How much do you pay for insurance?

[NFP Moto]

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How is that a good deal? I pay $375/ year for a 09 gsxr 750. Not in ontario.

.... "not in Ontario". thats like saying "how is that a good deal? I paid 20 cents a litre for gas in 1988". Yeah Ontario insurance is the most expensive in Canada due to the government mandatory Accident Benefits. No matter where you live in Canada, people in Florida will look at your $375 rate and think thats expensive. But its not apples to apples, in most states insurance mostly covers dings to the bike. You get hurt? better call William Mattar cuz its a culture of suing each other. The insurance down there is just a piece of pink paper. In Canada insurance routinely pays out $85,000 bodily injury claims

 

[Soulcatcher668]

.... "not in Ontario". thats like saying "how is that a good deal? I paid 20 cents a litre for gas in 1988". Yeah Ontario insurance is the most expensive in Canada due to the government mandatory Accident Benefits. No matter where you live in Canada, people in Florida will look at your $375 rate and think thats expensive. But its not apples to apples, in most states insurance mostly covers dings to the bike. You get hurt? better call William Mattar cuz its a culture of suing each other. The insurance down there is just a piece of pink paper. In Canada insurance routinely pays out $85,000 bodily injury claims

Agreed to a point.
I believe a majority of the distrust comes from the fact that there is no rhyme or reason to the rates.
Multi thousands of dollars difference from company to company reeks of a system out to milk the buyers.
I could understand maybe a 10 percent swing dependent on how companies assess risk, but 300 percent swings?
If the industry wants to be seen as anything other than a mandatory and predatory entity, there needs to be some transparency.

*edited for spelling

 

[gsxr guy]

.... "not in Ontario". thats like saying "how is that a good deal? I paid 20 cents a litre for gas in 1988". Yeah Ontario insurance is the most expensive in Canada due to the government mandatory Accident Benefits. No matter where you live in Canada, people in Florida will look at your $375 rate and think thats expensive. But its not apples to apples, in most states insurance mostly covers dings to the bike. You get hurt? better call William Mattar cuz its a culture of suing each other. The insurance down there is just a piece of pink paper. In Canada insurance routinely pays out $85,000 bodily injury claims

I just moved out of ontario. So how is comparing insurance in one province to another not comparing apples to apples. Still the same country.

 

[gsxr guy]

if you knew anything about ontario...

Paid ontario insurance for the last 35 years. That was enough.

 

[gsxr guy]

Unfortunately for those of us in Ontario anything under $1k/yr is good.


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In 2015 I was paying $675/ year on the same bike in ontario by 2020 it was $1100 same bike and I'm 5 years older. Its a total scam. That was enough. So I moved, and all my other insurance house, car and truck stayed similar but not the gsxr.

 

[Mad Mike]

Motorcycle policies are cheaper for physical damages, PL/PD but the AB is far, far higher per incident. Modern cars are pretty safe... motorcycles haven't really improved... ever.

I pay about the same for a car and a van insurance (2 policies) as one non-sport bike policy, where AB is 68% of the policy. The AB on the car/van is 42%.

Actually not. Personal injury claims are higher per incident, about double, so if you crash in a car the cost to the insurer is lower than if you crash on a bike.

But car crashes cost more overall. Cars close the gap in several areas. First, the mortality rate on bikes is very high, that limits liability considerably. Second is AB in bike crashes are mostly single claims, passenger and pedestrian benefits are rare. Finally, bikes simply don’t travel the same miles as cars, and have far fewer claims per year.

 

[Mad Mike]

.... "not in Ontario". thats like saying "how is that a good deal? I paid 20 cents a litre for gas in 1988". Yeah Ontario insurance is the most expensive in Canada due to the government mandatory Accident Benefits. No matter where you live in Canada, people in Florida will look at your $375 rate and think thats expensive. But its not apples to apples, in most states insurance mostly covers dings to the bike. You get hurt? better call William Mattar cuz its a culture of suing each other. The insurance down there is just a piece of pink paper. In Canada insurance routinely pays out $85,000 bodily injury claims

That’s not all fair. Insurance companies bilk Ontarians on many fronts. FSCO does not prohibit umbrella liability, the IBC does. What that means is a driver with 10 vehicles buys the coverage 10 times, that doesn’t happen in FL.

Insurers feel that if you can afford to own 2 vehicles, you can pay twice for redundant coverage.

 

[Evoex]

Paid ontario insurance for the last 35 years. That was enough.

1. So then you know we get shafted for bikes here where other provinces don't.
2. You know certain areas of the GTA have not just highest insurance rates in the country but in the world.
3. You know $1000/yr on a super sport these days even with experience/age and good location is becoming the norm, many places are black listing it outright

I'm puzzled on why you think it's not a good deal in Ontario.

