Generators | GTAMotorcycle.com

Generators

ifiddles

ifiddles

Well-known member
We're thinking of getting a generator for backup in case of a power outage that lasts for longer than just a few hours...planning on putting it in our garage (I'm in a townhouse, so neighbors on both sides attached by garages) and obviously need to vent the exhaust to the outside...we also would like to hard wire it into the breaker panel (or have it's own breaker switch tied into the main panel).

Any idea how much something like this might cost...I can make some calls next week, however thought I'd ask here too.

Also, if anyone has suggestions on brands (hubby likes Honda) that are reliable.

TIA
 
You want the generator running in the garage? I have a strong suspicion that is no bueno.

If you dont require automatic transfer, I would go with a portable generator. Install the plugs, wiring and transfer switch. I would put the plug in the back yard so the generator is reasonably secure. Haul the generator out when required.

If you want automatic transfer, as above with package generator. Should be <$10k.

How often do you need this and what do you need to power? The easiest solution is a portable generator running in the backyard and an extension cord that you swap between appliances every hour or so. A few hours of power a day should keep fridge/freezers cold and the house warm if you find a way to power a gas furnace.

I have an eu2000 that can run everything I need. Obviously not rigged as automatic transfer.
 
You need to have the proper automatic disconnect so that you don't back feed power into the grid when the generator is on.

I would be shocked if it is in anyway legal to have it in the garage even with proper exhaust, at minimum it sounds like a really bad idea.
 
backmarkerducati said:
You need to have the proper automatic disconnect so that you don't back feed power into the grid when the generator is on.

I would be shocked if it is in anyway legal to have it in the garage even with proper exhaust, at minimum it sounds like a really bad idea.
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Automatic transfer switch is not required, but you are correct, if you want to power up the circuits in your house, there must be a physical interlock that ensures the grid is disconnected if the generator is connected.
 
I don't have a back yard...I have a three story townhouse, double garage in the rear, deck on top of garage off second floor kitchen...no basement...heat comes from my hot water tank (the hot water tank sends hot water to the furnace which basically acts as a fan to circulate heat throughout the house)...

We were thinking of putting it on the second floor deck, however, how do you get the power cord from the generator into the house without opening the sliding door and/or windows?
 
ifiddles said:
I don't have a back yard...I have a three story townhouse, double garage in the rear, deck on top of garage off second floor kitchen...no basement...heat comes from my hot water tank (the hot water tank sends hot water to the furnace which basically acts as a fan to circulate heat throughout the house)...

We were thinking of putting it on the second floor deck, however, how do you get the power cord from the generator into the house without opening the sliding door and/or windows?
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For a temporary install, I just leave the door open a crack. Either tape up a flap with poly and a blanket or make a filler stick out of semirigid insulation wrapped in poly or tape to contain fibres.
For permanent install, generator on deck might work (may be a code violation for distance to property line or distance to openable window). Where is electrical panel? Hard wiring requires the sparky get from the generator to the transfer switch/panel with copper. Also need suitable gas supply on deck.
 
You cannot legally install a gasoline powered gen set in your garage, even vented to the outside. And if you run a mini circuit set, not powering the whole house you need the ability to disconnect your house from the grid, backloading a line and lighting up a repair guy 2 kms away is bad form.
If your in a condo townhouse your not putting it on your deck either.

Call your insurance provider, bet they have LOTS to say about gen sets and where/how it has to be installed.

Lot of dead families every year from hillbilly installs
 
Your situation is going to be very tough to get a legal installation. No chance in the garage. Without back or side yard, only the front yard is available. (the roof and even indoor are options for commercial installations, but sound, venting and structural engineering are required) With a large enough front yard, maybe one of the natural gas home units might work.

One of those F150s with the built-in 2.4 kW inverter generator, feeding a Manual Transfer Switch to a sub-panel, might be a sneaky solution.
Otherwise a 3 kW inverter generator stored in the garage and hauled outside as needed. Again feeding a Transfer Switch to a sub-panel.

During the last ice storm I had three places running temporary generators and extension cords. One of those has since installed a permanent Natural Gas Generator. But they have plenty of space.
 
Hmmmm...freehold townhome, 6x10 front yard LOL...second floor deck is separated by vinyl/aluminum fencing (looks like board on board) on both sides (I'm second house in a 6-house row)...wooden deck...kitchen sliding door to one side with about 30" to one fence and 11' to the other fence...

