How is this ok?

Slick_Steveo said:
okay ..make fun of the noob....I read this subforum alot ...and have learned quite a bit....thanks for answering my question
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LOL... sorry Steve, I know there is some good info here, I just hope you're getting the right stuff.
 
Interesting.

On one hand, I appreciate the warnings provided by the more experienced riders here about the dangers. I also agree that the track should do the best it can to mitigate risks including letting the participants know what they are. Not using the hay-bails that are already on the premisis is pretty dumb.

On the other hand, I do respect that ultimately, it's a person's decision to partake, knowing all the risks.

Where the difficulty lies is in the awareness of all the risks. There are some (many?) people that would not realize what dangers exist, and what their magnitudes can be without being told, or worse, experiencing them firsthand. (I don't think I'd want to kiss that wall at speed)
 
This should be the official pic for GTAM.......

FR.jpg
 
I will be helping GWB tackdays at TMP this year. Our tech requirements will remain high for the safety of all riders. If the bags are on Site I will do everything in my power to get them to the wall even if I have to get 10 people to drag them over there. Unfortunatly we can not help anyone out on the dates that are run by TMP themselves.

If you have any questions about our tackdays feel free to PM me and I will either get you answers or get you in contact with someone who can
 
To everyone concerned about the wall at TMP...

28968629.jpg


A great big hammer... like a wrecking ball...
 
YellowDuck said:
Given the video someone posted earlier in the thread, I am wondering if the bales were removed at the request of a group using the track for a car lapping day. It seems possibly non-trivial to move those things back and forth if that is indeed what is going on here. I'm not making excuses for anyone, just trying to speculate as to why it even happened.

It sure would be nice to have some actual information about this incident, rather than just a pile of ranting. Personally, if signing up for a TMP track day meant spending 30 minutes on the bale brigade in the morning, I'd be just fine with that. But moving a super-sack full of bales requires a fork lift or something, no?
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Who cares if they moved them for a car lapping event? They should have been back on for a motorcycle lapping event.

I'm no rocket surgeon, but if they were able to move the bags off the track, they would be able to put them back on the track.
 
What I learned today:
Highly knowledgeable people will spend inordinate amounts of time trying to educate people who clearly have no frame of reference with which to comprehend the information.
Bless you all for trying, but for your own sanity, please focus on those who actually want to learn.
Thank you.
 
Twotons, just take time to re-read post#30 again.

Sometimes a thread like this needs to happen for the benefit of the riders community.
 
Twotons said:
thanks for the comment but pls remember that my point (second pt..bc im not getting into the first) was that riders need to take responsibility for their actions and control their bikes on track days first just like the street to reduce risk ...
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All well and good ...

The problem is that not everyone else does, and they're on the same track you are on at the same time.

You can control your own actions but you can't control the actions of everyone else.

Get punted off the track at an inappropriate spot and you'll be wishing for those softer barriers.

FWIW when I did a track day at Mont-Tremblant, in the absence of vast amounts of air fence, the corner-one concrete-wall situation was dealt with by having a pylon chicane that everyone had to ride through single file to force the speed to be kept down in that area, and the section of track leading up to that was declared to be a permanent waving yellow (no passing). And the other way that it was dealt with, was that you had to sign up and pay for both days. There was no one-day choice. The high cost kept the riff-raff out, and the participants were all experienced track-day riders or roadracers who knew the meaning of following the rules and were respectful of other riders. It was a very good weekend.
 
Twotons said:
thanks for the comment but pls remember that my point (second pt..bc im not getting into the first) was that riders need to take responsibility for their actions and control their bikes on track days first just like the street to reduce risk and then worry about what safety barriers the track will or won't provide them. IMO this will have a greater impact on safety.
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I'm new to this circle j*erk so I'll waste another attempt to enlighten you on the reality of the situation.
I once witnessed Frank Trombino (multi-time pro champion) make it all the way to turn 7 on his first lap of a trackday before he comprehensively balled his bike up and went home. As good as Frank is, I've done it in turn 4 of my first lap (the only thing I'll beat Frank at).
The point is that no amount of rider talent or responsibility or karma or best intentions can prevent the possiblity of a crash at any point after unloading your bike at the track (I've actually seen people crash then too). So minimizing the potential harm from any known hazard is imperative, because you just never know when you're going to test your safety equipment.
You've had the benefit of a couple hundred years of racing and racetrack experience freely given to you, it's time to shut up and listen.
 
Twotons said:
thanks for the comment but pls remember that my point (second pt..bc im not getting into the first) was that riders need to take responsibility for their actions and control their bikes on track days first just like the street to reduce risk and then worry about what safety barriers the track will or won't provide them. IMO this will have a greater impact on safety.

I never once said safety barriers are a bad idea like ppl seem to imply. But if that makes me dense or a moron as other ppl have posted so be it. I'll enjoy reading all their complaints about Tim Horton superstars on the track this year.

I wish you a safe season out on the track this year. Cheers, (my last post on this..flame away.)
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Your logic is fundamentally flawed.

If all tracks were lined with 6' tall Armco guard rail that had sharpened spikes sticking out of it, and the riders were made aware of it, no one would ever crash?

That is silly.

Further, riders have been hurt by that wall in the past. TMP is aware of the risks and TMP acknowledges the risks and TMP has placed straw bales along the wall to help reduce the potential for injury. Key words... TMP acknowledges the risk.. but now the the straw bales have been moved away from the wall for some reason. What happens if a rider crashes there and hits the wall and hurts themselves? Why they crashed doesn't matter, the fact that they crashed there and there was no protection even though there has been in the past is a great recipe for a lawsuit.

Then what happens? No more trackdays at TMP.

So, when you say something like:

Twotons said:
IMO anyone who can step up to the plate and offer track days deserves credit even if they are not perfect from a safety stand point. And it really surprises me that ppl in the "industry" would rant about someone else when they are not willing to step up to the plate to offer those services.
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I think that you lack the experience to be discussing this.
 
caboose56 said:
Why they crashed doesn't matter, the fact that they crashed there and there was no protection even though there has been in the past is a great recipe for a lawsuit.
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Ever read the waiver you sign at TMP? Pretty much says no matter how badly you hurt yourself, you absolve TMP and any other rider on the track of any responsibility whatsoever.

When I read the waiver line by line at GB the person at the gate was flabbergasted. Said I was the first person in her memory to actually read before signing.
 
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