cheap race / track bike $1000 | GTAMotorcycle.com

cheap race / track bike $1000

boyoboy

boyoboy

Well-known member
found a cheap race / track bike ? post here.

from vrra forum - race bikes for sale http://www.vrra.ca/board/viewforum.php?f=20


1989 ex 500 1000.00 OBO
Postby relicracer » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:30 am

Selling my son's first race bike.Ninja 600 front end,Works rear shock.Micron pipe.Race ready.He used it for the RACE school and 4 rounds of the super series with only one mechanical issue Head Gasket with was replaced before round 5.Bike worked well he finished 5th in LTW Prod round 5. Spares available. Pictures to come as soon as I figure how to post them.
relicracer

Posts: 51
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 8:37 am
Location: stoney lake ontario
 
Last edited:
Is that Angerman's bike? Hopefully he's staying with a "small" bike and in our class again!!
 
I could be wrong, but the Ninja 600 forks make it ineligible for Lightweight Production....just saying...
 
bakaboy said:
I could be wrong, but the Ninja 600 forks make it ineligible for Lightweight Production....just saying...
Click to expand...

Definitely not "legal". It doesn't bother me though as long as it's not the 600 engine stuffed in there haha. It does bring the older Ninja 500 tire options on par with more modern bikes (16-inch on the pre-93 ones). The 1994 onward had 17s. We're all so inconsistent that more track time is a far better "advantage".
 
Owen said:
Definitely not "legal". It doesn't bother me though as long as it's not the 600 engine stuffed in there haha. It does bring the older Ninja 500 tire options on par with more modern bikes (16-inch on the pre-93 ones). The 1994 onward had 17s. We're all so inconsistent that more track time is a far better "advantage".
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be too worried about the forks. According to the RACE rule book liquid cooled 500 twins are not permitted in lwt prod'n. Additionally, 400 fours are also not permitted as per the rule book. I had a couple back and forth emails about this with John C? at RACE, and when I pointed this out to him he didn't respond to my email. It appears to me that as long as you are not dominating the class you can pretty much run whatever you want.

As for 300 prod'n there are no rules whatsoever in the RACE rulebook. None. I found this very strange. When SOAR and RACE aligned the rules about 3 years? ago the rules for 300 prod'n were clear. Now RACE has a slightly modified version of the old 300 prod'n rules pasted into the rule book for lwt prod'n. WTF?

I imagine a racer dominating lwt prod'n with a stock fzr400 would be dissappointed to find out he has to race in lwt sbk.

I had intended to prep an old suzuki gs 500 (vintage) for 300 prod'n as the original rules from RACE permitted 500cc air cooled vintage twins. But today there aren't any 300 prod'n rules in the RACE rule book.

from the RACE rulebook 2015 (there isn't a 2016 version):


LIGHTWEIGHT Production (LTWT)

Any year CBR125,any year Ex250, Yamah R3, KTM390
Any year Hyosung 250GT
Any year CBR250
Any year Kawasaki Ex300
Any year CBR300
380cc Four stroke multi or twin
400cc Four stroke single
500cc Four stroke air cooled (vintage legal)
400cc Two stroke air cooled street based
 
Last edited:
Slick_Steveo said:
My guess is that there were a few bikes that ran the lwt prod/300 prod last season, that were "ineligible".
Click to expand...

Without a doubt. As the grids grow and the competition grows, rules are sometimes used to compete.

As a "new" racer looking at the above noted bike they may not know the finer points. Which has the potential for disappointment.

I think that the 300 Class in 2016 evolved from the creation of the 250 Class as per my requirements which was largely based on the CSBK CBR250 class.

With the CSBK 300 deal Chris wanted to support those racers, Kawasaki and CSBK and therefore the "300 Production" class was created. Unfortunately no rules were published for the RACE 300 class. Copying the principles of the old 250 Production class rules would be problematic since the Ktech fork upgrades and QS used in the CSBK 300 series were disallowed in the old 250 class.

I would, if I was running 2017 RACE in those 2 lightweight classes, maybe suggest an update to the rule package.

An updated "300" rule package based on the new WSBK 300 class might be logical.
 
Last edited:
bakaboy said:
Without a doubt. As the grids grow and the competition grows, rules are sometimes used to compete.

As a "new" racer looking at the above noted bike they may not know the finer points. Which has the potential for disappointment.

I think that the 300 Class in 2016 evolved from the creation of the 250 Class as per my requirements which was largely based on the CSBK CBR250 class.

