Kinda a near miss today, what would you do? | GTAMotorcycle.com

Kinda a near miss today, what would you do?

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HorizonXP

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This is my 2nd season of riding, and I'm still very much a noob. So I take any incident and try to learn from it.

Scenario: Heading westbound on Eglinton, making a left onto Don Mills to head southbound. Was on my way to the gym, and there was heavy traffic. Car in front of me creeps into intersection to prepare for the left. Opposing traffic clears enough for him to make the left, and he does. It's still clear for me, with a couple of opposing cars and trucks on their way. I check for crossing pedestrians and see a man making his way across. I could've gunned it and made it, but decided that I didn't want to risk scaring the pedestrian. I look back at the traffic and notice that the light has turned yellow. So now, I definitely can make the turn without concern for opposing traffic. However, the pedestrian is still walking across.

So he starts this entire process off by walking when he wasn't supposed to. Ok fine, I'll deal with it and wait until he makes it across the lane I want to turn into. At this point, the car behind me decides to cut me off on the inside and gun it to the pedestrian before me. ****** move on his part, and he still has to wait for the guy to cross. Ok fine, I'll deal with it.

Then, the car behind him proceeds to do the same! So now, I'm making my way across the intersection side-by-side with this second car. I pull in my clutch and throw my hands up in frustration at him and give him the dirtiest look. He makes his way ahead of me and I complete the turn behind him, pulling in front of the SUV that was turning behind him. I'm pretty upset, and see that he's making the same left I am up ahead. I cut him off on the inside and make the turn before him, across heavy cross traffic (he was too big to fit, while my bike easily filtered. I really shouldn't have done this and just kept a cool head.)

Nevermind the fact that I had the right of way and these idiots just plain ignored me (although in fairness, I think the second car was just following the first), I still feel like I could've and should've avoided this somehow. I came out into the intersection so that cross traffic would see me. I was doing my due diligence to ensure that my way was clear before I made the left turn. I've never had to worry about people behind me like this, so I'll be honest and say that I wasn't watching these guys in my mirror.

Turn my bike more to make myself bigger? Should I have made the turn earlier? This could easily have turned into something much worse, which is why I'm so concerned.
 
HorizonXP said:
This is my 2nd season of riding, and I'm still very much a noob. So I take any incident and try to learn from it.

Scenario: Heading westbound on Eglinton, making a left onto Don Mills to head southbound. Was on my way to the gym, and there was heavy traffic. Car in front of me creeps into intersection to prepare for the left. Opposing traffic clears enough for him to make the left, and he does. It's still clear for me, with a couple of opposing cars and trucks on their way. I check for crossing pedestrians and see a man making his way across. I could've gunned it and made it, but decided that I didn't want to risk scaring the pedestrian. I look back at the traffic and notice that the light has turned yellow. So now, I definitely can make the turn without concern for opposing traffic. However, the pedestrian is still walking across.

So he starts this entire process off by walking when he wasn't supposed to. Ok fine, I'll deal with it and wait until he makes it across the lane I want to turn into. At this point, the car behind me decides to cut me off on the inside and gun it to the pedestrian before me. ****** move on his part, and he still has to wait for the guy to cross. Ok fine, I'll deal with it.

Then, the car behind him proceeds to do the same! So now, I'm making my way across the intersection side-by-side with this second car. I pull in my clutch and throw my hands up in frustration at him and give him the dirtiest look. He makes his way ahead of me and I complete the turn behind him, pulling in front of the SUV that was turning behind him. I'm pretty upset, and see that he's making the same left I am up ahead. I cut him off on the inside and make the turn before him, across heavy cross traffic (he was too big to fit, while my bike easily filtered. I really shouldn't have done this and just kept a cool head.)

Nevermind the fact that I had the right of way and these idiots just plain ignored me (although in fairness, I think the second car was just following the first), I still feel like I could've and should've avoided this somehow. I came out into the intersection so that cross traffic would see me. I was doing my due diligence to ensure that my way was clear before I made the left turn. I've never had to worry about people behind me like this, so I'll be honest and say that I wasn't watching these guys in my mirror.

Turn my bike more to make myself bigger? Should I have made the turn earlier? This could easily have turned into something much worse, which is why I'm so concerned.
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Well im sure the man didn't take up the entire track... Should've just went around him as thats what i would've done.
 
When I am waiting for a left turn, I barely move out past the line. Usually any car behind me has to wait behind the stop line. To be extra clear, and say the same thing another way: usually people queue up so that two, or even three cars (in an intersection like your scenario) are actually in the intersection. I never enter an intersection to turn left unless I absolutely know I can get out of it safely. If there are cars ahead, I wait behind the line. When I am first in the queue, I barely enter the intersection.

This protects me from what happened to you. Usually there just isn't enough room for a car to squeak by.

