Getting Ontario registration for 'custom' motorcycle

[TimDTT]

Trusty old JR Duffy wasn't able to sort anything out, but I do have a lead with another broker who tells me they can get me a policy, has quoted a liability only price and the only thing left would be an appraisal.

I expect the appraisal is mostly to provide the insurance company with a detailed description of the bike from an independent third party, even though I already provided MTO with an affidavit that satisfied them for the registration.

So I guess that's next. Long story short, it seems that insurance is possible, albeit at about a 50% premium over what I would normally expect to pay for liability only on a 650cc bike.

 

[GreyGhost]

Trusty old JR Duffy wasn't able to sort anything out, but I do have a lead with another broker who tells me they can get me a policy, has quoted a liability only price and the only thing left would be an appraisal.

I expect the appraisal is mostly to provide the insurance company with a detailed description of the bike from an independent third party, even though I already provided MTO with an affidavit that satisfied them for the registration.

So I guess that's next. Long story short, it seems that insurance is possible, albeit at about a 50% premium over what I would normally expect to pay for liability only on a 650cc bike.

Interesting. Appraisal includes pictures and often a basic description of construction. It's actually better for you that they want that. Makes it easier in the event of a claim as they have documentation up front of exactly what they are insuring and they have a harder time arguing you didn't disclose something important up front. Are they giving you an agreed value policy or a normal policy where you fight over pricing after a claim starts?

Thanks for keeping us updated on your progress.

 

[TimDTT]

Interesting. Appraisal includes pictures and often a basic description of construction. It's actually better for you that they want that. Makes it easier in the event of a claim as they have documentation up front of exactly what they are insuring and they have a harder time arguing you didn't disclose something important up front. Are they giving you an agreed value policy or a normal policy where you fight over pricing after a claim starts?

Thanks for keeping us updated on your progress.

The premium I was quoted is liability only. Unless it was very little extra I wouldn’t bother with any replacement values. I’ve never filed a claim for a motorcycle and can’t imagine bothering for this bike.

I suppose if someone took me and the bike out I might want something from their insurance but if it’s my fault I don’t really care about insurance paying for damage to the bike.

Again - if it was only an extra $50 a year or something I might consider it. I was conned into paying for comprehensive coverage on my 1975 BMW for a year or so and then discovered if there was a claim, there would be no payout as it had depreciated to $0

 

[GreyGhost]

The premium I was quoted is liability only. Unless it was very little extra I wouldn’t bother with any replacement values. I’ve never filed a claim for a motorcycle and can’t imagine bothering for this bike.

I suppose if someone took me and the bike out I might want something from their insurance but if it’s my fault I don’t really care about insurance paying for damage to the bike.

Again - if it was only an extra $50 a year or something I might consider it. I was conned into paying for comprehensive coverage on my 1975 BMW for a year or so and then discovered if there was a claim, there would be no payout as it had depreciated to $0

Even for comp (which is normally cheap), if some idiot steals or knocks over your bike, without an agreed value policy, insurance company will pay put close to zero. If you have an appraisal for 5k and it disappears, you get some money.

 

[TimDTT]

Even for comp (which is normally cheap), if some idiot steals or knocks over your bike, without an agreed value policy, insurance company will pay put close to zero. If you have an appraisal for 5k and it disappears, you get some money.

I really should get my 1975 R75/6 appraised and get better coverage on it. It's the one bike that is actually worth something and would be a challenge to replace.

My 2015 DRZ400S is nothing special and pretty indestructible, and my wife's 2016 Vespa Primavera is I think actually covered. Ironically I don't think it has been ridden in 2 years.

 

[nobbie48]

s


Last year. HOM is still alive and well.

That would be a breath of fresh air for some. Pre Covid I was at a car show in Lindsay and a guy that got caught in limbo with a custom build was trying to sell his 1930's rod for the price of the paint.

I spoke to another guy that built from a kit and got his registered just before the rules changed. Otherwise it would be a lawn ornament. The MOT screwed up in broad brushing everything that didn't come out of a certified factory. I forget what they were targeting but the custom builds got caught in the bungle.

FWIW a hot rod was defined as any vehicle with a motor that was not available as an option at the time of manufacture. Now???

 

[TimDTT]

Just got off the phone with another broker, and got another quote for just under $1,000 liability only.

Not cheap, but not insane and most importantly actually possible. There are brokers that mention things like 'custom motorcycles' on their websites so those are the people I'm talking to.

One quote must have been from an underwriter that insures the uninsurable, as it was $500 PER MONTH!!! I guess if you're 18, have 10 tickets and want to insure a 'busa, they're your insurance company.

 

[PrivatePilot]

One quote must have been from an underwriter that insures the uninsurable, as it was $500 PER MONTH!!! I guess if you're 18, have 10 tickets and want to insure a 'busa, they're your insurance company.

Sounds like facility.

And that's far from the highest I've ever heard of. Saw a kid who bought a SS as his first bike with only an M1 or something and he posted he got quotes through facility for $1500/month. The law in Ontario says that any licenced driver MUST be able to obtain insurance on any vehicle. It doesn't require that the price be reasonable.

 

[TimDTT]

Sounds like facility.

