COVID and the housing market

Why is Poland so expensive? I thought it would be a reasonable spot.
Back to housing market, I would sell this house in a heartbeat, it’s a nice house ,2,600sq which is deceptive from the street , it looks small, good location but I gave up a 2 car garage . Never give up a 2 car garage . Changing to another house is a 200k problem if going laterally. Wife wanted this house .


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crankcall said:
Why is Poland so expensive? I thought it would be a reasonable spot.
Back to housing market, I would sell this house in a heartbeat, it’s a nice house ,2,600sq which is deceptive from the street , it looks small, good location but I gave up a 2 car garage . Never give up a 2 car garage . Changing to another house is a 200k problem if going laterally. Wife wanted this house .


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Because tickets alone are 8-10k. And Poland is very expensive even factoring in a conversion close to 3:1. Think McDonald coffee for $20 if you go 1:1.

Anyway housing…back on track.
 
crankcall said:
Why is Poland so expensive? I thought it would be a reasonable spot.
Back to housing market, I would sell this house in a heartbeat, it’s a nice house ,2,600sq which is deceptive from the street , it looks small, good location but I gave up a 2 car garage . Never give up a 2 car garage . Changing to another house is a 200k problem if going laterally. Wife wanted this house .


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In my hood moving from a 3 Br one car side split to a 4 Br two story 2 car is $400K. Add the taxes, commissions, moving fees, curtains and up grades I've done and I'd need $600 K. Then the taxes and heat will be higher.

The one thing that scares me is new neighbours. The ones I have are first class.
 
A horizontal move can be very expensive.

4% real estate fees on the sale.
LTT on the purchase (double in Toronto).
Lawyer fees.
Moving costs.
Possible breaking mortgage penalty costs but this can be avoided.
I would also factor in maybe 20K to 50K in near term renos, less of an issue going newer home to newer home but an older house likely has some hidden Kevin style demons but there could also be just the superficial stuff like paint, flooring, etc. Adds up fast.

So $2M lateral move, @crankcall hit the number right on the head, might even be 50K low. Not quite as bad outside of Toronto and/or lower priced home.

And the cost of the divorce this may all cause, that is extra.
 
Just for interest I stopped in at an open house outside of barrie. Crickets. Average 3 bed house on a nice lot and they are asking well over 1.5. Ouch. I don't know what the right number is but I'd want to be a lot closer to Toronto at that price. Only one potential buyer went to open house.
 
GreyGhost said:
Just for interest I stopped in at an open house outside of barrie. Crickets. Average 3 bed house on a nice lot and they are asking well over 1.5. Ouch. I don't know what the right number is but I'd want to be a lot closer to Toronto at that price. Only one potential buyer went to open house.
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I'd be lucky if I get 1.5M for my place...and I'd say I'm a much better option for someone working in Toronto or the nearby suburbs than Barrie...
 
Sales have ground to a screeching halt in our corner of Hamilton over the last 60 days. Only one house has sold, and that was a fixer-upper reach house that had an excellent location. Sellers aren't dropping prices, and buyers seem to be sitting tight in anticipation of additional rate cuts. Houses in our area have a decent spread, usually between 500k and 1M. Some very nice houses with recent renos are just sitting.

Will be interesting to see who starts blinking first...
 
Priller said:
Sales have ground to a screeching halt in our corner of Hamilton over the last 60 days. Only one house has sold, and that was a fixer-upper reach house that had an excellent location. Sellers aren't dropping prices, and buyers seem to be sitting tight in anticipation of additional rate cuts. Houses in our area have a decent spread, usually between 500k and 1M. Some very nice houses with recent renos are just sitting.

Will be interesting to see who starts blinking first...
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A friend has a mortgage fixed at 2.25 until the end of 2026. He's bored of mortgage payments and wants it gone. We were trying to figure out if there was a viable way for me to use his loan instead of mine. It would save tens of thousands. I think the logistics get too complicated though.
 
A large housing development has ground to halt in Erin, not that anyone currently living there wanted it in the first place. Supposed to be close to 5000 homes, with 1500 completed. Stopped for a environment survey, I think that sort of thing should be done before construction even starts but what do I know? At any rate, from the little bit of information I have seen, they are not selling and current buyers have homes up for sale that have never been lived in. Like everything not sure if info is 100% accurate as everyone has an agenda these days, but I hope it stops, this many houses will turn Erin into a little Brampton in no time...
 
Back in early 2023 I did a search of houses in Toronto for under $1M, if I remember correct it was around 30. Just did one now and I get 463... Now you aren't finding them if fancy pants neighbourhoods and many are in stabby areas but there are also a lot of small detached gems in mid tier areas if you are just starting out and only need one or two bedrooms and no parking or one parking space, maybe not worried about better schools.... At the same time it is sad under $1M is considered low...

In our area initial asking prices haven't moved much but actual selling prices have. Most sit unsold for a long time at asking, either they price drop (multiple times) if they need to sell or they take them off the market. The odd one sells fast at or above asking, usually older character homes.

IMO it is a buyer's market but many sellers don't want to believe it. It could be a very good time to buy. If I was selling I wouldn't bother for another couple years if one can wait.
 
