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Minimum wage spin offs

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nobbie48

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I'm watching the California game play out and it's developing unintented consequences.

SACRAMENTO, Calif. (AP) — Lost in the hubbub surrounding California’s new $20-per-hour minimum wage for fast food workers is how that raise could impact public schools, forcing districts to compete with the likes of McDonald’s and Wendy’s for cafeteria workers amid a state budget crunch.

The minimum wage law that took effect Monday guarantees at least $20-per-hour for workers at fast food restaurant chains with at least 60 locations nationwide. That doesn’t include school food service workers, historically some of the lowest-paid workers in public education.

Yet demand for school meals is higher than ever in California, the first state to guarantee free meals for all students regardless of their family’s income. And demand is projected to fuel an increase of more than 70 million extra meals in California schools this year compared to 2018, according to the state Department of Education.

But these jobs typically have lots of turnover and are harder to fill. The minimum wage boost for fast food workers could make that even more difficult.

I was talking to a guy who said McDonald's, in some middle east countries, was considered upscale. Are we looking forward to $25 cheeseburgers?
 
I don't feel bad for billion dollar profit multinational conglomerates being forced to pay a living wage, and in CA, $20 is still not a living wage, but it's a lot better than the pittance that they usually pay.

The problem with all this is the greed and drive for "shareholder value". Shareholders for McDonands just expect billions of dollars in profits every year now, and the windfalls that provide. When a company is actually forced to pay their employees fairly for the work they do and it inconveniently bites into profits, the shareholders get upset, and then there's negative financial consequences for the company. This, IMHO, needs to stop somehow - I'm literally living this at my employer right now, and it sucks. We need to stop normalizing companies making tens, hundreds, or billlions of dollars in profits while treating the employees who actually make those profits like inconveniences along the path to even more millions or billions.
 
PrivatePilot said:
I don't feel bad for billion dollar profit multinational conglomerates being forced to pay a living wage, and in CA, $20 is still not a living wage, but it's a lot better than the pittance that they usually pay.

The problem with all this is the greed and drive for "shareholder value". Shareholders for McDonands just expect billions of dollars in profits every year now, and the windfalls that provide. When a company is actually forced to pay their employees fairly for the work they do and it inconveniently bites into profits, the shareholders get upset, and then there's negative financial consequences for the company. This, IMHO, needs to stop somehow - I'm literally living this at my employer right now, and it sucks. We need to stop normalizing companies making tens, hundreds, or billlions of dollars in profits while treating the employees who actually make those profits like inconveniences along the path to even more millions or billions.
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I agree but what about the unintended consequences?

Not every investor is a smarmy slave driver sitting on his yacht in the Bahamas. Pensions, RRSPs, RRIFs, Widow and orphan funds all depend on the market. They all suffer in downturns. One brush doesn't paint them all.

The worst of the lot are the "Show me the money" O'Learys that create wealth but not jobs or new products.

The expectations of the shareholders is often borderline delusional.

Of course one could seek out the source of their cheap oil filter from India.


Due to child labour laws that wouldn't work here.

A fast food joint open 18 hours a day would have a wage cost of $240 per position per day X 365 = $87,600 plus some benefits and shared deductions. How much is a robot?

If you watch the India video it's easy to see where the process could be made more productive but when labour is that cheap why spend the money?

Then more effort is put on the consumer. My bank prefers me to waste two minutes or more of my time pushing phone keys and listening to options rather them pay a person to express my call through in fifteen seconds of their time.

The self order stations and self checkouts are working for less than $20 an hour. They'll work the bugs out eventually.

The shift of relative remuneration from the low end to the CEO has gone extreme.

The old standard used to be the worker drove a Chevy and his boss an Oldsmobile. Now the worker gets a Versa and the boss drives a 600 MB.
 
nobbie48 said:
The expectations of the shareholders is often borderline delusional.
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Yep.

nobbie48 said:
If you watch the India video it's easy to see where the process could be made more productive but when labour is that cheap why spend the money?
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We also have a lot more worker protection here, and I don't think anyone should discount the benefits of that.

