Carpenters: Can this be done?

[Pistachio Nuts]

Carpenters, am in need of a solution! ?

We have two long tables (126" in length) that we want to be able to dismantle and put back together for easier transport. The thing is, there's no visible screws, and all the joints have been glued together. The table itself is made of particle board with a laminated top and sides.

Is it possible to dismantle this thing and install joints that can be easily taken apart (and put back together again)? If so, is this even worth doing?

Thanks for any help, dudes!

 

[GreyGhost]

Yes.

How often do you want to take it apart? How small do the pieces need to be?

I had to cut a bookshelf in half to get it into the basement at our old house. After cutting it, I put alignment pins on both pieces. It is now ~1/8" shorter and there is a line, but it's unobtrusive and if I didn't point it out, you probably would notice it. I was in a hurry so it got cut on the front step. If I spent more time and/or was more concerned about appearance, a better job could be done. I use gravity to hold the pieces together, obviously you would need some kind of latch or catch. As an added bonus, pressure on the joint will minimize the appearance. If you are doing this often, I would look first at catches designed to pull tables together around leaves.

EDIT:
If you are planning on cutting the top in half, given the distance between the legs, I would probably use a truss rod just below the existing web to keep the top from sagging. You would end up with a visible nut at the end but that could be capped with something if desired.

 

[Pistachio Nuts]

Yes.

How often do you want to take it apart? How small do the pieces need to be?

I had to cut a bookshelf in half to get it into the basement at our old house. After cutting it, I put alignment pins on both pieces. It is now ~1/8" shorter and there is a line, but it's unobtrusive and if I didn't point it out, you probably would notice it. I use gravity to hold the pieces together, obviously you would need some kind of latch or catch.

It would be taken apart frequently (once or twice every week, during busy times). I was thinking about 4 pieces, cut along the glued joints, so it would keep the pieces relatively intact. The joints at the ends are angled, too, so might be tricky to cut.

Some have proposed just cutting the table in the middle (going width-wise). The only issue with that is that there's a centre support running along the length of the table top. If the support is also cut in half, I suspect the strength will be compromised.

 

[matthew]

I'm an amateur. The above example of a bookcase is a little different since the weight is pushing down from above. If you cut a table in half, especially one made out of LDF, it may always have a sag where it's been cut. You could try a lot of glue and dowels, but with that effort, you may just want to buy another table or find a way to move it without cutting it in half.

Again, I'm just an amateur so someone more experienced than I may have a better solution / idea.

 

[mimico_polak]

I would cut it right below the joint on the vertical legs. This would keep the cut out of the visible line of sight, but still close to the corner.

Then get a few L-brackets (4-6 total) and put in short screws to connect the whole thing together. Throw some of those plastic fillers into the holes so that it has something to grip instead of just the flaky material.

EDIT: Alternatively....get a very thin pry bar, try to separate them apart at the joint carefully as there's a good chance it'll chip/damage. Then when it's apart use the L-brackets to put it back together.

 

[GreyGhost]

It would be taken apart frequently (once or twice every week, during busy times). I was thinking about 4 pieces, cut along the glued joints, so it would keep the pieces relatively intact. The joints at the ends are angled, too, so might be tricky to cut.

Some have proposed just cutting the table in the middle (going width-wise). The only issue with that is that there's a centre support running along the length of the table top. If the support is also cut in half, I suspect the strength will be compromised. It will be used for customers, so have to be 100% sure that it's safe.

Ugh. The easy and quick setup/breakdown is hard.

You are correct, if you cut the top, it may sag but if you cut the legs, the whole table may rack and collapse. What about cutting the top and adding a centre leg to each piece? Then you are left with two 2x5 tables to move (to where, I have no idea, most restaurants don't have a ton of space)?

How's your ceiling height? Can you suck them up to the ceiling with some ropes and pulleys?

 

[backmarkerducati]

Cut it down the middle (side to side), add some alignment dowels and secure it with these:

Cast Brass Table Fork Closure - Lee Valley Tools

If you really needed to, you can make the top thicker at the split by gluing/attaching a wide strip right at the cut (wide enough for the table fork closures.

For cutting use a very high quality blade on a circular saw (using a guide) or table saw. May also want to tape the cut or use a sacrificial chunk of wood to try and stop and chipping of the finished top.

Instead of straight up wood dowels you can also use these for alignment...

Table-Leaf Alignment Pins - Lee Valley Tools

You can also make the end sections (legs) fold-able, use two per end..... Or add a centre folding leg (at the cut) to help prevent any potential sag using one of these....

Folding Leg Bracket - Lee Valley Tools

General table parts....

Table Hardware - Lee Valley Tools

 

[Dirty Frank]

The squeeze isn't worth the juice in this case multiple tables or a different method of transport would be better IMHO.

 

[GreyGhost]

Cut it down the middle (side to side), add some alignment dowels and secure it with these:

Cast Brass Table Fork Closure - Lee Valley Tools

If you really needed to, you can make the top thicker at the split by gluing/attaching a wide strip right at the cut (wide enough for the table fork closures.