 

[gsxr guy]

Because in the last ten years ins. on the same bike doubled. With no claims, I call scam.

 

[SVeezy]

We’re all calling scam. But presently we have no choice but to deal with that scam so for now $1k/m on a sport bike in Ontario is a “good” rate

Edit: And yes, my rates go up every year it seems despite a clean record. I’m as annoyed as everyone else.


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[Katatonic]

That’s not all fair. Insurance companies bilk Ontarians on many fronts. FSCO does not prohibit umbrella liability, the IBC does. What that means is a driver with 10 vehicles buys the coverage 10 times, that doesn’t happen in FL.

Insurers feel that if you can afford to own 2 vehicles, you can pay twice for redundant coverage.

This.
I have 3 cars and 2 bikes with 2 licensed drivers in the house, I am the only one with a bike license.
We are paying 5 x full liability coverage, 5 x personal injury coverage, 5 x accident benefits.
So if something happens, do I get 5 times the coverage? Nope. That’s why it’s a scam. They are essentially double-billing, or in my case quintuple-billing.
Having umbrella liability, injury and benefits and then paying individually for fire/theft on each vehicle would be the fair way of dealing with insurance.
And if this was the case, I would definitely get a couple more bikes and at least one more summer car. In the end, the insurance company would likely be making about the same money off me and I would have the vehicles I want and be happier. Win/win.
Worried about me loaning my vehicles out and having them all driven/ridden at the same time (which is the current bs argument), simple - I’ll sign a document that says I won’t do that which will absolve the insurance company of any risk.

 

[Mad Mike]

This.
I have 3 cars and 2 bikes with 2 licensed drivers in the house, I am the only one with a bike license.
We are paying 5 x full liability coverage, 5 x personal injury coverage, 5 x accident benefits.
So if something happens, do I get 5 times the coverage? Nope. That’s why it’s a scam. They are essentially double-billing, or in my case quintuple-billing.
Having umbrella liability, injury and benefits and then paying individually for fire/theft on each vehicle would be the fair way of dealing with insurance.
And if this was the case, I would definitely get a couple more bikes and at least one more summer car. In the end, the insurance company would likely be making about the same money off me and I would have the vehicles I want and be happier. Win/win.
Worried about me loaning my vehicles out and having them all driven/ridden at the same time (which is the current bs argument), simple - I’ll sign a document that says I won’t do that which will absolve the insurance company of any risk.

Insurers are free to do this, they agree among themselves not to. They also agree to keep new entrants under control so they don’t disintermediate their cozy business model.

 

[PrivatePilot]

I'm somewhere around $400 year on my Vulcan 1700 +/- $50, I forget exactly. Bundled with everything else in the house, yeah, but I'm pretty happy with the rate...no complaints.

 

[Trials]

.... For motocross /off-road bikes its almost the opposite as the smaller they are the less companies can insure it (long story) . Less rate options to compare against is the reason why a Yamaha WR250R might end up having a higher rate (for the ROAD) or around the same as a bigger Kawasaki KLR650.

DM me if you want more info on this.... from an actual RIDER'S perspective

Motocross / off road Yamaha WR250R seriously! you guys don't sell personal motocross insurance, no way.
That's a 300 pound street bike with dirt bike styling, it would be a disaster on a motocross track or off road.

 

[Mad Mike]

I'm somewhere around $400 year on my Vulcan 1700 +/- $50, I forget exactly. Bundled with everything else in the house, yeah, but I'm pretty happy with the rate...no complaints.

That's pretty good for Vulcan 1700. Insurance on my 125 enduro went up this year by 33% to $30/mo, the Vstrom held at $60/mo, FJR too at $80. I can't bundle as my cars are with CAA and they dont do motorcycles.

 

[D-J]

Looks like the cost to ride is at an all-time high.

Yes, without question. This discussion reminds me of those GreenShield TV spots with the bald guy in the sports jacket repeating to nauseating effect "The cost of prescription drugs keeps going up"; "the cost of dental care, up", "the cost of vision care, up"... let's add to that "the cost of riding a motorcycle in Ontario keeps going up".

I believe a majority of the distrust comes from the fact that there is no rhyme or reason to the rates.

Precisely. Every year shopping around comparing rates it's always shocking to find such a wide range of quotes (+/- $2-3,000) for essentially the same coverage, same bike, same personal situation.

Engine size is definitely a factor when it comes to insurance but not as much as experience, age, and to a lesser extent location.

I disagree. After 7 years of riding/continuous insurance coverage I now believe the 2 biggest variables determining rates are a rider's given postal code and the engine size/class of motorcycle. Every year my riding experience goes up along with my age — spotless record, no claims no tickets, and every year my rates keep creeping up and up. Explain the rationale.

