I have been cut off 3 times, road hours 5!

[Paul1000RR]

Forum Sponsor

I've only been riding for a few months, mostly downtown, and I've had a problem with this too. I find the worst is in this scenario:

Without riding in the centre of the lane, it's hard to keep cars from passing on the left when there is even the slightest gap in oncoming traffic. It's happened to me a few times, the worst of which was at a yellow light.

Pulling up to the intersection, light changed from green to yellow. I had lots of time to stop, so I did. Apparently the guy behind me was in a rush so he passed me on the left, without leaving my lane, and crossed the intersection as the light went red and I was pulling up to the stop line.

Needless to say people that are in that much of a rush usually don't end up getting very far even when driving like a total *******. 30 seconds later the light went green, I easily caught up to him 50 metres down the road and told him how much of an ******* he was for risking my life just to get 3 car lengths ahead of where he was. He just sat in the drivers seat, looking straight ahead and mumbling to himself, too afraid to make eye contact.

Felt like beating the **** out of his car - smashing tail lights and breaking mirrors off.

In this situation i'd move more to the center

 

[KarGo]

1) Use proper blocking position
2) Stay out of people's blind spots
3) Don't take it personally
4) Since you are -generally- more agile than them, you can always return the favour (use discretion of course, don't cut off a car when braking is involved)

As you become accustomed to this behaviour, you can tell when someone is about to cut you off WELL before they actually do it.

I love riding.

+1 I was just going to type this.

I don't recall ever being cut off. To add to the above, ride slightly faster than the flow of traffic.

 

[noob_in_mid_age]

In this situation i'd move more to the center

I do the same....In addition,as I am coming to the light, I flash my brake lights and do sway back and forth to avoid hearing the smidsy, anything to make sure the guy behind me is aware of me and my intentions to stop. As a driver is coming closer to a light that is in the process of turning yellow, his/her attention may turn to the light, the timer and/or beyond the intersection thus not seeing a motorcyclist.

Great thread you started OP

 

[Emefef]

In this situation i'd move more to the center

...and that would be a good blocking position. Again, the distinction between lane position and blocking position.
In two open lanes with one car behind, that blue bike would be in a good blocking position. With parked cars in the right lane, I would treat the left one as a single lane, which would also make more sense for that red bike.
There are lots of times during my commute when the blocking position I choose is the right tire track of the right lane on the Gardiner, or dead center. Why? Because at those times the risk is either behind me (moving onto the shoulder to try to see around me), or coming up at a merge point. I've been to the left and had people try to pass on the right, and I've been to right and had people try to pass on the left. When someone looks like they want around, I keep adjusting my lane position to stay directly in front of the driver. Keep in mind this often at speeds below 4kmh. At actual hwy speed if someone wanted around me that badly, I would gtf away from them.
I still think a bunch of us are saying the same thing - "do something effective" and perhaps some of Paul refers to as "the advocates" have been too caught up in the "blocking position" as being a single position all the time.

 

[unL33T]

Do you have loud pipes that will help.

No. It won't. I think you were joking, anyway.

You're assuming that people actually use their mirrors...

Here's the average driver's steps to a lane change in the gta:

1. Decide to change lane
2. Start changing lane
3. Look beside to see whats in that lane
4. 50% of the time if something is beside swerve back, almost over correcting and crashing, the other 50% continue the lane change anyways, the other guy will move
*Signals are optional and rare, most drivers dont use them since it gives away your intended move and if you do turn it on the champ behind you will speed up and not let you in. This is the rule :lmao:

And guess what my blocking lane advocates, when the car realizes you're beside them they would have already hit you or come close to it...

Skip step 4 for most drivers.

1) Use proper blocking position
2) Stay out of people's blind spots
3) Don't take it personally
4) Since you are -generally- more agile than them, you can always return the favour (use discretion of course, don't cut off a car when braking is involved)

As you become accustomed to this behaviour, you can tell when someone is about to cut you off WELL before they actually do it.

I love riding.

It has nothing to do with visibility 90% of the time. People will be actively watching me while they cut me off. They just don't care. If you're lucky they'll give you the finger while they do it.

I ride in the blocking position and never have people try to share my lane. Still get cut off all the time, though.

 

[Emefef]

I've only been riding for a few months, mostly downtown, and I've had a problem with this too. I find the worst is in this scenario:

Without riding in the centre of the lane, it's hard to keep cars from passing on the left when there is even the slightest gap in oncoming traffic. It's happened to me a few times, the worst of which was at a yellow light.