I recently saw someone bring up some comments on the Baltimore bridge situation and how China would have that bridge reopoened in 12 months, but the reality is China would throw 50,000 peasants making a few dollars a day at the job, thousands of them would die or be maimed during the job (which you'd never hear about, but China treats their people like disposable robots, you dont need to go very far on YouTube to see that workplace safety is not even on the radar there), a lot wouldn't know what they're doing to begin with and would do subpar work, and sure, that bridge would be reopened in 12 months, but at what cost in the longer term bigger picture?

Those indian made oil filters...do yout think there's any sort of QA in the end? Sure, there might be only one bad one for every 1000 they make or whatever, but if you're the person who has their engine trashed when that 1 in 1000 fails, you lose.

So, Cheaper and faster isn't always better.

nobbie48 said:
The self order stations and self checkouts are working for less than $20 an hour. They'll work the bugs out eventually.
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A lot of stores are closing them actually as the theft issues are real. It ranges from people scanning a $500 TV as a $199 one to people just "accidentally" punching in the produce code for the cheap bulk apples instead of the expensive ones actually in the bag.

Personally, I love self checkouts (introvert things), but I know they are abused.

nobbie48 said:
The shift of relative remuneration from the low end to the CEO has gone extreme.
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One of the biggest issues. When the CEO is making $10M a year sitting in an ivory tower just talking on the phone and sending emails, and then they're crapping on the peasants actually doing the grind every day making the company actually function, well, that's a problem in my mind.
 
PrivatePilot said:
The problem with all this is the greed and drive for "shareholder value". Shareholders for McDonands just expect billions of dollars in profits every year now, and the windfalls that provide. When a company is actually forced to pay their employees fairly for the work they do and it inconveniently bites into profits, the shareholders get upset, and then there's negative financial consequences for the company. This, IMHO, needs to stop somehow - I'm literally living this at my employer right now, and it sucks. We need to stop normalizing companies making tens, hundreds, or billlions of dollars in profits while treating the employees who actually make those profits like inconveniences along the path to even more millions or billions.
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There are some simple solutions on paper but complicated non-intended consequences.

For wages, make a law that total C suite comp cannot exceed X times the average salary at the company. If the brass wants to make more, they need to raise non-executive compensation.

You could pass a similar law regarding profits but it would cause a huge stock market correction. Something like profit, dividends and Share buybacks cannot exceed y% of non-executive payroll. If they want to book more profit, they need to come up with a way to distribute more to employees.

The lobbyists would ruin both laws by setting meaningless limits and/or loopholes to accommodate every corporation.
 
I see something else that could happen.

School cafeterias removed and replaced with corporate chain outlets. It happens on university campuses, it’s entirely plausible it could happen here.
 
jc100 said:
I see something else that could happen.

School cafeterias removed and replaced with corporate chain outlets. It happens on university campuses, it’s entirely plausible it could happen here.
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I saw a post (maybe here on GTAM??) about a new high school in Texas
Super huge amazing sports school -- gyms, fields, stadiums....just ridiculous
Then they showed the food court -- all fast food chains

Edit:
Found it

www.barstoolsports.com

Unreal: New High School In Texas Has An Insane Arena, Indoor Football Practice Facility And A Mall-Style Food Court With Sonic And Jimmy Johns

I saw this and immediately thought it was just some recycled post about a high school that has probably gone viral 20 times for their setup. Nope. This new high school in *checks notes* Prosper, Texas...
www.barstoolsports.com www.barstoolsports.com

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 
Joe Bass said:
I saw a post (maybe here on GTAM??) about a new high school in Texas
Super huge amazing sports school -- gyms, fields, stadiums....just ridiculous
Then they showed the food court -- all fast food chains