Another reason why hubby wants to move to the country.. ?
 
You could run the feed in a conduit from your deck into the garage, then on to your transfer switch. A 2kw inverter style as small and quiet, it will run your furnace, fridge, a bunch of led lights a computer and tv. No dryer, electric range, heaters, a/c. Toaster, hair dryer, microwave , hot plate are maybe One at a time if your furnace is small.
 
@Mad Mike I like the conduit idea...if we put it on the deck, it would basically be right above the breaker panel...we have the generator booklet from Honda giving average wattage for different household items...I don't think a 2K inverter would run that much...we were looking at either the 7K quiet one ($6,000) or a commercial 10K (but then we'd need to build a box around it for insulation/noise purposes)

Keep it coming boys...hubby likes the responses...giving him lots to think about...

Personally, I would prefer one that could do the whole house...I also prefer hard wired (will need to check with town of Milton next week) as I don't want power cords running all over the house
 
ifiddles said:
@Mad Mike I like the conduit idea...if we put it on the deck, it would basically be right above the breaker panel...we have the generator booklet from Honda giving average wattage for different household items...I don't think a 2K inverter would run that much...we were looking at either the 7K quiet one ($6,000) or a commercial 10K (but then we'd need to build a box around it for insulation/noise purposes)

Keep it coming boys...hubby likes the responses...giving him lots to think about...
Personally, I would prefer one that could do the whole house...I also prefer hard wired (will need to check with town of Milton next week) as I don't want power cords running all over the house
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Get the quiet one. A noose enclosure will cost you a lot of money and space. It's not as simple as an insulated box. You need to get a lot of air in and out of that box constantly while keeping the noise in.

As for 7000w required, is it very important for you to continue life as if the power was still on? 1500 comfortably runs a fridge, furnace , lights , computer etc. Obviously no ac or dryer for me.
 
VFR.CBR said:
Your situation is going to be very tough to get a legal installation. No chance in the garage. Without back or side yard, only the front yard is available. (the roof and even indoor are options for commercial installations, but sound, venting and structural engineering are required) With a large enough front yard, maybe one of the natural gas home units might work.

One of those F150s with the built-in 2.4 kW inverter generator, feeding a Manual Transfer Switch to a sub-panel, might be a sneaky solution.
Otherwise a 3 kW inverter generator stored in the garage and hauled outside as needed. Again feeding a Transfer Switch to a sub-panel.

During the last ice storm I had three places running temporary generators and extension cords. One of those has since installed a permanent Natural Gas Generator. But they have plenty of space.
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I have a Honda 2 that I use on my boat
ifiddles said:
@Mad Mike I like the conduit idea...if we put it on the deck, it would basically be right above the breaker panel...we have the generator booklet from Honda giving average wattage for different household items...I don't think a 2K inverter would run that much...we were looking at either the 7K quiet one ($6,000) or a commercial 10K (but then we'd need to build a box around it for insulation/noise purposes)

Keep it coming boys...hubby likes the responses...giving him lots to think about...

Personally, I would prefer one that could do the whole house...I also prefer hard wired (will need to check with town of Milton next week) as I don't want power cords running all over the house
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if you are going 10kw, maybe think of one of these https://www.lowes.ca/product/home-s...ator-with-automatic-transfer-switch-330697725. My BIL has one, runs on natural gas (like a bbq) so no fuel headaches. Price isn’t bad, 4K including auto transfer switch.
 
If permitted by the condo you could keep a generator in a locked deck box, secured to the deck. Pull it out when needed.

Getting the power inside is the problem as it requires a hole of some sort in a wall which will be a common element.

If a board can be placed into a window gap a slot can be cut into the board to suit the cord. You could then power up plug in devices. I don't know what hard wired devices you will need and they get into the grey zone of permitted connections.

If your needs can be met with the equivalent of one 120 volt circuit all you will need is a collection of extension cords.

Inverter generators are quieter and more fuel efficient than conventional ones but their protective circuits sometimes have trouble with compressive loads such as full size refrigerators.

What devices would you consider needing power and how much power do they need?

Most people try to protect the contents of a fridge or freezer and a few lights.