...all the insurance companies use a computerized system to come up with rates, so they are pre set. ...every agent I have ever spoken with says either "that is what the system came up with" or "I can't adjust it because of the system"

Yes, that's exactly what I found speaking with numerous insurance people the past few weeks. In each case, on the phone with an agent or broker, the system would invariably spit out a quote and the only way to manipulate the price would be to either drop or add optional coverages or change the deductable. One agent actually said to me, "why don't you just get a cruiser?" to help reduce the cost. Brilliant! Thank you for that advice.

I have a clean record (no tickets or claims) and I'm past the magic 6 for years of riding and continuous insurance.

I too have a clean record and I'm past 6 years of riding and continuous insurance. This year, I thought I was going to get a bit of a break. Nope. Every quote obtained was marginally or in some cases substantially higher than 2020 quotes — same bike, same coverage, same everything. The notion the COVID lockdowns-fewer-cars-on-the-road resulting in fewer claims and payouts resulting in lower premiums is complete nonsense.

Motorcycles are far less costly to underwrite than cars, and for the most part riders pay less for their motorcycles than their car policies. But they still pay too much.

No, at least not in my case. My wife and I pay $1600 combined for 2 vehicles (SUV and sedan) with 2M liability, collision and comprehensive.
Whereas a '16 ZX-10R is costing me $1562/yr (albeit $38 less) with full coverage, 1M liability, collision and comprehensive, $500 deductable.

Nothing makes sense...

Exactly. If I were to trade my ZX-10R in for a 1290 Super Duke R, same coverage, my premium would apparently go down to $800-ish/yr. Try to understand the logic here. I don't.

 

[NFP Moto]

Yes, without question. This discussion reminds me of those GreenShield TV spots with the bald guy in the sports jacket repeating to nauseating effect "The cost of prescription drugs keeps going up"; "the cost of dental care, up", "the cost of vision care, up"... let's add to that "the cost of riding a motorcycle in Ontario keeps going up".


Precisely. Every year shopping around comparing rates it's always shocking to find such a wide range of quotes (+/- $2-3,000) for essentially the same coverage, same bike, same personal situation.


I disagree. After 7 years of riding/continuous insurance coverage I now believe the 2 biggest variables determining rates are a rider's given postal code and the engine size/class of motorcycle. Every year my riding experience goes up along with my age — spotless record, no claims no tickets, and every year my rates keep creeping up and up. Explain the rationale.


Yes, that's exactly what I found speaking with numerous insurance people the past few weeks. In each case, on the phone with an agent or broker, the system would invariably spit out a quote and the only way to manipulate the price would be to either drop or add optional coverages or change the deductable. One agent actually said to me, "why don't you just get a cruiser?" to help reduce the cost. Brilliant! Thank you for that advice.


I too have a clean record and I'm past 6 years of riding and continuous insurance. This year, I thought I was going to get a bit of a break. Nope. Every quote obtained was marginally or in some cases substantially higher than 2020 quotes — same bike, same coverage, same everything. The notion the COVID lockdowns-fewer-cars-on-the-road resulting in fewer claims and payouts resulting in lower premiums is complete nonsense.


No, at least not in my case. My wife and I pay $1600 combined for 2 vehicles (SUV and sedan) with 2M liability, collision and comprehensive.
Whereas a '16 ZX-10R is costing me $1562/yr (albeit $38 less) with full coverage, 1M liability, collision and comprehensive, $500 deductable.


Exactly. If I were to trade my ZX-10R in for a 1290 Super Duke R, same coverage, my premium would apparently go down to $800-ish/yr. Try to understand the logic here. I don't.

Simple. KTM SuperDuke 1290 is only blacklisted by certain insurance companies (not all), the Kawasaki Ninja ZX-10R is blacklisted across the board by every single company. For example, I ride a BMW S1000R but the S1000RR (blacklisted - though essentially the same bike, both stupid fast) would be about $500 more on insurance.... for me anyways.

 

[Evoex]

Exactly. If I were to trade my ZX-10R in for a 1290 Super Duke R, same coverage, my premium would apparently go down to $800-ish/yr. Try to understand the logic here. I don't.

Easy, everyone's crashing far more ZX10Rs into guard rails then SDR these days, so you pay more.

 

[Lightcycle]

Easy, everyone's crashing far more ZX10Rs into guard rails then SDR these days, so you pay more.

Also, you bought a bike called a "Ninja"...

What are you? Five?

 

[bigpoppa]

Also, you bought a bike called a "Ninja"...

What are you? Five?

they need to release a new line called samurai

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