As engineers we certainly wrote the manuals for our parts. We would also validate the parts using what was specified in the manual, otherwise all that durability/validation work would not be valid.
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Engine Oil Question?
- Thread starter bronsondm
- Start date
As engineers we certainly wrote the manuals for our parts. We would also validate the parts using what was specified in the manual, otherwise all that durability/validation work would not be valid.
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19891989
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cbcanada
Banned
a mechanic told be that oil is oil. he used castrol gtx on all bikes he works on since forever. i know 3 "old timers" that use gastrol gtx forever with no
issues. there is a theory that motorcycle specific oil is a marketing ploy.
my 1983 honda manual says use catrol motor oil abn had the picture of the auto oil.
you have to remember that motorcycle specific oil is a recent thing maybe 10-15 years? not sure? but bikes have been around for 70 years running
on regular motor oil.
i think whats more important is regular oil and filter changes.
issues. there is a theory that motorcycle specific oil is a marketing ploy.
my 1983 honda manual says use catrol motor oil abn had the picture of the auto oil.
you have to remember that motorcycle specific oil is a recent thing maybe 10-15 years? not sure? but bikes have been around for 70 years running
on regular motor oil.
i think whats more important is regular oil and filter changes.
Motors and transmissions are built to use the standards of oils available at the time. I can tell you that the clutch in a modern bike has a good chance of getting messed up if used with energy-saving motor oil, which most auto oils are.*
*Cue person who chimes in "but I use Motomaster Formula 1 dino oil in my S1000RR and never had a problem with the clutch"
cbcanada
Banned
so you are saying that they build motors in accordance to the motor oil available at thre time? should it not be the other way around?
its just that i know more then a couple that use castrol gtx on their 15 year old or older japanese bikes for years with no issues , thats why i mentioned it.
also i notice everything is specific now days from pet food to car polish, so i figute there is a good chance motor oil will follow suit, after all its all about the money and why wouldnt marketing and sales departments not take advantage of peoples love for their bikes? its their job.
How on earth would you expect anyone to design a motor with no consideration towards what oil to use? That makes no sense.
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Motorcycle oil manufacturers know the oil has to lubricate BOTH your engine AND your transmission! In my car (which specifies ONLY Mobil 1 FULL synthetic oil anyway 
) the tranny has it's own special oil it uses. Motorcycle oils gotta do both!
-Jamie M.
) the tranny has it's own special oil it uses. Motorcycle oils gotta do both!-Jamie M.
The engine designers work hand in hand with the oil suppliers. In 1920, engines were designed hand-in-hand with motor oils that were designed in 1920. In 2012, engines are designed hand-in-hand with motor oils designed in 2012. The 1920 engine could not possibly have accounted for oil technology that didn't exist at the time. Likewise, 1920 oils couldn't possibly account for the changes that have happened in engine technology since then.
Many of the latest changes have been driven by changes in emission standards. One particular anti-wear additive that has traditionally been used, ZDDP, is being used less and less, and being replaced by other anti-wear additives, because it fouls catalytic converters. The auto engineers say "we can't deal with the zinc", the oil engineers say "What do you want to replace it with - but there's only so far we can go if you want your engine to last", etc.
The cheapest oil that you can get today is almost certainly better in almost every respect than anything short of exotic lubricants that were available when those engines were designed - with the possible exception of the "energy conserving" additive situation that can be incompatible with motorcycle wet clutches. And, those engines were designed with the oils of 15 years ago in mind - with the exception that the engine designers at the time could not have foreseen the "energy conserving" additives used today.
Don't underestimate the possibility that the engineers have been at work.
Put cheap plain ordinary non synthetic 10w30 motor oil into the engine in my car, and you'll be replacing the camshaft and lifters. Plenty of folks have found this out the hard way, a couple thousand bucks later. And that's if you don't coke the turbo first. 5w40 synthetic oil meeting the standards applicable to diesel engines ... no problem.
Put modern "energy conserving" oil into a bike engine with a wet clutch and you MAY (or may not) experience clutch problems. Even if the bike is older than the advent of "energy conserving" oil, it's good practice to use oil that meets JASO MA (which Rotella T6 does) even if the owner's book doesn't call for it. The owner's book couldn't possibly have foreseen the use of oil additives that didn't exist at the time the bike was built and the owner's book was written ...
Your confusion is understandable and you're right - all viscous fluids (of which, oil is only one) thicken when they cool and thin when they heat up. Oil viscosity is measured in "centistokes" and a straight 10W, 20W, 30W, 40W, etc. oil, will measure within a specified range of centistokes for any given temperature range. A 10W oil will come in at a lower number of Cst's at, say 5 degrees C, than a 30W oil - meaning it is less viscous and therefore will flow more easily. It does however, get way too thin at the operating temps. in current engines - bike, car, truck, etc. to provide an adequate hydrodynamic film, between all the engines sliding and rotating surfaces. The pressure, the various components of an engine (cam lobes, rod bearings/crankshaft, pistons, etc.) exert on their mating surfaces, would shear through this flimsy film very easily - and then you have metal to metal contact, causing high friction, resulting in high heat and wear, resulting in component failure.
A 30W oil would have a sufficiently high viscosity (in many engines), at operating temperatures, to provide the required hydrodynamic film, to prevent his from happening - however, it would be too thick (viscous) at temps. of freezing and below, to flow readily/easily enough, to adequately lubricate all the moving surfaces of an engine on start up - more friction and wear and crap. Hence, the "multi-grades".
A 5W-40 oil is thicker when it's cold, than when it's hot - absolutely - - - However - it will not measure more Cst's when it's cold, than a "straight" grade 5W oil would at the same temperature. In addition - it will not thin out (or measure fewer centistokes) than a "straight" grade 40W oil would, when it's hot.
Does this help - or did I make it worse ?
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