Ethanol is bad for "Vintage" engines | GTAMotorcycle.com

Ethanol is bad for "Vintage" engines

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bitzz

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I came across this pic
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That's a guy putting 10% ethanol fuel, into his 1968 Pontiac GTO, (going by the price and the pickup in the background) probably around 1980, from the gas station that only sold 10 and 15% ethanol blended gasoline (it was an american chain of stations).
HOW CAN THIS BE???? We ALL KNOW that ethanol RUINS old carbs and wrecks havoc on seals and hoses.
I guess he crashed and burned soon after...
Ethanol blended fuel has been around since the '30s. How did we survive without Stabil?????
 
I'd peg that truck as a 77 or 78

Anybody know for sure?


Edit: looking at some pics. Might be a 76?
 
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It's a square body, they came out in '72, ended in '87. The only real body difference was the grill and headlights
I dated the pic from the price of gas
 
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bitzz said:
...Ethanol blended fuel has been around since the '30s. How did we survive without Stabil?????
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Just curious about your comment... Do you mean that Stabil poured in ethanol blend fuel will offset the bad effect of ethanol?
I'm asking as I have a few vintage motorcycle here and I always try to fill up the tanks with no ethanol fuel (+ Stabil) but such "pure" fuel becomes harder and harder to find...
Thanks!
 
Even "pure gas" will varnish over time and gum up everything.
But I don't hear anyone talk about that anymore, just that cornahol is the devil and if it wasn't there everything would be fine.
 
Claude said:
Just curious about your comment... Do you mean that Stabil poured in ethanol blend fuel will offset the bad effect of ethanol?
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I was being facetious
The problem with ethanol blended fuels is ethanol is hydroscopic, meaning it absorbs water. Stabil contains soap, which floats to the surface, forms a film that blocks air contact.
The facetious part comes in when you realize water in fuel has ALWAYS been a problem, and the way we have dealt with that issue during storage was to drain the tank and carb... which we've been doing for 100 yrs, and I'm going to continue, as it is cheaper and easier and WORKS A LOT BETTER. A LOT!
Read u/Windshear's post. He knows the truth.
Putting food in your gas tank is plain stupid

IF your vintage bikes don't like ethanol blended fuels, bring 'em over in the spring and we'll fix that for you. USUALLY just go up a jet or two on the main and fiddle with the pilot
 
Wind Shear said:
Even "pure gas" will varnish over time and gum up everything.
But I don't hear anyone talk about that anymore, just that cornahol is the devil and if it wasn't there everything would be fine.
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Ethanol fuels are mostly harmful to fuel systems, not to engines.

Ethanol has light solvent and corrosive properties which over time can be hard on fuel systems. Small amounts of acidic compounds are produced when ethanol meets air, these are particularly hard on the bare metal surfaces of small carbs and older motorcycle tanks.

Ethanol doesn't play nice with some materials used in the soft parts of fuel systems. The solvent action can dissolve, harden and swell floats, seals, fuel lines, and tanks.

American and Japanese products started switching to ethanol-safe soft parts in the early 80s, after which motorcycles and cars were not badly impacted. Europeans moved to ethanol-based fuels later, they also moved to ethanol-tolerant parts later. Most Euro cars and bikes were good by 2000, and bikes by 2010 -- although some were still using ethanol-intolerant parts as late as 2018.

I have a garage full of bikes old and new, I keep the tanks full, add a bit of fuel stabilizer in the fall, and run them all once a month over the winter.

Your mileage on that program may vary, it's worked well for me over the years.
 
bitzz said:
I was being facetious
The problem with ethanol blended fuels is ethanol is hydroscopic, meaning it absorbs water. Stabil contains soap, which floats to the surface, forms a film that blocks air contact.
The facetious part comes in when you realize water in fuel has ALWAYS been a problem, and the way we have dealt with that issue during storage was to drain the tank and carb... which we've been doing for 100 yrs, and I'm going to continue, as it is cheaper and easier and WORKS A LOT BETTER. A LOT!
Read u/Windshear's post. He knows the truth.
Putting food in your gas tank is plain stupid

IF your vintage bikes don't like ethanol blended fuels, bring 'em over in the spring and we'll fix that for you. USUALLY just go up a jet or two on the main and fiddle with the pilot
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Once you drain all the gas do you air it out, add anything or just close it up till spring?
 
bitzz said:
Leave the cap open. Air circulation is key in storage.
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My newest plan for my older bikes is to remove carbs from bike, clean and store in a bin. Drain fuel lines and fuel pump. I had planned on filling the tank, them empty in spring. But if you say to leave it empty is better I might give that a try!
 
Fuzzbuster said:
But if you say to leave it empty is better I might give that a try!
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Any water in the gas sinks to the bottom and rusts the tank, typically at the seam. For long term storage of a tank (like my old Honda tank that languished for over a decade ) I throw in some oil and slop it around. Can't hurt.
 
timtune said:
Any water in the gas sinks to the bottom and rusts the tank, typically at the seam. For long term storage of a tank (like my old Honda tank that languished for over a decade ) I throw in some oil and slop it around. Can't hurt.
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Do you rinse the oil out before putting back into use?
 
Mad Mike said:
Ethanol fuels are mostly harmful to fuel systems, not to engines.
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Sooooo... wouldn't that mean that draining the system would be the preferred storage regimen? When you don't drain the system you're leaving all that bad ethanol stuff sitting on those "soft" parts for an extended time, giving it lots of time to do it's evil doings.
 
Fuzzbuster said:
What is the best method for early model fuel injected bikes?
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I don't do anything, just park it. My philosophy is the same with carbs. If I drain them, the remaining film of fuel is more likely to evaporate and turn into varnish than lots of liquid fuel. It's a lot easier to simply drain your carbs or tank in the spring than it is to scrub the varnish off them.
 
Relax said:
I don't do anything, just park it. My philosophy is the same with carbs. If I drain them, the remaining film of fuel is more likely to evaporate and turn into varnish than lots of liquid fuel. It's a lot easier to simply drain your carbs or tank in the spring than it is to scrub the varnish off them.
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Do you use stabilizer?
 
bitzz said:
Sooooo... wouldn't that mean that draining the system would be the preferred storage regimen? When you don't drain the system you're leaving all that bad ethanol stuff sitting on those "soft" parts for an extended time, giving it lots of time to do it's evil doings.
Click to expand...

I suppose draining over the winter would reduce some corrosion as that happens mostly when fuel evaporates leaving unprotected metal open to moisture and the air.

It wouldn't help all that much for the plastic and rubber parts as they are soaked in fuel for most of the year anyway -- doesn't matter if fuel is still or moving to a rubber o-seal.

As I mentioned earlier, I keep them filled to the brim, run them occasionally over the winter.

One thing I do notice, my premix 2 strokes seem a lot less impacted by ethanol gas, their carbs stay cleaner, fuel lines don't get rock hard, and I don't see the same orange dust in the tanks.
 
Fuzzbuster said:
Do you use stabilizer?
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Nope. 6 months really makes no difference, especially for fuel injection. If the Project Farm video has you worried, just remember that all the ugly problems were with E85 (85% ethanol). Our gas is only E10 (10%). To put it in perspective, I decided to start up my 1999 BMW 323i parts car today. The last time I put gas in it was in 2013, which was 89 octane with 10% ethanol. Started on first try with a weak battery.
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