K&P Trail - no motorcycles

[jc100]

You used to be able to ride from north of Sharbot Lake all the way up to Renfrew on this but a recent bylaw put in place now seems to prohibit any dirt bike or motorcycle on the trail. However, ATV’s are still allowed?


That’s a shame. This is/was a decent, long permit free offroad multiuse trail that could get you to some interesting places. Not sure why they banned motorcycles and not ATVs unless there’s been some abuse going on.

 

[Mad Mike]

I had a cottage on Sharbot Lake for years... used that rail often with my kids on small dirt bikes.

Speed limit is 50Kmh, I think me on my TW200 and my kids on Trail 70s were the only ones that traveled those speeds. I'd say the average dirt biker was running as fast as possible, bikes passing us a 100kmh+ was frequent. I get it, running (racing?) motocross bikes on a multiuse trail is hard on the trail.

They should have restricted mc use to street legal <=200cc enduro bikes.

 

[Shaman]

How's that different from the ATVs? They fly past my house all the time doing 100+ on the road. There's a huge amount of them around here and a lot of them are those high-powered 800+cc v-twins.

My house is no more than a few kilometers from several trail heads (Petworth, McGill, Colebrook, Boyce, #38) so I see them pretty well every day that isn't pouring rain. Super annoying, since my road is 60kph and has many driveways on it. I have an ATV and the neighbor has a Can Am Maverick and both of us use them at proper speeds.

 

[Mad Mike]

How's that different from the ATVs? They fly past my house all the time doing 100+ on the road. There's a huge amount of them around here and a lot of them are those high-powered 800+cc v-twins.

My house is no more than a few kilometers from several trail heads (Petworth, McGill, Colebrook, Boyce, #38) so I see them pretty well every day that isn't pouring rain. Super annoying, since my road is 60kph and has many driveways on it. I have an ATV and the neighbor has a Can Am Maverick and both of us use them at proper speeds.

ATV's a lot lighter on terrain.

Full size ATVs are 800-1000lbs with rider and gear, less than 50hp/50lbs torque delivered through 4 fat and wide tires that don't rip up multiuse trails.

Most 250 2Ts dirt bikes are 1/2 the weight and have almost as much power being delivered through 1 skinny tire - they can really dig up a trail.

I'm guessing the rule changes are driven mainly through the snowmobile and equestrian crowds -- neither like dirtbikes and they wield a lot of power.

 

[Scuba Steve]

ATV's a lot lighter on terrain.

Full size ATVs are 800-1000lbs with rider and gear, less than 50hp/50lbs torque delivered through 4 fat and wide tires that don't rip up multiuse trails.

Most 250 2Ts dirt bikes are 1/2 the weight and have almost as much power being delivered through 1 skinny tire - they can really dig up a trail.

I'm guessing the rule changes are driven mainly through the snowmobile and equestrian crowds -- neither like dirtbikes and they wield a lot of power.

All the ATVs around here are closer to 100 hp and drive way too fast on the road as well.

Sent from the future

 

[GreyGhost]

All the ATVs around here are closer to 100 hp and drive way too fast on the road as well.

Sent from the future

And when the vehicle has the option, I keep atv in 2wd until I am approaching stuck. The common factor is the ass hat in control not the machine. Stab the throttle on a cvt atv and you make a mess of the trail. Ride any vehicle gently on a dry trail and it is hard to see evidence of your passage.

 

[Shaman]

Whoa, whoa..... you think that ATVs are easier on the environment? No, they're not. I've owned several of both (I have an ATV right now).

Those big fat tires flex. The knobs are designed to dig into the ground, the tire flexes and that literally rips apart ground AT ALL TIMES. Ride your ATV across a freshly cut lawn and you will see exactly what I'm talking about, there is NO way to ride an ATV across a lawn and not leave clearly visible marks and obvious if minor tearing at the edges of the tires, except to inflate the tires far beyond their proper capacity.

I learned this when I was a kid and the first of the fat-tired machines came out, mostly 3-wheelers. The pretty great trails that we had for dirtbikes that had a visible dirt line but very minor damage became rutted, nasty trails with mud ruts and really noticeable damage to the environment. It's all because of the natural, intentional flex of those tires and the powerful machines they have today just make it that much worse.

 

[xrljoel]

Whoa, whoa..... you think that ATVs are easier on the environment? No, they're not. I've owned several of both (I have an ATV right now).

Those big fat tires flex. The knobs are designed to dig into the ground, the tire flexes and that literally rips apart ground AT ALL TIMES. Ride your ATV across a freshly cut lawn and you will see exactly what I'm talking about, there is NO way to ride an ATV across a lawn and not leave clearly visible marks and obvious if minor tearing at the edges of the tires, except to inflate the tires far beyond their proper capacity.

I learned this when I was a kid and the first of the fat-tired machines came out, mostly 3-wheelers. The pretty great trails that we had for dirtbikes that had a visible dirt line but very minor damage became rutted, nasty trails with mud ruts and really noticeable damage to the environment. It's all because of the natural, intentional flex of those tires and the powerful machines they have today just make it that much worse.

Have to agree with you here. A dirt bike trail might be 12" wide on the ground while an ATV trail is 5' (?) wide and denuded of vegetation. Not to mention they invariably track into any/every wet or area turning it into a loose, soupy mess.

 

[Mad Mike]

Have to agree with you here. A dirt bike trail might be 12" wide on the ground while an ATV trail is 5' (?) wide and denuded of vegetation. Not to mention they invariably track into any/every wet or area turning it into a loose, soupy mess.

I think you guys are drifting a bit. We're not discussing dirtbikes on single-track or ATVs on logging trails, the discussion is about multi use recreational trails.

I used the trail in question for years, it rolled right by my cottage. Most of it is gravel railbed, it's used by walkers, cyclists, atvs, equestrians, and snowmobiles. When I frequented the trail in question, motorcycles too.

My experience is most trail users were respectful of rules... horses and ATVs were not carving up the trails. Too many MX riders were using the trail as a race course, running 2x the speed limit, racing, and carving ruts into the trail bed. The risk and trail damage is why other user groups voted motorcycles off the Island.

 

[xrljoel]

I think you guys are drifting a bit. We're not discussing dirtbikes on single-track or ATVs on logging trails, the discussion is about multi use recreational trails.

I used the trail in question for years, it rolled right by my cottage. Most of it is gravel railbed, it's used by walkers, cyclists, atvs, equestrians, and snowmobiles. When I frequented the trail in question, motorcycles too.

My experience is most trail users were respectful of rules... horses and ATVs were not carving up the trails. Too many MX riders were using the trail as a race course, running 2x the speed limit, racing, and carving ruts into the trail bed. The risk and trail damage is why other user groups voted motorcycles off the Island.

Fair point. There's definitely a large cohort of guys who spend plenty on a new MX bike, gear and trailer but will NEVER abide paying for insurance and an OFTR membership (and a spark arrestor) to ride/behave responsibly.