if I am wrong in asking for a safety before buying a bike, and agreeing on some UVIP numbers. If these things are too much trouble for sellers to agree with, F it, imma go dealer.
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

I meant the riding season... Not sure when the peaks and valleys are for buying and selling. I can tell you that there are a whack of CBR250s out there. If you buy one used then you should be able to flip it in a year or two for little loss as they are well recognized as being an ideal starter bike. Now that the Ninja 300 is here, R3, CBR300 etc the 250s should hopefully be a little easier to find. The older Ninja 250s are great bikes as well. Having a fuel injected bike and it being only one cylinder should make maintenance costs low on the CBR250.

I just meant to not sweat it about having a bike yet. I am getting the itch to ride too but I like there to be a few good rains to get most of the salt off the roads. I usually do not take my first ride until mid April which is still a month away.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

marktwothousand said:
Based on what I have read here, I will try to avoid VOS motors.
Click to expand...

Being you're new... before you jump on a bandwagon don't believe everything you read on this of all forums. I bought my bike at vos as did half a dozen of my friends and not one of the bs stories are true. They're great to deal with and have zero to hide. I've been all through the shop many times unannounced and there's been nothing going on that you wouldn't see in any other shop. Most of the **** talkers here have never dealt with them, they just read bad stuff on the internet or "their bros told them it's bad" :rolleyes:

I previously had bought a new bike at brampton powersports who are also great to deal with but they couldn't come anywhere near the deal I got at vos. If he has what you're looking for go check them out. I can't say enough good about them.

For the idiots who think they only "import beat up us bikes and fix them"
This was mine brand new.
a765a18c1dda7a797df649ebb467e7e6.jpg



4e2d6c15b2feb479399d24797b50ac5d.jpg
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

Roomie said:
Being you're new... before you jump on a bandwagon don't believe everything you read on this of all forums. I bought my bike at vos as did half a dozen of my friends and not one of the bs stories are true. They're great to deal with and have zero to hide. I've been all through the shop many times unannounced and there's been nothing going on that you wouldn't see in any other shop. Most of the **** talkers here have never dealt with them, they just read bad stuff on the internet or "their bros told them it's bad" :rolleyes:

I previously had bought a new bike at brampton powersports who are also great to deal with but they couldn't come anywhere near the deal I got at vos. If he has what you're looking for go check them out. I can't say enough good about them.

For the idiots who think they only "import beat up us bikes and fix them"
This was mine brand new.
a765a18c1dda7a797df649ebb467e7e6.jpg



4e2d6c15b2feb479399d24797b50ac5d.jpg
Click to expand...

+1 I bought my bike from there and it was a smooth and pleasurable buying experience. I went in there earlier in the year to look at possibly buying an FZ07 and was talked out of it because the salesman knew that coming from an R6 I probably wouldn't have enjoyed as much as I thought I would. He actually talked me out of giving them more money.

Despite what you might hear about them they are a good dealership to deal with. Check out their stock and see if they have anything good that you're looking for. It wouldn't hurt to look.

They may be a little bit over priced but the price tag can always be talked down a bit.

And don't let one bad experience ruin your enthusiasm, before I went the dealership route I looked at a bunch of private sales with no luck. Plus you still have about a month before the season really starts to pick up.

Good luck on the search!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

The number one problem with motorcyclists and accidents is cockiness.

First year people may have accidents because they don't know their bikes that well.

Second year the rate goes down because they're learning control

Third year it goes back up because things are become automatic, and they don't have to think them through.

For some people the cockiness may start earlier, and for a few it never goes away.

As to the video, it looks to me like he tried to apex before the turn even started, and ran out of road. He got too close to the line right after the cars passed, and then looked to the outside as he moved back. Don't look where you don't want to go. Look where you want to go.

For intersections, cars, trucks, motorcycles, bicycles will turn in front of you, they do it to transport trucks, so they're not going to change.
Motorcycles are smaller than cars, so they may seem further away, and their speed is harder to judge. People tend to speed up at intersections to catch the light, in all vehicles. My bike has a longer stopping distance than my car. The new car will even brake harder if you're not pressing hard enough. So you need to be more cautious at intersections. This is again where the cockiness comes in, you've passed through the same intersection 1,000 times before, you know when the light will change, so you give it that extra bit of gas to make the light, there's a big cube van turning left from your side, so you can't see the opposing traffic . . .

