how do I down shift properly | GTAMotorcycle.com

how do I down shift properly

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Sam I am

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Hello, I have my M1 atm...and im trying to learn how to down shift properly.

For example, If i am at 4th gear and I need to go down to 3rd gear, do I slow down to a certain speed. For example, I know when I need to shift up because the bike cannot go any faster in the current gear and I can feel the engine wanting to go to next gear, however, I cannot tell how I should down gear.

I tried to downshift but I feel the bike jerking and the engine revs high when I do it.

thank you for your help
 
Each gear has a range within which it can operate without the engine stalling.

Do you know how to drive a car with a manual transmission?
 
Sam I am said:
Hello, I have my M1 atm...and im trying to learn how to down shift properly.

For example, If i am at 4th gear and I need to go down to 3rd gear, do I slow down to a certain speed. For example, I know when I need to shift up because the bike cannot go any faster in the current gear and I can feel the engine wanting to go to next gear, however, I cannot tell how I should down gear.

I tried to downshift but I feel the bike jerking and the engine revs high when I do it.

thank you for your help
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Mind telling us what bike you have?

To be very basic about the whole thing;

Each gear operates best within a certain rpm, when you pull in the clutch and disconnect the engine from the back wheel the rpms will drop. Now you have the engine and the back wheel spinning at different 'speeds'. By the time you get the gear down and let the clutch out again you`re now trying to connect them at different speeds, this is causing that jerky reaction.

The way to counter this is to 'blip' the throttle before letting the clutch back out. Essentially you are giving the bike a quick burst of throttle to help keep the rpms up during the gear change. This will take practice and a better understanding of how everything works together.

I would suggest pulling the clutch in first and then go off the throttle if you`re not already doing it this way. This will help keep the time span before getting back on the throttle lower and keep the rpms up.

Would you mind sharing with us how you currently shift gears down step by step?
 
Evoex said:
Mind telling us what bike you have?

To be very basic about the whole thing;

Each gear operates best within a certain rpm, when you pull in the clutch and disconnect the engine from the back wheel the rpms will drop. Now you have the engine and the back wheel spinning at different 'speeds'. By the time you get the gear down and let the clutch out again you`re now trying to connect them at different speeds, this is causing that jerky reaction.

The way to counter this is to 'blip' the throttle before letting the clutch back out. Essentially you are giving the bike a quick burst of throttle to help keep the rpms up during the gear change. This will take practice and a better understanding of how everything works together.

I would suggest pulling the clutch in first and then go off the throttle if you`re not already doing it this way. This will help keep the time span before getting back on the throttle lower and keep the rpms up.

Would you mind sharing with us how you currently shift gears down step by step?
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If i am on 4th gear and going 50km/h and I see a stop sign, I hold the clutch and gear down all the way to 1, while at the same time breaking. I let go off the clutch once I am in first gear. I drive a cbr500 , idk how many gears it has but im guessing 6.
 
Sam I am said:
If i am on 4th gear and going 50km/h and I see a stop sign, I hold the clutch and gear down all the way to 1, while at the same time breaking. I let go off the clutch once I am in first gear. I drive a cbr500 , idk how many gears it has but im guessing 6.
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Okay.

When you let out the clutch in 1st I'm assuming you aren't at the stop sign yet so the vehicle is still moving. Jumping down 4-1 and letting the clutch out shortly after is certainly a reason for the bike reacting as you described, it also explains the rpms shooting way up.

Let's talk briefly about gears and rpms;

Each gear (you have 6 of them on the cbr500) has full use of the rpm range which on your bike should be 0-8500 rpm or so. As you have been noticing for shifting up, once you get around 8000 rpm the engine will be pretty loud; it's 'telling you' to change gears. So as you switch from 1st gear to 2nd gear, you will notice the rpms will drop down again after letting the clutch out. Dropping gears has the reverse reaction. Whenever you go down a gear the rpms will drop to 0 but then once the new lower gear engages they will shoot back up to the top of the range.

The bike would have a smoother reaction if you went down 1 gear at a time (letting the clutch out every time), instead of jumping 3 of them.
 
Sam I am said:
If i am on 4th gear and going 50km/h and I see a stop sign, I hold the clutch and gear down all the way to 1, while at the same time breaking. I let go off the clutch once I am in first gear. I drive a cbr500 , idk how many gears it has but im guessing 6.
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Do NOT do this!