Pulling up to the intersection, light changed from green to yellow. I had lots of time to stop, so I did. Apparently the guy behind me was in a rush so he passed me on the left, without leaving my lane, and crossed the intersection as the light went red and I was pulling up to the stop line.

Needless to say people that are in that much of a rush usually don't end up getting very far even when driving like a total *******. 30 seconds later the light went green, I easily caught up to him 50 metres down the road and told him how much of an ******* he was for risking my life just to get 3 car lengths ahead of where he was. He just sat in the drivers seat, looking straight ahead and mumbling to himself, too afraid to make eye contact.

Felt like beating the **** out of his car - smashing tail lights and breaking mirrors off.

First off, I wasn't there. I don't know what would have worked and what wouldn't. People ask me questions like this all the time and that reject the responses because "that wouldn't have helped." Maybe not. They're just things to consider.

1. If you were so far over to the right that he didn't even have to leave his lane to pass you, that's not a blocking position - it's just riding on the right side of the lane. This is what I mean about lane position vs blocking position. If you had been more to left (closer to center, but perhaps not dead center) or even slightly left of center, it would have made that manoeuvre more difficult for him
2. Part of being able to stop safely is being confident that the traffic behind you isn't going to run you over. If you had tapped your brake pedal (only enough to make the light come on, not enough to slow down), you would have a perfect defence for proceeding through the light because you could argue you were proceeding with caution - while sending a clear signal to the traffic behind you.
The combination of the more effective blocking position and the flash of the brakelight MAY have made the driver behind you think a little more before pulling around you, especially if it would have put him over the yellow line.
Like I said, I wasn't there. Proper blocking position is a way of communicating, and discouraging people from taking your space. BUT - stupid never sleeps. If someone wants to go around you, they will so always be prepared to get out of the way.

 

[unL33T]

some places may call it getting cut-off, but here in the t.dot, thats switching lanes unfortunately lol.

For most people, yep.

 

[GDM]

I find that diagram rather disturbing, it looks like the bikes are riding on the right side of the lane next to a line of parked cars. If anyone pops out from between the cars, you've got no chance of avoiding the hit. In this case, I would be left of centre giving me a better sight line to the right. Think of pedestrians as deer, ready to jump stupidly into your path - but with slightly less fur.

 

[Buddhacide]

We also have to accept that "merging into" and "cutting off" are very, very subjective. There are people that overreact simply because someone moved in front of them - someone that actually activated the signal, looked, and moved over before the rider even recognized their intentions.

Its not subjective. When someone forces themselves into a spot against your right of way you have been cut off. The rules are quite clear. It doesnt matter whether they signal or not, start to merge etc... If they compromise your right of way you have been cut off.

And blocking position is not an abstract idea, as has been mentioned a few times here. Its a philosophy that can literally put you in harm's way if you believe all you are doing is signalling to others that you are in the lane. The danger is not from people thinking they can squeeze into your lane just because your not in the proper tire track. The danger is that you can be putting yourself that much closer to the path of an absent minded cager that doesnt care to look in the first place.

Sorry if this comes off as argumentative but new riders are fed a bunch of balogne that can get them killed imo.

And to the OP. Get used to it, eventually you develop skills to deal with it better. But like the other poster said drive like everyone is trying to kill you, because in Toronto they might as well be.

 

[pucci14]

Get out of those blind spots

Sent from my SGH-I317M using Tapatalk 2

 

[Kri$han]

I find that diagram rather disturbing, it looks like the bikes are riding on the right side of the lane next to a line of parked cars. If anyone pops out from between the cars, you've got no chance of avoiding the hit. In this case, I would be left of centre giving me a better sight line to the right. Think of pedestrians as deer, ready to jump stupidly into your path - but with slightly less fur.

Perhaps if it were a line of trucks, I'd agree with you. But a pedestrian is pretty easy to spot between parked cars. For any of you that went to Young Driver's, you can recall the very effective method of "ground viewing": it's a quick ground scan for feet or other things not common to cars.

The position of the bikes in that diagram is correct, based on the info presented.

It has nothing to do with visibility 90% of the time. People will be actively watching me while they cut me off. They just don't care. If you're lucky they'll give you the finger while they do it.

That's also true: I really can't give any helpful tips for dealing with ********: we all react to them differently.

Its not subjective. When someone forces themselves into a spot against your right of way you have been cut off. The rules are quite clear. It doesnt matter whether they signal or not, start to merge etc... If they compromise your right of way you have been cut off.

I think you've missed the point here: it IS subjective, in that two drivers who experience the exact same "lane change/cut off" situation can react completely differently.

