M2 Training Post-M2 License

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Beakster

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Hi,

Does anyone know of an riding school that offers the M2 training course to riders who already have an M2 license?

My girlfriend did her test at the ministry and has several months experience. Just upgraded to a larger bike and seems like the M2 training course would make a significant difference to the insurance cost. But don't want to spend a whole weekend with people who have never ridden a bike before Also don't need to do the test as have an M2 license already. Ideally looking for a something minimal in terms of time and cost to get the certificate for someone who can already ride and has the license. Also has her own bike and insurance so don't need to rent a bike from them either.

Thanks
 
You could have her go to one of the more in depth M2X courses that is offered by several schools. Even though she's not actually eligible for her full M as of yet (it sounds like she just got her M2 recently?) she'll still learn some skills.

Or you could have her go something like the Motorcycle Masters course that I posted about here recently although it's really not perfectly suited to someone with only a few months riding experience.

That having been said, if it's just insurance savings you're looking for, nothing other than the accredited M1X>M2 training course is recognized by pretty much all insurance companies so far as yielding any insurance discounts. Even the advanced rider training course I did with MCM means squat for my insurance costs, but it made me far better rider.

Don't diss the course if she hasn't done it or "Doesn't' want to spend the whole weekend with people who have never ridden a bike before". Trust me, she WILL learn things. People who have ridden for decades but never had any formal training learn things. A few months experience is nothing - she WILL benefit, and she'll get that insurance discount. There's nothing stopping *anyone* from taking this course even if you have a full M licence already.

IMHO you're getting ahead of yourself based on her skillset. Having achieved an M2 through (presumably?) the MTO test means little to nothing so far as skills learned.
 
Insurance companies are looking for the M2 fundamentals course. The course isn't just newbies riding bikes for their first time, they get experienced motocross riders, folks scraping of the rust while returning to MC riding, and some noobs. Ins co's aren't too concerned about your fundamental control, they like the safety training.

There are no shortcuts other than hiring a private instructor who can do M2 exit certification.
 
Mad Mike said:
There are no shortcuts other than hiring a private instructor who can do M2 exit certification.
Click to expand...

So far as insurance discounts, it's almost certain that won't yield anything either.

Basically, the only thing 99% of MC insurance underwriters care about is the recognized/standardized courses. I wish the advanced rider course I spent $250 taking a month or so back yielded even the tiniest extra discount, but yeah...no.
 
Hi, thanks for the replies. I've done some research and it does seem that there is no shorter route than the M2 exit course with the beginners. I am skeptical of the M2 course given that there is no on-road training element. As motorcyclists the biggest danger we face is sharing the road with larger vehicles often driven by careless drivers. I did my courses in the UK where you are not allowed to go out on the road alone until you have been assessed by an instructor driving in the road in real conditions with other traffic. I have also heard some people who took the M2 course speak poorly of it, being left to ride around a car park for a couple of days until they'd figured it out and no one failing the test at the end even if they dropped the bike.

That said I'm sure there are some good instructors and good schools out there and there will be value to be had from taking one of these courses.
 
You'll over-simplying what you seem to think the M1>M2 course covers.

And I'm not sure where you read that the M1x courses offered here was just two days of "riding around a parking lot". And if you drop the bike during the test, it's an instant fail. It sounds to me like whatever course you were reading about isn't the "Gearing Up" standardized one.

Yes, it's in a parking lot. But it's a very structured course. No, there's no on-street segment, but they absolutely positively DO teach things that are directly transferable to the street - things that are impossible to practice on the street to begin with actually for that matter, such as emergency braking, swerving/obstacle avoidance, etc etc. It's way better to simulate emergencies in a parking lot then to ride around looking for them.

Trust me, just send her to the course. Again, if she just got her licence, she still has a TON to learn, and she'll learn a ton of it there, including things that could very well save her life some day.
 
Beakster said:
Hi, thanks for the replies. I've done some research and it does seem that there is no shorter route than the M2 exit course with the beginners. I am skeptical of the M2 course given that there is no on-road training element. As motorcyclists the biggest danger we face is sharing the road with larger vehicles often driven by careless drivers. I did my courses in the UK where you are not allowed to go out on the road alone until you have been assessed by an instructor driving in the road in real conditions with other traffic. I have also heard some people who took the M2 course speak poorly of it, being left to ride around a car park for a couple of days until they'd figured it out and no one failing the test at the end even if they dropped the bike.

That said I'm sure there are some good instructors and good schools out there and there will be value to be had from taking one of these courses.
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When I was an instructor we would ask if the student had riding experience and try to put them into groups that had similar riding experience.
 
taximan62 said:
When I was an instructor we would ask if the student had riding experience and try to put them into groups that had similar riding experience.
Click to expand...
Also if you did take the course even if you had an M2 you had to pass the final test in order to receive the certificate proving you took the course
 
Hey Beakster,
Several months of experience and upgraded already?
As a motorcycle course instructor, I regularly pass on techniques to long term dirt bike and experienced road riders.

I've had riders say "I've got 20 years experience and I'm only here 'cause the insurance company tells me I have to come" be outshone by total newbie riders at the end of the class. The old school riders have done zero to improve their skills - so, they've got 1 year of experience, 20 times... as they're no better now than they were way back when.

If you're concerned she'll be bored to tears and it's just not worth it, well, tell her to suck it up. Spend the weekend doing the course. At worst she'll be bored. At best she'll have learned something *AND* have a drastic insurance reduction.

Basically, consider this (purely example, from a student this past weekend)
Yamaha FZ6r (sport touring category): $3200
Yamaha FZ6r (with course ($475ish after tax))): $1750

Learn something, more than make the cost of your course back in 1 year of insurance - all for the sake of some boredom.
 
Anybody can jump on a small bike and get riding in an hour or two -- those who do that and learn riding from their friends are about twice as likely to crash as those who do a foundations course.

Remember what the course is designed to do - teach you about motorcycle safety, the basic stuff you need to learn to minimize the risks of riding. Much of what your gal will learn is not related to skill, it's knowledge -- lane selection, being visible, blocking, head checks, risky situation awareness (left turners, cars entering roadways), target fixation and a bit of confidence -- learning these things helps keep riders alive.

Skills come next. The course teaches with foundational skills: braking, emergency braking, steering, throttle, clutch, swerve and low speed control. All this prepares a rider to get on the road and start building to basic proficiency.

Insurers know more than 1/2 of all MC accidents happen to riders with less that 5 months riding experience. They also know that rate is cut in 1/2 with basic MC training -- that's why the offer big discounts to riders with basic training.
 
Up here in Ottawa at the OSC for the M2X, the first thing you do is classroom, second is the M1X test on your bike.
If you don't pass, you don't go out on the weekend.
That's to demonstrate that you're capable or riding somewhat proficiently, before you're taken out on the road with others.
It also filters out those who have sat on their license for four and half years without riding.
On the weekend, there are at most three students per day, with one or two instructors.
One of the instructors will demonstrate what's expected of you, while the other drives you in the van following, and walking through what's being done.
Then you go out and ride it either behind or in front of the van, the instructor in the van lets you know what you're doing right and wrong, with the demo rider trailing the group, in case the bike following misses a turn or light.
After the person in front gets it, they switch to the back.
Once everyone has had a turn through residential, business, and highway, you stop somewhere else, and one by one, go through the test in a similar, but different, neighbourhood.
Some of the guys teaching it have been riding for 40 or 50 years.
I haven't heard anyone say that they didn't get something out of it.
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