Gal Pal is trying to sell a townhome in north east Oakville, nothing special but a roof over your head $795k ask and less than zero interest in a month on market


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GreyGhost said:
Just for interest I stopped in at an open house outside of barrie. Crickets. Average 3 bed house on a nice lot and they are asking well over 1.5. Ouch. I don't know what the right number is but I'd want to be a lot closer to Toronto at that price. Only one potential buyer went to open house.
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Been snooping around Halton, I saw a couple of fairly new townhouses, 1300sq' with a single garage @ $649, and another 2800sq' with 2 car garage at $1.3. Both in great hoods -- last year they were $900K and $1.7M.

I was shocked at the 2800' condo fees $13K, taxes $7K. Ouch!
 
GreyGhost said:
A friend has a mortgage fixed at 2.25 until the end of 2026. He's bored of mortgage payments and wants it gone. We were trying to figure out if there was a viable way for me to use his loan instead of mine. It would save tens of thousands. I think the logistics get too complicated though.
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Easy peazy.

1) Buddy keeps his $100K mortgage through its term, but you make the payments.
2) Buddy gives you a private mortgage using the cash earmarked to pay off his own pesky mortgage. Same term has what he has left, + and interest uptick of n basis points for his goodwill)
3) You pay down your existing mortgage/HELOC using cash, then make payments to buddy.

You will have to figure out how much you can prepay under the conditions of your mortgage. Most conventional lenders allow some or all of the following without penalty:
  • Annual lump sum of 15% of the original mortgage value (not 15% of what's left)
  • Doubling of monthly payments
  • Conversion to accelerated payments. Changing to weekly or bi-weekly saves interest, and it accelerates by 1/2 a monthly payment each year.
  • Conversion of part of the mortgage to HELOC. Yes, it will be at a higher rate, but it will also be open and you will have access to it for settlement at the end of Buddy's term (presumes your renewal term has a different date than his.
There should be no cost at your bank, and a couple of hundred to draw up and register the security agreement.
 
Mad Mike said:
Easy peazy.

1) Buddy keeps his $100K mortgage through its term, but you make the payments.
2) Buddy gives you a private mortgage using the cash earmarked to pay off his own pesky mortgage. Same term has what he has left, + and interest uptick of n basis points for his goodwill)
3) You pay down your existing mortgage/HELOC using cash, then make payments to buddy.

You will have to figure out how much you can prepay under the conditions of your mortgage. Most conventional lenders allow some or all of the following without penalty:
  • Annual lump sum of 15% of the original mortgage value (not 15% of what's left)
  • Doubling of monthly payments
  • Conversion to accelerated payments. Changing to weekly or bi-weekly saves interest, and it accelerates by 1/2 a monthly payment each year.
  • Conversion of part of the mortgage to HELOC. Yes, it will be at a higher rate, but it will also be open and you will have access to it for settlement at the end of Buddy's term (presumes your renewal term has a different date than his.
There should be no cost at your bank, and a couple of hundred to draw up and register the security agreement.
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The issue is cash flow on my end. Reducing the principal I owe the bank doesn't reduce the payment so I'd have to make full payment to bank and payment to him. He's not sitting on enough cash to entirely pay off his mortgage or mine in one shot or I could take the cash, clear my mortgage and make his payments. In two years though, I would need to get a new mortgage to pay him out as his renewal won't be substantially different than mine. I'm not sure how much hassle that would trigger as I could see potentially having to get appraisal and lawyers involved which would be ridiculous as ltv means bank is invincible but u wouldn't be surprised if they forced it.
 
GreyGhost said:
The issue is cash flow on my end. Reducing the principal I owe the bank doesn't reduce the payment so I'd have to make full payment to bank and payment to him.
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That depends on how much equity you have. If you’re above 60%, you should be able to convert the balance to Heloc. Heloc has a slight premium, but the min payments are interest only and it’s open.
GreyGhost said:
He's not sitting on enough cash to entirely pay off his mortgage or mine in one shot or I could take the cash, clear my mortgage and make his payments. In two years though, I would need to get a new mortgage to pay him out as his renewal won't be substantially different than mine. I'm not sure how much hassle that would trigger as I could see potentially having to get appraisal and lawyers involved which would be ridiculous as ltv means bank is invincible but u wouldn't be surprised if they forced it.
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That’s the benefit of a Heloc. It can be accessed for a short period as a bridge between when you pay him out and you term ends. Then you convert back to conventional.

It’s all doable, just needs Excel and an hour to see if you save enough for it to make sense.
 
crankcall said:
I’m not a numbers guy ( wish I was) , but I would not pursue the above.


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I could never get back into the home ownership club if anything went wrong. We were reviewing some finances the other day and wondered what our lives would be like if we were renting, with the possibility of the rug being pulled out.

Yeah on paper we've lost tons of equity due to the market crash but the roof is still there.
 
and today the Libs announce mving the insured morgage cap from 1mil to 1.5m and expanding the 30yr amortization program to make housing more affordable.
It will get a foot in the door , but it does nothing to change affordability , people ( like many Lib policy makers) are really disconnected from the meaning of the word, your in the game but chained to the wheel for a lot longer , costing more money .....
 
crankcall said:
and today the Libs announce mving the insured morgage cap from 1mil to 1.5m and expanding the 30yr amortization program to make housing more affordable.
It will get a foot in the door , but it does nothing to change affordability , people ( like many Lib policy makers) are really disconnected from the meaning of the word, your in the game but chained to the wheel for a lot longer , costing more money .....
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Gotta keep those house prices propped up through any means necessary.

Up to 1.5M for First Time Home Buyers...not many FTHBs will be able to do that...but those that can will see increased competition now as their payments will be significantly lower.
 
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