I changed lanes in front of a guy yesterday (whilst in my car), who honked and decided it was appropriate to pass me and give me the finger. I was about 3 car-lengths ahead of him BUT what I didn't know was that homie wanted to aggressively accelerate with the gap in traffic that I also wished to exploit

Interacting with other drivers on the road can be an interesting psychological experience...

 

[Ugur Dinch]

Add me to the blocking position crew. As has been mentioned, it's not to physically block someone, but to make yourself more visible.

I commute by bike every day it's not raining in the summer. Have for about six years now, three of which were to and from downtown. Plus some touring, average about 20k km a year by bike. Somehow, I have zero issues with cars cutting me off.

LOL that's cuz ppl can hear your bike from a mile =)

 

[Emefef]

Its not subjective. When someone forces themselves into a spot against your right of way you have been cut off. The rules are quite clear. It doesnt matter whether they signal or not, start to merge etc... If they compromise your right of way you have been cut off.

By subjective, I meant that some people have a much lower tolerance, or much greater reaction, to someone moving in front of them. It could be that they didn't see it coming, it could be that the movement was sudden, it could be that the vehicle left less space than they were comfortable with. People use the term "cut off" differently. To be consistent with your terms - people believe their right of way has been compromised at different distances.
I don't think I've stated enough, since you're responding to my post that blocking position is NOT simply riding in a tire track. It is an active, dynamic, and fluid positioning of the bike to balance what are sometimes conflicting priorities. At any given time, one objective may be compromised (visibility) to more effectively manage another (space). If not, it's not a blocking position, it's just where you happen to be.
If you're not in the cager's line of sight, you aren't in a blocking position.

 

[suprPHREAK]

Blocking position makes you more visible to the driver beside you.

Only if the driver bothers to look.

 

[spray____]

First off, I wasn't there. I don't know what would have worked and what wouldn't. People ask me questions like this all the time and that reject the responses because "that wouldn't have helped." Maybe not. They're just things to consider.

1. If you were so far over to the right that he didn't even have to leave his lane to pass you, that's not a blocking position - it's just riding on the right side of the lane. This is what I mean about lane position vs blocking position. If you had been more to left (closer to center, but perhaps not dead center) or even slightly left of center, it would have made that manoeuvre more difficult for him
2. Part of being able to stop safely is being confident that the traffic behind you isn't going to run you over. If you had tapped your brake pedal (only enough to make the light come on, not enough to slow down), you would have a perfect defence for proceeding through the light because you could argue you were proceeding with caution - while sending a clear signal to the traffic behind you.
The combination of the more effective blocking position and the flash of the brakelight MAY have made the driver behind you think a little more before pulling around you, especially if it would have put him over the yellow line.
Like I said, I wasn't there. Proper blocking position is a way of communicating, and discouraging people from taking your space. BUT - stupid never sleeps. If someone wants to go around you, they will so always be prepared to get out of the way.

Appreciate your POV

1. This is something I've been trying to find a happy medium with. I feel a lot more comfortable near the edge of the lane when stopping in traffic because I feel like there's an easier escape and I'm less in the way if someone behind me isn't stopping. Staying to the middle of the lane to block, the pros and cons are the same thing:
   1. The Good - you're in the way so it's hard for people to go through without hitting you
   2. The Bad - you're in the way so it's hard for people to go through without hitting you
2. That's a good technique, I think I'll try to practice that in the future. I'd never really thought about it, but you're right. A brake light on isn't a promise that I'm going to stop, it just gets everyone behind me ready for me to stop. In this specific situation, the guy was just a dick. I could have twisted the gas and made it through the yellow, he would have been really pushing it to follow me. We both had tonnes of time to stop, he just thought risking my life was worth not having to stop one more time on the way home.

 

[sid_for_speed]

believe it from a guy driving a cage
(who's about to get a new black bike of all the colors...)

Cagers try their best to look out for bikes...no one wants to go to jail...but sometimes one zips by me at mach2....I wouldn't even have noticed....

but staying in proper blocking position helps...

 

[the_falcon]

Last i checked, they weren't sure if he lost control and hit the car or vice versa. sad but speculation at best.

i started a thread with a few more extreme examples, sucks.

Don't drvie with cars around, look for gaps between packs of trafic, speed up or slow down to find them.

It doesn't matter whose right when you ride, you're *** is the one sliding across hot pavement. stay safe.

 

[ross]

I did see how the fellow rider reminded to the cager about checking the blind spots, ... with a steel toe boots. worked well.

 

[Sushii]

Only if the driver bothers to look.

That kind of reasoning applies to everything. What exactly is your point?

 

[klr_guy]

OP - take up knitting - it's much safer

Forum Sponsor