ABS is good to have. I wouldn't buy another bike without it.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

One other reminder. If you have your full G but only an M1 or M2, "some" of the restrictions for the M1 or 2 "carry over" to your G licence. IE alcohol with a full G you can have a drink, (not that I recommend it), before driving with a M1 you have to maintain a ZERO alcohol. So now with the M1 you MUST have ZERO alcohol even when driving a car with full G.

But other M1 conditions do not apply, like driving on 400 series highways etc.

I know a buddy in his 40's went out for dinner with his wife had a glass of wine, with dinner. Got stopped in a ride check blew, (reading was 0.4, LESS than a warning for a full G driver) but he was suspended, because he was also an M1 licence holder. Made NO sense but that is how the regs are written.
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

With the greatest of respect, as I know you guys are the experts...but that's why I am going to say the following...according to all the research I've done on this board and others, that seems to be NOT true:
- M1 conditions apply when you are on your motorcycle
- G conditions apply to you when you are in your car
However: if you violate any M1 conditions WHILE on your bike, your entire license (G and M) gets the suspension.

that is the way I understand it. And the reasoning I have reason for this explanation is...the M1 also says I can't drive at night or on highways. Well, I guess I'm in big trouble then because I practically drove the 427/407/404 loop this week in my car...at midnight!!!

please correct me if I am wrong but I have been doing great research into this point. I am especially concerned about the M2 zero tolerance restriction. I bought a breathalyzer. I am concerned that if I have A BEER (yes, *one*) on a hot sunny afternoon and bike home 5 hours later, I will still have a positive BAC level. Apparently, this would affect my G AND M insurance in a BIG way. If I ever register a positive BAC level, I will leave my bike parked.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

hedo2002 said:
One other reminder. If you have your full G but only an M1 or M2, "some" of the restrictions for the M1 or 2 "carry over" to your G licence. IE alcohol with a full G you can have a drink, (not that I recommend it), before driving with a M1 you have to maintain a ZERO alcohol. So now with the M1 you MUST have ZERO alcohol even when driving a car with full G.

But other M1 conditions do not apply, like driving on 400 series highways etc.

I know a buddy in his 40's went out for dinner with his wife had a glass of wine, with dinner. Got stopped in a ride check blew, (reading was 0.4, LESS than a warning for a full G driver) but he was suspended for 90 days because he was also an M1 licence holder. Made NO sense but that is how the regs are written.
Click to expand...

Are you sure about this? I always thought if you have your full G all the restrictions apply as per the full G when driving a car etc. When you are riding the motorcycle only the M1, M2 restrictions apply while you are using the bike. The only difference is if you get a fine while under the restrictions of the M1, M2 while using the bike , the fine carries over to your drivers license record. Unless you never had a G license already. Then when you get the M2 license you can automatically drive class G vehicles under the G1 rules.
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

Don't have time at this minute to get the link to the MTO, but this is taken directly from RTI, Riding school.

If you hold other class licences, such as a G, D etc, and you are caught ignoring the M1 and M2 restrictions it can result in fines and the loss of your drivers licence. You would lose all your driving privileges in all classes. What you do in one vehicle affects the other.
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

marktwothousand said:
With the greatest of respect, as I know you guys are the experts...but that's why I am going to say the following...according to all the research I've done on this board and others, that seems to be NOT true:
- M1 conditions apply when you are on your motorcycle
- G conditions apply to you when you are in your car
However: if you violate any M1 conditions WHILE on your bike, your entire license (G and M) gets the suspension.

that is the way I understand it. And the reasoning I have reason for this explanation is...the M1 also says I can't drive at night or on highways. Well, I guess I'm in big trouble then because I practically drove the 427/407/404 loop this week in my car...at midnight!!!

please correct me if I am wrong but I have been doing great research into this point. I am especially concerned about the M2 zero tolerance restriction. I bought a breathalyzer. I am concerned that if I have A BEER (yes, *one*) on a hot sunny afternoon and bike home 5 hours later, I will still have a positive BAC level. Apparently, this would affect my G AND M insurance in a BIG way. If I ever register a positive BAC level, I will leave my bike parked.
Click to expand...