Also, don mills southbound has three lanes. I feel you could have easily picked a (slightly illegal) path through the turn into the lane furthest from the pedestrian, preferably behind him.

Also, for me, as soon as that light turns yellow, all bets are off and I'm getting through the intersection as safely and efficiently as possible. As you learned, people do dangerous things when the lights are yellow.
 
Yeah generally just navigate around carefully - good for your low speed skills and make eye contact and smile and nod and just do it.
Lefts on yellow are very dangerous as is being out in the intersection.
Turning your bike more is NOT the correct thing ever on a left - you risk getting hit from behind and pushed into opposing traffic. Keep your bike straight until you are actually riding into the turn.
( this applies to cage as well - don't angle the car ).

Good you kept your cool - sometimes you need to use the agility of the bike to lose the idjits including straying pedestrians - I don't envy you learning in Toronto.

Low speed handling practice and being in gear and in the right gear helps you in these circumstances but try your best NOT to stop in an intersection - wait the light out if you need to and ignore the dirty looks.

Also good you post up your bike and experience level....helps a lot answering questions.
 
i believe you have 3 lanes to turn into when making that left, so if you were waiting for the pedestrian, i would understand why the drivers behind you got frustrated.

Also were you waiting for the ped. to clear all 3 lanes or just one?

in the future, just make the left, or wide second lane, or go third if you really have to.

people are impatient, what can you do except avoid getting hit
 
Hm, I guess I'm hearing conflicting advice on this then.

I used to make lefts by keeping my bike barely over the line, waiting for cross traffic to clear enough to make the turn. Had an incident where a car decided to gun it through the red just as I decided to clear the intersection. I had barely started moving, so I grabbed the front brake, lost my footing, and slowly dropped the bike. The advice I got was to come out further into the intersection so that opposing traffic can see me better. This came from a fellow GTAM member who saw the whole thing as he waited at the intersection on the opposite side.

Now you guys are saying to stay close to the line, so that I'm not in the intersection exposed to other traffic. This would apparently help with those behind me, as they cannot cut me off.

Both sound reasonable. But which is it? LOL!

Sushii and KoalaKid, you're right, I had other lanes that I could technically have used, but the pedestrian was still crossing. He was not hustling, even though he should've been.

MacDoc, I didn't keep a cool head as I cut the guy off up ahead at the next left turn. I should've though. Thankfully, my low-speed control is pretty decent. I wasn't actually scared of being hit or anything. I was just upset that these guys didn't respect my space.
 
Fingolfin said:
i believe you have 3 lanes to turn into when making that left, so if you were waiting for the pedestrian, i would understand why the drivers behind you got frustrated.

Also were you waiting for the ped. to clear all 3 lanes or just one?

in the future, just make the left, or wide second lane, or go third if you really have to.

people are impatient, what can you do except avoid getting hit
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I was waiting for him to clear just the one lane. This all happened in a 5 second timespan. The first car that cut me off still ended up waiting for the pedestrian to clear that one lane.

I suppose I can just use the other lanes next time. But I'll be honest, my habit is to turn into the leftmost lane, whether I'm driving or riding. I will rarely use the other lanes when making the left, so this option never entered my head. I'll have to remember that for next time.
 
Where were you during yellow while waiting for the pedestrian to cross? Were you in the middle of the intersection or did you make the turn and were waiting in front of the crosswalk?

If you were in the middle of the intersection then the drivers might have thought they wouldn't make the turn before red and be stuck in the middle of the intersection, or they wanted to minimize the time they would be blocking traffic?

If it was me I would have completed the turn and waited right in front of the pedestrian and revved the engine a bit to get the sucker to hurry if he was just strolling.
 
HorizonXP said:
Hm, I guess I'm hearing conflicting advice on this then.

I used to make lefts by keeping my bike barely over the line, waiting for cross traffic to clear enough to make the turn. Had an incident where a car decided to gun it through the red just as I decided to clear the intersection. I had barely started moving, so I grabbed the front brake, lost my footing, and slowly dropped the bike. The advice I got was to come out further into the intersection so that opposing traffic can see me better. This came from a fellow GTAM member who saw the whole thing as he waited at the intersection on the opposite side.

Now you guys are saying to stay close to the line, so that I'm not in the intersection exposed to other traffic. This would apparently help with those behind me, as they cannot cut me off.

Both sound reasonable. But which is it? LOL!
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Do whichever you feel your comfortable with. I personally bring my whole bike into the intersection as i can see more of the opposing traffic if a car on the opposite side is also left turning. And it also allows more then one vehicle to turn if the light does turn yellow.
 
soto said:
Where were you during yellow while waiting for the pedestrian to cross? Were you in the middle of the intersection or did you make the turn and were waiting in front of the crosswalk?