With the CSBK 300 deal Chris wanted to support those racers, Kawasaki and CSBK and therefore the "300 Production" class was created. Unfortunately no rules were published for the RACE 300 class. Copying the principles of the old 250 Production class rules would be problematic since the Ktech fork upgrades and QS used in the CSBK 300 series were disallowed in the old 250 class.

I would, if I was running 2017 RACE in those 2 lightweight classes, maybe suggest an update to the rule package.

An updated "300" rule package based on the new WSBK 300 class might be logical.
Click to expand...

YES, and clarification of lwt prod'n rules is needed. the old lwt sportsman rules would be a better fit if they want to permit 400 fours and 500 twins (EDITED).
 
Last edited:
Just a little clarification. I am the person who wrote the combined rulebook. I personally didnt see the production class working and at our series it hasnt, we havent run it yet due to lack of entries. Sounds like at RACE it doesnt really work either with many of the bikes racing it being not legal. But it was included at the request of RACE. As for 300 I didnt write it as I had no interest in it, thats why there is nothing there. Kawasaki made no effort to include the regional series in its plans so why would we cater to that series with no support? Its also a miserable failure (similar to the 250 class before it) with very few competing riders and the lions share of the grid being reporters on factory owned bikes. This also holds true for Masters and Novice. These two classes are pretty much mirrors of Old Boys and Rookie and I saw/see no sense in having both sets of classes.
Now that RACE has gone their own way once again, I am not sure if they will re-write their own rulebook but I can see your point.
 
Very true on the Masters/OBC duplicity and the Rookie/Novice classes as well.

Makes sense to have only 1 class for both of them. Especially when you consider that the Masters Middleweight rules are based on the old Sportsman class rules which would have made the 1-3rd place finishers for the year ineligible based on their machinery.

The grid sizes for the the Lightweight classes at RACE have been good. I think 17 entries for the last weekend in Lightweight Production alone.

A rule upgrade (new for 300 Production since it doesn't exist) would make sense for RACE for 2017.
 
Last edited:
kneedragger88 said:
Just a little clarification. I am the person who wrote the combined rulebook. I personally didnt see the production class working and at our series it hasnt, we havent run it yet due to lack of entries. Sounds like at RACE it doesnt really work either with many of the bikes racing it being not legal. But it was included at the request of RACE. As for 300 I didnt write it as I had no interest in it, thats why there is nothing there. Kawasaki made no effort to include the regional series in its plans so why would we cater to that series with no support? Its also a miserable failure (similar to the 250 class before it) with very few competing riders and the lions share of the grid being reporters on factory owned bikes. This also holds true for Masters and Novice. These two classes are pretty much mirrors of Old Boys and Rookie and I saw/see no sense in having both sets of classes.
Now that RACE has gone their own way once again, I am not sure if they will re-write their own rulebook but I can see your point.
Click to expand...

the 300 class is growing at RACE, the race results showing ~15 bikes on the grid at the last round. this is good news. but to say many of the bikes in 300 prod'n are not legal doesn't make sense as there are no rules for 300 prod'n. the lwt prod'n class rules have the old 300 prod'n rules pasted in place. RACE could not have made things any more confusing.
 
Last edited:
boyoboy said:
the 300 class is growing at RACE, the race results showing ~15 bikes on the grid at the last round. this is good news. but to say many of the bikes in 300 prod'n are not legal doesn't make sense as there are no rules for 300 prod'n. the lwt prod'n class rules have the old 300 prod'n rules pasted in place. RACE could not have made things any more confusing.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't go so far as to say confusing. Its simple really, bring a small bike and run with other small bikes. If you happen to have a 300cc or less, you get an extra race per weekend.

If you are into throwing a whole bunch of money into that small bike, it may gain you a small edge, but I tend to agree with Owen. The additional track time is money better spent.

Personally, the only thing that I would like to see, is that the classes be restricted to red numbers only. (sorry Mike )
 
Slick_Steveo said:
I wouldn't go so far as to say confusing. Its simple really, bring a small bike and run with other small bikes. If you happen to have a 300cc or less, you get an extra race per weekend.

If you are into throwing a whole bunch of money into that small bike, it may gain you a small edge, but I tend to agree with Owen. The additional track time is money better spent.