You need to be aware that the breathalyzers sold in stores are not calibrated and can provide a false reading. I freely admit I will have a beer when out for dinner in my car, But I NEVER touch a drop of alcohol when riding, (I have held GM licences for 35 years, so I certainly have no zero tolerance restriction). It is NEVER a good idea to get on a bike after having consumed alcohol.

Now in your scenario, having one beer and waiting 5 hours the alcohol, (especially if you have eaten, etc) should have cleared your system.

As fr the driving your car at night if you look at my original post you will see I clearly stated not all restrictions of a M1 or M2 apply when operating a vehicle with your G licence.

EDIT: Found the MTO wording it is in the driver's handbook. "Hybrid driver" refers to one who holds two or more classes of licences IE G M1.

Escalating sanctions for hybrid drivers would apply if there is any combination of repeat violations of their novice licence (G1/G2/ M1/M2) conditions within a 5-year period.

The penalties under escalating sanctions for novice and hybrid drivers are:


  • 30-day licence suspension for the first occurrence
  • 90-day licence suspension for the second occurrence
  • Licence cancellation and a requirement to re-apply for a G1/M1 after the third occurrence. Any fees paid, credit received for time spent in the program or BDE credit would be forfeited when the licence is cancelled. Please note that in the case of a hybrid driver, only the novice class licence is cancelled on the third occasion, their full class licence is maintained.
A reinstatement fee is also imposed on first and second occurrence drivers.

Somewhat, confusing but all classes are suspended for first and second occurrence then third violation ONLY the M1 would be cancelled the G would remain valid. But also if you had say 16 months credit in M2 on the way to getting your full M you lose credit for that time as well and go back to an M1 with full waiting periods again.

Of course this would also incude the novice, (under 21 Zero alcohol BAC condition).
 
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Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

That is ludicrous. I just got my M1, and You're asserting that for basically another two years now, zero tolerance will apply to me when I am driving a car, after I've already had my G for 20 years?
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

marktwothousand said:
That is ludicrous. I just got my M1, and You're asserting that for basically another two years now, zero tolerance will apply to me when I am driving a car, after I've already had my G for 20 years?
Click to expand...

Been there done that. With the course your waiting period is shortened to 15 months. Makes it a little easier to get the full license within 2 years.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

I'm not convinced one affects the other that way. Are you sure?

If you hold other class licences, such as a G, D etc, and you are caught ignoring the M1 and M2 restrictions it can result in fines and the loss of your drivers licence.

Say I have a G/M1. If I have a beer and drive my car, am I ignoring M1 restrictions? I would think being in a car my M1 restrictions don't apply.
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

Not my assertion those are the rules. Was WAYYYY easier when I got my licence you went in got your "learners permit" then after 3 months you got your full licence. Then you would go and write your M licence and if you passed you had your full GM licence..

marktwothousand said:
That is ludicrous. I just got my M1, and You're asserting that for basically another two years now, zero tolerance will apply to me when I am driving a car, after I've already had my G for 20 years?
Click to expand...
 
Re: Seller pulled out...dealerships?

That quote was taken from RTI. But I then posted the MTO version as printed in the drivers handbook and yes if you are a M1 driver, but are driving your car with a BAC then your licence is suspended. The only restrictions that are applicable are those surrounding alcohol, the carrying passengers driving after sundown etc do NOT apply when in your G vehicle.

There are other threads in the law forum that covered this all last season.

MTO link http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section4.8.1.shtml

spray____ said:
I'm not convinced one affects the other that way. Are you sure?

If you hold other class licences, such as a G, D etc, and you are caught ignoring the M1 and M2 restrictions it can result in fines and the loss of your drivers licence.

Say I have a G/M1. If I have a beer and drive my car, am I ignoring M1 restrictions? I would think being in a car my M1 restrictions don't apply.
Click to expand...
 
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