I'm not sure what power is required for your heating system. Are there circulation pumps, fan coil units etc? I assume the heat is supplied by natural gas.
 
nobbie48 said:
If permitted by the condo you could keep a generator in a locked deck box, secured to the deck. Pull it out when needed.

Getting the power inside is the problem as it requires a hole of some sort in a wall which will be a common element.
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She mentioned she is freehold. No condo bull-****.
 
@Mad Mike Generac is the one I showed hubby...how does your BIL like it?...I read and liked the automatic transfer switch feature...

@nobbie48 Yup, I'm freehold...ideally, I would prefer to be able to operate as if nothing happened...

I do have natural gas for heat, but like I said in a previous post, my hot water tank provides the heat...my furnace acts more like a blower fan on a car's radiator...there's no pilot light, no ignition source on my furnace...it's called a max air furnace...when I bought the house 10 years ago, I was told if I ever didn't have hot water, to call Reliance right away and tell them it's also my heat source
 
What are you looking to run with it? And how long is your power typically off for?

Most people drastically over estimate how much wattage they need. I have a friend who got roped into buying a 20kw generator (noisy as HELL, loud, and bulky) just so he could run his refrigerator, furnace, and his TV and a few lights when the power goes out once a year. A 5000w generator would do all that with power left over.

As someone else touched on, an inverter may be a better bet, and completely eliminates all the issues of noise, keeping fuel on hand for the generator (and keeping said fuel from going stale), gummed up carburetors (so the genny doesn't actually want to start/run when you actually need it), and all the other hassles of another internal combustion engine.

An inverter on the other hand...pop the hood of your vehicle, clamp it onto the batteries, buy a 100' extension cord for $50 from Costco, and run it in the house - close the door on it gently or run it in through a crack in a window. Leave vehicle idling with the doors locked to keep the battery charged and powering the inverter. Depending on what you're looking to run in an emergency you may need as little as 2500w, but even a 5000-7500w inverter will run most of the *essentials*. Your electric dryer or stove/oven? Nope. Essentials such as your fridge/freezer, some lights, and furnace until the power comes back on? Yep. And a car will run at idle for a few L an hour. More than a small generator? Sure....but unless your power goes out for hours every single month it could take a decade to recoup the cost of a generator vs just idling your car to power an inverter.

Save your self the hassle and serious expense of a transfer panel as well. I use the inverter solution with a 3500w unit. When the power goes out I clamp it to the 12V battery on on of our EV's, run the extension cord in through the front door, and plug in a power bar on the end. Essentials get plugged into the power bar for the hour or two until the power comes back on. Easy peasy.
 
ifiddles said:
@Mad Mike Generac is the one I showed hubby...how does your BIL like it?...I read and liked the automatic transfer switch feature...

@nobbie48 Yup, I'm freehold...ideally, I would prefer to be able to operate as if nothing happened...

I do have natural gas for heat, but like I said in a previous post, my hot water tank provides the heat...my furnace acts more like a blower fan on a car's radiator...there's no pilot light, no ignition source on my furnace...it's called a max air furnace...when I bought the house 10 years ago, I was told if I ever didn't have hot water, to call Reliance right away and tell them it's also my heat source
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My BIL is a farmer, he has it plumbed in to natural gas got his barn. If he loses electricity, 80,000 Swiss Chalet dinners go into the dumpster.

he’s never had a problem, it’s only been used a few times. His is connected to his smartphone so he can fire it up at will, he cycles it a few minutes each week, I’m guessing they do better if you run them periodically.
 
Easiest solution is a meter base plug it goes under the hydro meter and you just plug the 240 cord from a 5000 w or larger generator int it when power goes out. Fully legal and you can just run the Genny in the driveway when power is out.

Sent from my moto g(8) plus using Tapatalk
 
Mad Mike said:
My BIL is a farmer, he has it plumbed in to natural gas got his barn. If he loses electricity, 80,000 Swiss Chalet dinners go into the dumpster.

he’s never had a problem, it’s only been used a few times. His is connected to his smartphone so he can fire it up at will, he cycles it a few minutes each week, I’m guessing they do better if you run them periodically.
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They should be regularly brought up to operating temp. As always rtfm but normally something like an hour a month to get it hot, recharge the battery and make sure it will fire up when asked. Program that time smartly. I dealt with a pizza place that set their genny up to exercise at 03:00 so it didn't annoy the customers. The houses adjacent did not agree with that logic.
 
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