Is it worth doing the m2 exit?

[High Flya]

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I'll be the dissenter - I just did the full M road test.
I wasn't going to get any further insurance breaks so I went my own way.

Caveats

• more mature rider
• I THINK I had enough self-awareness, AND forsight, to avoid developing any egregious bad habits before taking the test (I won't admit to any that have developed since)
• again, I THINK I had enough self-awareness to be conscious of what they were looking for (really, head-on-a-swivel can't be overemphasized)
• Researched the hell out of the test - I even brought medical tape so I could tape their sh***y earpiece in (and suggested to a few other test takers to do the same and gave them my tape)

They still dinged me for "mistakes" (i.e. not accelerating to highway speed before merging, despite merging with slow bumper to bumper traffic), so be philosophical about what it is you're hoping to gain - getting the license.

I'm with @Wind Shear on this. I too did the M on my own last May, in Scarborough no less. I too would like to think I'm a mature rider, but that's up for debate. I was in my 5th year of riding at that point with ~20k km under my belt in all conditions (except snow). I didn't feel the M2X course have much to offer in terms of skill development when I researched other people's experience of the course, mostly it was to help them pass the course. I watched a couple of YT videos about the M2x test, and passed easily. I don't think I exceeded 40km/h on the highway portion as the DVP was gridlocked as usual, but that's an issue/difficulty of its own.

I do concur that advanced riding courses have their merits and I'll try to partake it one in the near future.

 

[adri]

Insurance wants at least one course. If you've already done one, a second doesn't get you a further break. I suspect there is a reasonable argument that recency should also be included (eg. course discount for five years) but I haven't heard of any insurer doing that.

I don't think you get the insurance break from having the second additional course. I think you get the insurance break from having a full class license.

My insurance company at the time, I think it was TD, told me that my rates would go down when I got my full license, so I was in a hurry... I had only just graduated from being a broke student and entered the workforce, so anything that was going to save me money I was all about. That was about 15 years ago though. OP should just ask his insurance company for a quote on the same bike with an M2 vs if he had a full M, and report on what the savings are so others can now if this still makes a difference, and how much of a difference it makes.

 

[Evoex]

I don't think you get the insurance break from having the second additional course. I think you get the insurance break from having a full class license.

My insurance company at the time, I think it was TD, told me that my rates would go down when I got my full license, so I was in a hurry... I had only just graduated from being a broke student and entered the workforce, so anything that was going to save me money I was all about. That was about 15 years ago though. OP should just ask his insurance company for a quote on the same bike with an M2 vs if he had a full M, and report on what the savings are so others can now if this still makes a difference, and how much of a difference it makes.

Slim to none on savings.

As GG said, you only get the insurance break once.

Allowed to drink and ride now, lower my insurance? Har har!

The only date that matters is the date you got your M2. Around the 5 year experience mark with a clean record you'll qualify for most discounts with insurers.

 

[adri]

Slim to none on savings.

Even if you're under 25 years old?

 

[Jay Alexander]

Most insurers care about you doing your M1 exit course if you're a new rider. Many won't even touch a newer rider without this course. I am not aware of any insurer in Ontario that gives a discount for the M2 exit.

Even if you're under 25 years old?

This is a myth in Ontario. Turning 25 years old isn't a magic number when insurance drops dramatically. It's more gradual.

Like @Evoex said above, what matters more is years licensed, as well as how long you've owned a motorcycle. Having an M-class license for over 5 years, and being 30+ years old will be a good point in your riding career when it won't be a fortune any more for insurance.

My insurance company at the time, I think it was TD, told me that my rates would go down when I got my full license, so I was in a hurry

If this was TD, they were wrong. I'm with TD, and it makes zero difference in premium - going from M2 to full M.

 

[Renboy]

This is a myth in Ontario. Turning 25 years old isn't a magic number when insurance drops dramatically. It's more gradual.

Can't say for bikes, but for cars that is/was completely untrue. When I was 24 my car insurance was $161/month. As soon as I turned 25 it dropped to $59/month. And I mean it was the payment following my birthday. Not a little while later, right after I turned 25.

 

[Jay Alexander]

Can't say for bikes, but for cars that is/was completely untrue. When I was 24 my car insurance was $161/month. As soon as I turned 25 it dropped to $59/month. And I mean it was the payment following my birthday. Not a little while later, right after I turned 25.

There can be a lot going on here. Claims no longer being rated (after 6 year mark), convictions/suspensions/cancellations for non-payments falling off after 3 years, address change, and more.

But a rate won't even change until renewal of a new term, unless the rated risk changes, like moving or adding/removing a driver, for example. A new DPR (motor vehicle report) wouldn't be ordered mid-term, either - these are done on renewals. There's honestly too many variables. Without knowing specific details, I can't comment.

I will say however that drawing broad conclusions based on one point of anecdotal experience is not evidence. Your term may have renewed, and I'm assuming other factors were at play. Some insurers rate better for 25+ drivers, but I'd be surprised if the same insurer dropped their rate by that amount when controlling for all other variables. Maybe your broker switched your insurer that rated risk differently for that age group.

 

[adri]

Most insurers care about you doing your M1 exit course if you're a new rider. Many won't even touch a newer rider without this course. I am not aware of any insurer in Ontario that gives a discount for the M2 exit.


This is a myth in Ontario. Turning 25 years old isn't a magic number when insurance drops dramatically. It's more gradual.

Like @Evoex said above, what matters more is years licensed, as well as how long you've owned a motorcycle. Having an M-class license for over 5 years, and being 30+ years old will be a good point in your riding career when it won't be a fortune any more for insurance.


If this was TD, they were wrong. I'm with TD, and it makes zero difference in premium - going from M2 to full M.

Interesting. Guess things may have changed in the...

*cringe*

10 years since before I was 25 :|

 

[Jay Alexander]

Interesting. Guess things may have changed in the...

*cringe*

10 years since before I was 25 :|

One important thing I forgot to mention is that if it was a hard rule for all insurers, it would be written in the OAP 1.

 

[shanekingsley]

By the time my 5yrs on the M2 were up, I had ridden around 150k. My bro had to get his full M, but had barely ridden in the 5yrs, so we both did the course together. I could have easily taken the Ministry test and passed no problem, but I found it was good to take the course, because there were definitely some minor bad habits I had picked up over the years.

I scored perfect on the M test and the instructor told me that I should be a moto instructor. So a couple years later I was remembering his advice and did just that. Ended up teaching for 6 years, which was a really rewarding experience and something I would love to go back to when I have more time. So taking that course spurred on other opportunities, which I'll always be thankful for and likely not possible if I took the Ministry test.

The cost was not that much and I feel there's always value in having someone who is a skilled and competent rider watch me, specifically for the purpose of critiquing my riding.

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