Change gear down one at a time, in sequence. From 4th, at a road speed and engine RPM where it is appropriate to downshift, clutch in, quick "blip" of throttle to raise engine RPM to approximately what it's going to be in the next gear down while simultaneously moving the shift lever to the next lower gear, clutch out. All this is simultaneous with braking. Then from 3rd, having slowed down a bit more, and now at a slightly lower road speed and engine RPM where it is appropriate to downshift again, repeat the exact same action to go down to 2nd. The ONLY exception is for downshifting to 1st. On a smaller bike, it may not be appropriate to downshift to 1st until the engine drops to near idling speed in 2nd, and then it's pointless to clutch-out and rev-match. Once you drop to a road speed in 2nd where the engine is just above idling speed, and you are planning to stop, just pull in the clutch and downshift to 1st with the clutch pulled in and leave it pulled in until you stop.

Take a riding course ... they'll get you sorted out.
 
What if I am in 4th gear and I am approaching a traffic light that just turned amber. I dont have a long distance and shifting down one gear at a time and getting off the clutch with each shift would take too long.

In those cases, can I bring the clutch in, shift all the way to 1st as I slowely come to a full stop for the red light?


Also, in a different scenario. If I am in 4th gear and approaching a turn that is say 50 meters ahead, and I know I need to dump speed to make the turn, so I know I am going to down shift to 3rd. What I have been doing is, come off the throttle, bring in the clutch, shift gears down but keep holding the clutch in. coast into the turn and apply the break if neccessary then after the turn, I blip the throttle and start to come off the cluth. Any thing I should do diffrently?

Sorry OP to add to your question, I am in your same boat. M1 and safety course cancelled for now.
 
otwo_91 said:
What if I am in 4th gear and I am approaching a traffic light that just turned amber. I dont have a long distance and shifting down one gear at a time and getting off the clutch with each shift would take too long.

In those cases, can I bring the clutch in, shift all the way to 1st as I slowely come to a full stop for the red light?
Click to expand...

As mentioned above a few times, there's an optimal speed for every gear.

Question for you: If you were in 4th gear slowing to an amber light and you immediately tapped down all the way to 1st while you were still traveling at 60 km/h, and then you heard a car behind you lock it's wheels and start sliding towards you, what would happen if you let the clutch out in 1st?

The answer is, you'd lock the rear wheel and slow to the speed that 1st gear is optimized for - maybe 10-20 km/h. *NOT* what you want when there's a semi barreling towards you from behind at 80 km/h!

If I'm slowing to a stop light, I always want to be in the optimal gear for the current speed. You don't have to let out the clutch between each gear and rev-match from 4th->3rd and then 3rd->2nd, but you do want to be in the right gear in the event that if you need to let the clutch out, you can quickly accelerate out of harm's way without either locking the rear wheel (too low a gear) or bogging the engine (too high a gear).

So, in the use case above, I'd tap down from 4th->3rd until I reach 30 km/h, then tap down again to 2nd until I'm just about stopped, and then tap down to 1st just before I put my foot down at a stop light. At every single point, I'm in the correct gear to release the clutch and take off again should either a vehicle behind threaten to rear-end me, or if the light changes back to green and I need to accelerate again.

Hope this answers your question.
 
otwo_91 said:
What if I am in 4th gear and I am approaching a traffic light that just turned amber. I dont have a long distance and shifting down one gear at a time and getting off the clutch with each shift would take too long.

In those cases, can I bring the clutch in, shift all the way to 1st as I slowely come to a full stop for the red light?
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Yup, when having to come to a full stop in a hurry, particularly in a panic stop, forget about the downshifts.


otwo_91 said:
Also, in a different scenario. If I am in 4th gear and approaching a turn that is say 50 meters ahead, and I know I need to dump speed to make the turn, so I know I am going to down shift to 3rd. What I have been doing is, come off the throttle, bring in the clutch, shift gears down but keep holding the clutch in. coast into the turn and apply the break if neccessary then after the turn, I blip the throttle and start to come off the cluth. Any thing I should do diffrently?
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Coasting (clutch in, closed throttle) should be avoided. Get your braking and downshift(s) done before the turn in point, then proceed through the corner with an even throttle. Now you're in the correct gear for corner exit.
 
nice first bike. folks seem worried about you and your downshifting more than one gear at a time as you stop. its ok what you are doing to learn - others may disagreee, because they are right lol.

try slowing down/gearing down earlier - going from 4th to third earlier will leave you more room/time to brake and downshift to 2nd for an upcoming stop or turn.


practice... is the answer, best luck !
 
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otwo_91 said:
What if I am in 4th gear and I am approaching a traffic light that just turned amber. I dont have a long distance and shifting down one gear at a time and getting off the clutch with each shift would take too long.
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For anything short of an absolute panic emergency-stop ... you have enough time to do the downshifts in sequence, correctly. A traffic signal turning amber is NOT an emergency. If you don't have the time to do the downshifts in sequence, you have time to go through the amber traffic signal.