If you were in the middle of the intersection then the drivers might have thought they wouldn't make the turn before red and be stuck in the middle of the intersection, or they wanted to minimize the time they would be blocking traffic?

If it was me I would have completed the turn and waited right in front of the pedestrian and revved the engine a bit to get the sucker to hurry if he was just strolling.
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I was in the middle of the intersection. Next time, I will do exactly that and scare that bastard pedestrian.

Sushii said:
Do whichever you feel your comfortable with. I personally bring my whole bike into the intersection as i can see more of the opposing traffic if a car on the opposite side is also left turning. And it also allows more then one vehicle to turn if the light does turn yellow.
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Yeah, I do the same and until today, it's served me well. Of course, the fact that it allows more than one vehicle to turn is what caused my problem today!
 
soto said:
Where were you during yellow while waiting for the pedestrian to cross? Were you in the middle of the intersection or did you make the turn and were waiting in front of the crosswalk?

If you were in the middle of the intersection then the drivers might have thought they wouldn't make the turn before red and be stuck in the middle of the intersection, or they wanted to minimize the time they would be blocking traffic?

If it was me I would have completed the turn and waited right in front of the pedestrian and revved the engine a bit to get the sucker to hurry if he was just strolling.
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What if a car on the rightmost lane in the opposite side decides to gun the yellow? You would probably be hit if you were waiting in front of the man. Also, if a car is almost in the intersection and the light turns yellow/red i believe the car is able to make the turn legally or else he'll be blocking traffic in the perpendicular side.
 
HorizonXP said:
Yeah, I do the same and until today, it's served me well. Of course, the fact that it allows more than one vehicle to turn is what caused my problem today!
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This is why i ride with my new GoPro recording at all times! It works wonders! I also noticed that people stoped tailgating me once they saw the camera and gave me one cars length of space behind me when stopped.
 
HorizonXP said:
I was waiting for him to clear just the one lane. This all happened in a 5 second timespan. The first car that cut me off still ended up waiting for the pedestrian to clear that one lane.

I suppose I can just use the other lanes next time. But I'll be honest, my habit is to turn into the leftmost lane, whether I'm driving or riding. I will rarely use the other lanes when making the left, so this option never entered my head. I'll have to remember that for next time.
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You're doing it right if I understand it correctly. Left turn into left lane. FWIW that intersection is always in the top 10 most dangerous in Ontario and often #1. I think I would park a block away and call for a flatbed to take me though the turn :)
 
Sushii said:
What if a car on the rightmost lane in the opposite side decides to gun the yellow? You would probably be hit if you were waiting in front of the man. Also, if a car is almost in the intersection and the light turns yellow/red i believe the car is able to make the turn legally or else he'll be blocking traffic in the perpendicular side.
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Obviously there is a time and place for everything, but it sounds like OP wasn't worried about traffic from the other direction and the only problem was the pedestrian. If pedestrian was going slow that would cause everyone in the intersection on a yellow to get nervous and want to clear the way, so the idea is if you're first in the line to lead everyone through quickly.
 
As i understand it as well in Toronto if you get caught in an intersection and the light switches you are up for a ticket period......and many intersections are camera's now.
I'd far rather wait in the lane until the next light as then peds can't cross - I'm surprised he had a crossing light while the left turn lights were on or maybe that wasn't the set up.

I prefer intersections with complete right-of-way for left turning vehicles and I'll wait and not try to catch it at the last minute unless traffic is very very light.....too much risk of some idjit cager running it late.

There is a reason UPS saved millions banning left hand turns ;)
 
MacDoc said:
As i understand it as well in Toronto if you get caught in an intersection and the light switches you are up for a ticket period......and many intersections are camera's now.
I'd far rather wait in the lane until the next light as then peds can't cross - I'm surprised he had a crossing light while the left turn lights were on or maybe that wasn't the set up.

I prefer intersections with complete right-of-way for left turning vehicles and I'll wait and not try to catch it at the last minute unless traffic is very very light.....too much risk of some idjit cager running it late.

There is a reason UPS saved millions banning left hand turns ;)
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1. It was a yellow light, not a left turning light.
2. UPS (United Postal Service?) vehicles can't left turn?
 
Sushii said:
1. It was a yellow light, not a left turning light.
2. UPS (United Postal Service?) vehicles can't left turn?
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Routes generated for UPS trucks are designed to minimize left turns - reduces idling and risk of collisions, apparently.
 
1. It was a yellow light, not a left turning light.
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thanks for clarification....

and it's multiple lanes without a left turn designation ....geez......no wonder high accident

run the bastard over - it's you or him... ;)
bottom line if you have to move into an intersection like that keep the bike pointed straight and get the **** outa there right snappy. :D

•••••

UPS has the "right" idea ;)

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2007/12/no-left-turn-so/
 
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