Edit:
Found it

www.barstoolsports.com

Unreal: New High School In Texas Has An Insane Arena, Indoor Football Practice Facility And A Mall-Style Food Court With Sonic And Jimmy Johns

I saw this and immediately thought it was just some recycled post about a high school that has probably gone viral 20 times for their setup. Nope. This new high school in *checks notes* Prosper, Texas...
www.barstoolsports.com www.barstoolsports.com

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

My old Uni department had a cafeteria staffed by dinner ladies. You could buy slices of toast for just a few cents. Tea and coffee for not much more. Food was cheap and pretty wholesome. The idea was to have healthy people studying/working without breaking the bank. The profit side of things was a very very distant second. Came to Canada and there’s pizza outlets on campus etc and the prices were often higher than on the high street.
 
Relax said:
WTF, why only increase minimum wage for fast food chains???
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And only fast food chains with more than X stores. If I was on the cusp and wanted to expand, I'd find a way around it (eg. existing stores under BurgerJoint Inc. and new stores under BurgerJointB Inc which has a license to use the branding but is financially distinct).
 
WTF??? "The new California statewide legislation went into effect Monday and enforces a $20 minimum wage for restaurants that have at least 60 locations nationwide, except those that make and sell their own bread."
 
GreyGhost said:
And only fast food chains with more than X stores. If I was on the cusp and wanted to expand, I'd find a way around it (eg. existing stores under BurgerJoint Inc. and new stores under BurgerJointB Inc which has a license to use the branding but is financially distinct).
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Start baking bread. I guess this is how Subway is surviving? This law makes NO sense (to me).
 
Jay Alexander said:
There's a study on this, and some consequences included cutting hours and benefits to employees
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Companies can only cut so far before they either can't staff their stores properly, or the workforce is cut so close ot the bone that everyone gets burned out and either quiet-quits, or just leaves.

I know it's a common misconception that fast food joints can just hire another warm body and fill those positions, but eventually they run out of bodies when word gets out that somewhere is a really ****** place to work.

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jc100 said:
My old Uni department had a cafeteria staffed by dinner ladies. You could buy slices of toast for just a few cents. Tea and coffee for not much more. Food was cheap and pretty wholesome. The idea was to have healthy people studying/working without breaking the bank. The profit side of things was a very very distant second. Came to Canada and there’s pizza outlets on campus etc and the prices were often higher than on the high street.
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Back when I was in high school we had an honest to goodness cafeterial with honest to goodness oldschool "lunch ladies" that ran it. With actual food. I remember the usual fries and pizza, but we also had trays of lasagna, soups, and other stuff that actually had to be prepared and cooked in house.

Relax said:
Start baking bread. I guess this is how Subway is surviving? This law makes NO sense (to me).
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Scuba Steve said:
Panera paid a nice bribe for that put in.

Sent from the future
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<McDonalds found putting in a rush order of ovens for CA stores, sudden run on jobs for bakers>
 
Move the bakery loop hole up here and Timmies will have to start baking again instead of thawing frozen stuff. A ray of sunshine
 
Wonder if the actual law reads backed on premise or baked by the store ? You as shareholders and franchisee claim investment in the giant bakery that drop ships your bread . It’s all baked somewhere .
Tim’s stores franchisees resisted the mother ship sending donuts to be defrosted . Then somebody said no union baker on staff 24/7 , only defrost what you need so there are never day old donuts in a Tim’s , make BAGs more money . The stores love it .


Sent from my iPhone using GTAMotorcycle.com
 
crankcall said:
The stores love it .
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I don't know that the feeling is universal, almost all Tim's donuts suck now and a lot of franchisees know that, but they also don't have a choice as they're only allowed to do what is decreed from the ivory towers, with food they're decreed to buy from the ivory towers, and sell at prices that are decreed by the ivory towers.

Lawsuits against the ivory towers from franchisee owners are not uncommon. A bunch were filed in quebec just a week or so back, for that matter.

 
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