In a true emergency stop - to avoid a crash, or minimise the severity of an inevitable crash - forget downshifting completely. Get the bike stopped. If that means coming to a stop in 4th gear, deal with it later. Get the bike stopped.

There is no set of circumstances in which downshifting multiple times with the clutch pulled in, and while travelling at a road speed inappropriate for the lowest gear selected, is ever the right way to do it. DON'T do that.
 
otwo_91 said:
Also, in a different scenario. If I am in 4th gear and approaching a turn that is say 50 meters ahead, and I know I need to dump speed to make the turn, so I know I am going to down shift to 3rd. What I have been doing is, come off the throttle, bring in the clutch, shift gears down but keep holding the clutch in. coast into the turn and apply the break if neccessary then after the turn, I blip the throttle and start to come off the cluth. Any thing I should do diffrently?
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The drawback with this approach is that if you accidentally select too low of a gear, or if you don't rev-match well enough to that gear, or if you are too abrupt when releasing the clutch, then the jerkiness of the shift often happens at the wrong moment - while you are leaned over in the middle of the turn. That jerkiness while leaned over can cause a crash (including the really unpleasant highside-type crash). It's safer to get the downshifts done while the bike is upright, before leaning the bike into the turn.
 
When I was starting out

Go down a gear.....
Clutch => Rev the throttle (higher the better ) => no gas => Downshift => Clutch

When I got better and knew the bike, I didn't have to rev bomb the bike downshifting
 
Sam I am said:
Hello, I have my M1 atm...and im trying to learn how to down shift properly.

For example, If i am at 4th gear and I need to go down to 3rd gear, do I slow down to a certain speed. For example, I know when I need to shift up because the bike cannot go any faster in the current gear and I can feel the engine wanting to go to next gear, however, I cannot tell how I should down gear.

I tried to downshift but I feel the bike jerking and the engine revs high when I do it.

thank you for your help
Click to expand...
what you are doing is not wrong, just let go clutch lever slowly and ur gear change will be smooth, the engine rpm will rise because you are in lower gear and it needs to match with the road speed for that gear. there will be wear to the clutch friction disc but with practice and rev match u will eliminate that.

otwo_91 said:
Also, in a different scenario. If I am in 4th gear and approaching a turn that is say 50 meters ahead, and I know I need to dump speed to make the turn, so I know I am going to down shift to 3rd. What I have been doing is, come off the throttle, bring in the clutch, shift gears down but keep holding the clutch in. coast into the turn and apply the break if neccessary then after the turn, I blip the throttle and start to come off the cluth. Any thing I should do diffrently?
Click to expand...

Never initiate the turn in neutral, no downshift, and no upshift (downshift and upshift could be done when you are more exp obviously). get all ur gear change before the turn, check ur blind spot, pedestrian, oncoming traffic. and dont even think about grabbing front brake during ur turn.
 
As mentioned by lots of folks already, the key to smooth downshifts is getting the revs of the engine to match the revs of the rear wheel. This is usually described as a 'blip' of the throttle, which implies that it is done quickly. But there's a lot happening in a very rapid sequence in a turn, which can be overwhelming for a new rider (pulling in the clutch, blipping the throttle, releasing the clutch, all while simultaneously braking).

One exercise that can help while you are learning is to focus on the rev-matching skills in isolation, by downshifting from one gear to another while maintaining a constant speed on the open road or in a big parking lot. In other words, work on your rev-matching skills in a straight line. If you don't have to worry about braking or actually making a turn, you will have lots of time to play specifically with the rev-match skill. In a straight line, you can coast a bit and take as much time as you like to figure out how much throttle/RPM each gear needs. As you get better, it will take less time and will come to resemble a 'blip'.

If the bike lurches and throws you forward when you release the clutch, you need a bit more throttle/RPM. If the bike lurches and accelerates from under you when you release the clutch, you need a little less throttle/RPM.
 
where abouts do you live? One of these nights if the temps are good, I can come down and quickly show you in a parking lot safely. We all start somewhere, and even for me, good downshifts took lots of practice and time.

just be smooth with the clutch, or else you will do a clutch out wheelie, maybe panic, and whisky throttle. The bike you have is great to learn on!
 
ScorpionT16 said:
where abouts do you live? One of these nights if the temps are good, I can come down and quickly show you in a parking lot safely. We all start somewhere, and even for me, good downshifts took lots of practice and time.

just be smooth with the clutch, or else you will do a clutch out wheelie, maybe panic, and whisky throttle. The bike you have is great to learn on!
Click to expand...
He doesn’t have insurance lol.
 
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