And that's far from the highest I've ever heard of. Saw a kid who bought a SS as his first bike with only an M1 or something and he posted he got quotes through facility for $1500/month. The law in Ontario says that any licenced driver MUST be able to obtain insurance on any vehicle. It doesn't require that the price be reasonable.

Yep - Facility. I guess some people either have too much money or too little sense.

Long and the short of it is with an unknown 'Make', 'Model' being 'RBT' (rebuilt) and 'Brand - None' it appears you can get insurance for a not outrageous amount of money.

Appraisals are required however, so that's just a small wrinkle and additional cost - probably around $200 one-time.

 

[Jay Alexander]

Interesting that you still need to go through the hassle of needing an appraisal, when they won't offer vehicle coverages. As someone who works in the industry, the bigger companies typically don't care enough for niche products to insure. It makes up so little of the market, that they just won't bind them.

 

[TimDTT]

Interesting that you still need to go through the hassle of needing an appraisal, when they won't offer vehicle coverages. As someone who works in the industry, the bigger companies typically don't care enough for niche products to insure. It makes up so little of the market, that they just won't bind them.

Their explanation was that it helps determine damages should someone else cause an accident, which I can understand and appreciate.

So I guess I'll shoot for a $10,000 appraisal if the only difference it makes is how much I get paid out if someone damages the motorcycle.

 

[hedo2002]

I"ll be interested to see if the policy gets bound, (approved by the underwriter's). I was in the process of converting a school bus to a skoolie. NO problem there are 2 companies that "supposedly" provide these policies here in Ont. The broker provided the quote. they then started with the "hurdles" get us this info, got it, get us this info, got it... Get us this... got it... get that...got it. Give us pics... provided.... about 8 days lapse. they come back...

I had a quote of $246 per year fro RV insurance using the vehicle VIN, etc.

No! policy has not been bound, nor will it be. I asked for an explanation. Was told they are not required to nor will they provide one.

Vehicle had been safetied by a commercial heavy duty mechanic as FIT, and the MTO had issued registration as Unfit, Prior to safety. The vehcile was NO longer registered as a school bus as I had met the Criteria set out BY MTO and was now registered as a MOTORHOME...lol


Their "best" suggestion was to spend over $30,000 on renovations then come back to them and they "would be willing to take a second look at issuing a policy with NO guarantees one will be issued...."
They also said I could "appeal" to the FSCO , (Provincial insurance regulator). I wrote an email to them to request info on doing so. Got a reply about 4 days later with details. It also advised me that due to a "severe backlog" It would be approx 18 - 24 months for them to open a file...LOL

I said, to the agent, so spend $30,000 on a hope and a prayer.... They said yes. If I didn't like that answer, I was free to look elsewhere for coverage... Then the agent said... but the other company has now stopped issuing coverage so we are the ONLY option in Ontario...lmao.

Apparently skoolies that are already insured are grandfathered in but if the policy lapses an new one is unlikely.

 

[GreyGhost]

I"ll be interested to see if the policy gets bound, (approved by the underwriter's). I was in the process of converting a school bus to a skoolie. NO problem there are 2 companies that "supposedly" provide these policies here in Ont. The broker provided the quote. they then started with the "hurdles" get us this info, got it, get us this info, got it... Get us this... got it... get that...got it. Give us pics... provided.... about 8 days lapse. they come back...

I had a quote of $246 per year fro RV insurance using the vehicle VIN, etc.

No! policy has not been bound, nor will it be. I asked for an explanation. Was told they are not required to nor will they provide one.

Vehicle had been safetied by a commercial heavy duty mechanic as FIT, and the MTO had issued registration as Unfit, Prior to safety. The vehcile was NO longer registered as a school bus as I had met the Criteria set out BY MTO and was now registered as a MOTORHOME...lol


Their "best" suggestion was to spend over $30,000 on renovations then come back to them and they "would be willing to take a second look at issuing a policy with NO guarantees one will be issued...."
They also said I could "appeal" to the FSCO , (Provincial insurance regulator). I wrote an email to them to request info on doing so. Got a reply about 4 days later with details. It also advised me that due to a "severe backlog" It would be approx 18 - 24 months for them to open a file...LOL

I said, to the agent, so spend $30,000 on a hope and a prayer.... They said yes. If I didn't like that answer, I was free to look elsewhere for coverage... Then the agent said... but the other company has now stopped issuing coverage so we are the ONLY option in Ontario...lmao.

Apparently skoolies that are already insured are grandfathered in but if the policy lapses an new one is unlikely.

Why do they hate them? I don't see why the risk profile would be far different than a normal motorhome made in a factory of cardboard and hopes and prayers or a conversion van made by "van life" influencers that don't understand planning or construction or electronics or pretty much anything else.

 

[pwd]

So I guess I'll shoot for a $10,000 appraisal if the only difference it makes is how much I get paid out if someone damages the motorcycle.

Have you had any success with insurance? The fact you got it registered seems promising.

 

[TK4]

Once upon a time I was at a shop when buddy showed up with what was supposed to be a 1995 Sportster for a safety.
There wasn't a single original HD part on it, including a hardtail custom frame.
Someone had stamped the VIN from a legit machine into the steering head, I'm assuming hoping that no one would notice.
Needless to say he was chased away.