I wouldn't trust those in this application. Remember, at some point in time, there will probably be at least one idiot (maybe more) standing on the center of this table. A couple hundred pounds, 5' from the leg is going to be a horrendous force. Sadly, letting the table break to unceremoniously dump the dbag on the ground is not socially acceptable. 4-#4 screws into sawdust will hold approximately nothing.

 

[Trials]

I think I could do it lighter, cheaper and more compact with aluminum extrude then wood, needs some fancy bolt fasteners
and 4 saw cuts that need to be done with some precision.

 

[PrivatePilot]

I agree that cutting it in the middle is going to result in a sag no matter what you do afterwards, and a serious weak spot given it's MDF.

If it were me I'd cut it along the existing 45 degree joints at either end and use a beefy piano hinge on the inside edge along with a removable arm to hold the now folding legs extended when it's setup. Snap the arm into place and the table is up, and sturdy - take it out and the two end pieces will fold mostly flat along the bottom side of the main part of the table.

Edit: Just saw that there's a support under there as well. A long piano hinge longitudinally along it length will let it fold flat as well, although the end legs may not fold 100% flat anymore as a result of that added depth, but it should still fold at least 80% - enough for your needs?

 

[AllistonGT]

I'm a cabinet maker and have been for over 30 years doing very high end work. If you want this to be strong, easy to break down and reassemble and still look good its not going to happen. Sorry.

 

[mimico_polak]

How about cutting at the legs, or at a 45deg angle, and then installing hinges so that you can open/close as needed? Put in a brace to support the legs when out, and it won't close on you when people are sitting down.

 

[Trials]

Just priced the aluminum for my solution and it worked out to about 800$ per table, so I think Allistonfjr is right, is not likely to happen.

 

[nobbie48]

I wouldn't trust those in this application. Remember, at some point in time, there will probably be at least one idiot (maybe more) standing on the center of this table. A couple hundred pounds, 5' from the leg is going to be a horrendous force. Sadly, letting the table break to unceremoniously dump the dbag on the ground is not socially acceptable. 4-#4 screws into sawdust will hold approximately nothing.

Or right in the middle someone stacks 10 cases of books at 50 pounds each, the Timmies coffee box, and a case of water bottles.

 

[nobbie48]

I'm a cabinet maker and have been for over 30 years doing very high end work. If you want this to be strong, easy to break down and reassemble and still look good its not going to happen. Sorry.

Strong
Easy to assemble
Good looking

Pick any two

 

[J_F]

cut in half and put new ends/sides on so it's 2 tables
can't see anything else really working out

 

[Pistachio Nuts]

Ugh. The easy and quick setup/breakdown is hard.

You are correct, if you cut the top, it may sag but if you cut the legs, the whole table may rack and collapse. What about cutting the top and adding a centre leg to each piece? Then you are left with two 2x5 tables to move (to where, I have no idea, most restaurants don't have a ton of space)?

How's your ceiling height? Can you suck them up to the ceiling with some ropes and pulleys?

We actually store the tables on the second floor balcony. It's a pain getting them out there and back into the space, but it seems to work...until I looked at one of the tables today. They are covered with a tarp. However, some water leaked into one, and now there's some water damage on the edge of one of the tables. It's swollen and warped.

Ceiling height is minimal. Can't store them there.

The squeeze isn't worth the juice in this case multiple tables or a different method of transport would be better IMHO.

Yeah, agree. Just need to work on getting our tarp system completely water tight, so there's no further water damage. If I could disassemble the tables, I could store them in a covered shed, where there would no issues with water damage. The only issue is with the freezing and thawing of the wood and joints.

I'm a cabinet maker and have been for over 30 years doing very high end work. If you want this to be strong, easy to break down and reassemble and still look good its not going to happen. Sorry.

Yeah, starting to realize that!

Strong
Easy to assemble
Good looking

Pick any two

Could go with ugly, if it means being able to take them apart. Tbh, we prefer the more rustic designs, so maybe we'll upgrade these tables in the future.

Thanks for the responses, guys! Very helpful, as usual!

 

[crankcall]

1. there is no feeze thaw cycle on wood products once they are beyond the manufacturing phase.
2. it was mentioned this was PB, who moved on to MDF ?? reading comprehension folks. PS. it doesnt matter...
3. this is accomplished with a bridge plate and knockdown fittings, threaded inserts into the top from under niegth, a bridge plate with threaded fittings.
4. faster and better would be to reimagine the tables as a shorter version with a center leg so you can make them more portable.
5. re fabricate the tops with a honeycomb core or an LDF so a wee girl can carry them.

I have been a purveyor of core and laminating products to actual high end millworkers for years. I'll come take a look as i like this stuff and will save you from some dum dums.

(you dont want a carpenter, unless he's Jesus)

 

[AllistonGT]

If you throw enough money and time at it you can do anything. Even make it look like this!

Or just get new tables.


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