Personally, the only thing that I would like to see, is that the classes be restricted to red numbers only. (sorry Mike )
Click to expand...

for me it is confusing. if i go through the trouble of prepping my gs500 (vintage) will i be able to run it in 300 - as the old 300 prod'n rules allowed? if not, i'll have lwt prod'n and lwt sbk classes to run in. in that case i might as well use a 400 four or 500 liquid twin as they were running (illegally) this year. but even so i could be protested and punted out to lwt sbk. doh.

perhaps i should just sell my trusty old gs500 and do as slick stevo suggested - get a 300. but it wouldn't be cheap like me. i think running my old 37-38hp gs500 in 300 would have been an interesting addition to the class.

at atlantic motosport park they run two 250ss races and two 300ss races. a 250 rider would be able to run four separate races with a 250 - these guys are getting their moneys worth...
 
Last edited:
I believe they split the 250 and 300 due to rider turnout. The rulebook for 2016 said that they would run together but scored separately.

4 races on a 250? If you had a 250 or 300 at RACE you would get 4 races if you paid entry fees for 300 Production and Lightweight classes. 2 Qualifiers on Saturday and 2 Final races on Sunday.

I am not familiar with any previous 300 classes that allowed a GS500.

There was discussion last winter to revise the Lightweight Production rules but nothing happened.

The 300 class needs a set of rules. Otherwise no one knows how they can build. And as I have discussed with others trackside, what will people do when an R3 rolls up to grid for 300 Production? Or a RC390? WSBK views them all relatively similar now.
 
bakaboy said:
I believe they split the 250 and 300 due to rider turnout. The rulebook for 2016 said that they would run together but scored separately.

4 races on a 250? If you had a 250 or 300 at RACE you would get 4 races if you paid entry fees for 300 Production and Lightweight classes. 2 Qualifiers on Saturday and 2 Final races on Sunday.

I am not familiar with any previous 300 classes that allowed a GS500.

There was discussion last winter to revise the Lightweight Production rules but nothing happened.

The 300 class needs a set of rules. Otherwise no one knows how they can build. And as I have discussed with others trackside, what will people do when an R3 rolls up to grid for 300 Production? Or a RC390? WSBK views them all relatively similar now.
Click to expand...

I stumbled upon this a couple months ago, not sure where, but might have been fb?
I posted it on the race sticky - still there.



"Registration for Round 2 is now open. AMP is working the gravel trap installation so hopefully all will be good by next weekend. We will provide updates over the next week. There will be 2 250 Super-sport races as well as 2 separate 300 SS races for Round 2. 250s can bump into the 300 class and registration for those races as well. "

I guess it is open to interpretation, but it sounded like 4 finals to me.

in the first year that soar and race tried their amalgamation- the rules now posted as lwt prod'n were the 300 prod'n rules. they are a copy and paste from then.
 
boyoboy said:
I stumbled upon this a couple months ago, not sure where, but might have been fb?
I posted it on the race sticky - still there.



"Registration for Round 2 is now open. AMP is working the gravel trap installation so hopefully all will be good by next weekend. We will provide updates over the next week. There will be 2 250 Super-sport races as well as 2 separate 300 SS races for Round 2. 250s can bump into the 300 class and registration for those races as well. "

I guess it is open to interpretation, but it sounded like 4 finals to me.

in the first year that soar and race tried their amalgamation- the rules now posted as lwt prod'n were the 300 prod'n rules. they are a copy and paste from then.
Click to expand...

There have never been a rule package for 300 Production Class.

The combined rules/classes only had the Lightweight Production and Lightweight Superbike as Ken states and as the RACE and SOAR rulebook shows. Ken didn't see a need for the Lightweight Production class but it was added largely to appease me.

After Round 1 2015 was completed I asked RACE to add another class for the smaller bikes (ie CBR250s). RACE was accommodating and they created another class (as in bring back the 250 Production class from 2014) but in case 300 Machines started showing up it was classified as a 300 Production class. All of the participants (Quintin, JP, Walker, Taylore etc) agreed that the rules would be Production based with limited mods such as we're reflected from the CSBK 2014 CBR250 build limits.

2016 came around and CSBK 300s show up with Ktech forks, QS etc. These mods were outside of the original concept of the 300 Production class but no one discussed it and the 2016 season ran with no defined rules.

2017 may see the grid grow more.

Nothing says you can't run a 320 cc or a single thumper 390.

Having the Lightweight Production is great. The 2016 grid was largely what was imagined when the class was created.

The 2016 300 Production class continued because there was a demand for a 2nd class for 300 or lower bikes and RACE was willing to accommodate with track time.

The small bikes cannot be competitive in the Lightweight Superbike class. Consider that the 300 Production Pro Track record is 1 18. Lightweight Production is 1 16 while the Lightweight Superbike run 1 11 to 1 12.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom