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Careless Driving/ No insurance ticket- HELP!
- Thread starter s1000rrr
- Start date
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Why even do that when you can just ride it plateless? Its a no-brainer LOL
pegassus:
Cops lie in court = bad
pegassus lies in court = good
Really? Glad you feel proud that you can brag that you have basically lied your way out of 19 tickets. Here is a novel concept. STOP doing **** that gets you tickets to begin with then you won't be in court so often.
Glad that the ends justifies the means in your world. Like others, I prefer to live my life free of having to lie, in court. I too have had a few tickets over the years and guess what I have beat every single one, WITHOUT the need to having to resort to lying, but instead by being educated, about the law and the legal system. I don't go with the default setting that everyone else lies.
Cops lie in court = bad
pegassus lies in court = good
Really? Glad you feel proud that you can brag that you have basically lied your way out of 19 tickets. Here is a novel concept. STOP doing **** that gets you tickets to begin with then you won't be in court so often.
Glad that the ends justifies the means in your world. Like others, I prefer to live my life free of having to lie, in court. I too have had a few tickets over the years and guess what I have beat every single one, WITHOUT the need to having to resort to lying, but instead by being educated, about the law and the legal system. I don't go with the default setting that everyone else lies.
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Well I lost my respect for cops and the law when they "ambush" people at mistake-prone places like stop sings that are covered by tree branches. Do Cops have time to hide and ambush people in this manner while they don't bother coming to your house when your bike gets stolen? Really? There has to be laws and enforced but when you hide behind a stop sign that is covered by branches you are acting like a cynic and this is where I lose my respect for you.
When you stop my minivan WITHOUT even knowing what you are stopping me for, you are violating my rights and the law. This is why that OPP cop got owned in court. You should had seen the verbal education the judge gave him.
Did I say anything about respect? I merely pointed out what a hypocrite you are. As I said I have been able to defend myself against tickets without the need to lie.
In your kid seat belt case, I fail to see where the officer lied. He stated your child wasn't wearing a seat belt. You didn't deny that your child wasn't wearing the seat belt, (which leads to your questions of your parenting skills). Now he/she may not have RP&G to make a traffic stop, but that doesn't mean he lied about the offence you had committed. Had the officer wanted to lie, (as you suggest they ALL do), then he/she could have merely stated they were stopping you for another reason and then justified the seat belt charge as a "plain view" offence. Rather they testified TRUTHFULLY as to the reason for the stop and as a result, the JP, (he was never given an education by a judge, as traffic offences are heard by JP's NOT judges), felt the ticket should have been dismissed.
I assume seeing you feel it is proper to make such broad and sweeping statements such as all cops lie, then I would be just as correct by stating that all minivan drivers are pussies? After all, I could maintain that is my opinion and as such must be just as true as yours. BUT< I am an intelligent enough human being to realize that would be a foolish and incorrect assumption on my part..
In your kid seat belt case, I fail to see where the officer lied. He stated your child wasn't wearing a seat belt. You didn't deny that your child wasn't wearing the seat belt, (which leads to your questions of your parenting skills). Now he/she may not have RP&G to make a traffic stop, but that doesn't mean he lied about the offence you had committed. Had the officer wanted to lie, (as you suggest they ALL do), then he/she could have merely stated they were stopping you for another reason and then justified the seat belt charge as a "plain view" offence. Rather they testified TRUTHFULLY as to the reason for the stop and as a result, the JP, (he was never given an education by a judge, as traffic offences are heard by JP's NOT judges), felt the ticket should have been dismissed.
I assume seeing you feel it is proper to make such broad and sweeping statements such as all cops lie, then I would be just as correct by stating that all minivan drivers are pussies? After all, I could maintain that is my opinion and as such must be just as true as yours. BUT< I am an intelligent enough human being to realize that would be a foolish and incorrect assumption on my part..
Iceman
Well-known member
In my personal experience, I have never received a ticket for something I wasn't doing. I have met one or two power tripping cops. Most of the officers I've dealt with have been fair, with one or two stand outs who went way above and beyond to make the experience easier for me to deal with. In court I've always received a break from the Crown at early resolution, I've never gone to trial.
I've since learned about the "right time and place" and rarely ever get pulled over these days.
Sent from my SM-A500W using Tapatalk
I've since learned about the "right time and place" and rarely ever get pulled over these days.
Sent from my SM-A500W using Tapatalk
I know novel concept, Iceman, taking personal responsibility, and all....lol Plus then you matured and realized better not to do crap and waste time at the court house.. 
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I might be the idiot, but I am a firm believer that 2 wrongs don't make a right. I've fought most of my tickets, but I won't lie. Ymmv.
sent from my Purple LGG4 on the GTAM app
Update: So I have had the case adjourned a couple of times and received a call from my lawyer today stating that the trial date is this month and that it cannot be adjourned further(she mentioned the term Pre-Entry). I still have to discuss the details of our defense with the lawyer (what additional disclosure can i request legally?). I was wondering, is an early resolution option still available right up until the trial date? Also, the lawyer stated that I must be present for the trial, which I can't because I cannot take a day off from work. I was told the trial continues with or without me at this point (it seems to me that the lawyer is tired of adjourning the case and just wants to get over with it).
Finally, this is my first offense of this nature and I have obviously learned from my mistakes. Does the court have any sympathy if convicted, such as dropping one charge, or is it too late once you go into a trial?
Finally, this is my first offense of this nature and I have obviously learned from my mistakes. Does the court have any sympathy if convicted, such as dropping one charge, or is it too late once you go into a trial?
Your opportunity for early resolution is history - even if you asked for it now the court would tell you to get lost after asking for so many adjournments in what they will surely have seen for exactly what it was - an effort to delay things.
As for being there on the trial date, I'd do what you're told, ESPECIALLY if it's the court instructing you to be there, not just your lawyer. You don't want to have the judge automatically rule for the crown just because you couldn't be bothered to show, or end up nailing you with a contempt or something on top of your other issues for failing to show - "I have to work" isn't an excuse - book the day off, now. Tell your employer what it's for if they kick up a fuss and be prepared to tell them you can get proof of what you're doing if they insist, but if the court says you need to be there, you NEED to be there.
And I wouldn't expect any leniency on a carless charge, especially with the no insurance cherry on top.
Sorry, but just MHO. YMMV.
As for being there on the trial date, I'd do what you're told, ESPECIALLY if it's the court instructing you to be there, not just your lawyer. You don't want to have the judge automatically rule for the crown just because you couldn't be bothered to show, or end up nailing you with a contempt or something on top of your other issues for failing to show - "I have to work" isn't an excuse - book the day off, now. Tell your employer what it's for if they kick up a fuss and be prepared to tell them you can get proof of what you're doing if they insist, but if the court says you need to be there, you NEED to be there.
And I wouldn't expect any leniency on a carless charge, especially with the no insurance cherry on top.
Sorry, but just MHO. YMMV.
J_F
Guest
I agree with PP
provincial offenses crown will be extremely unlikely to deal with you now
best buckle up for a trial, he/she will be gunning for you
they are overworked and do not like defendants that F around
and the time for disclosure was months ago
it would have been the first thing your lawyer did, request it
provincial offenses crown will be extremely unlikely to deal with you now
best buckle up for a trial, he/she will be gunning for you
they are overworked and do not like defendants that F around
and the time for disclosure was months ago
it would have been the first thing your lawyer did, request it
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Hmmm? I was under the belief that the HTA allows Police to pull you over to check your documentation, the cars mechanical condition and condition of the driver. They can use the opportunity to fish further.
If anyone else knows the truth to this i'd be interested to hear it.
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So you`re going to fight it still? You do realize if you lose you'll likely pay the maximum on every charge? I was wrongly summoned to court for driving with a suspended license and had it quashed but while there i had the opportunity to watch quite a few 'not insured' cases.
Almost all pleaded guilty and the fines ranged from $1,500-$3,000. It appeared to depend largely on how much you make but the JP was fair and gave everyone a year to pay it off. One guy even begged that it was still too much and the JP said he would grant him another year if he came back and asked.
I'm not sure what you do for money or what you consider pocket change, but maybe you should weigh eating 10? grand up front and still getting charged vs half of that or less and still getting the charge.
I'm not advocating you don't assert your rights and fight however.
A year later and you still haven't talked defence strategy with your lawyer? At this point I suspect that the strategy will be that you keep you mouth shut and don't take the stand, and pray for a procedural error.
What additional discovery can you 'legally' request? It's a little late in the game for that, if you have exhausted any and all delays. That's what your lawyer has been doing for the last year. Those were probably a good part of the delays. That, and statements that the suggested trial dates were no good for you.
You can't take a day off work? For the trial that has been delayed already? Consider the following:
- Your lawyer has likely already used the "cannot attend on such-and-such a date" excuse to delay this long.
- Yes, the trial will continue with or without you. Or a bench warrant could be sworn out on you for contempt, if the judge is ****** that you're blowing this off. Is it likely for a 'mere' Provincial Offences Act charge? No, but it's also not impossible and well within the judge's powers. How would your boss feel if you were off for two weeks in jail on a contempt cite?
- It's not your lawyer who is tired of delays. If you had enough money she would happily exhaust all reasonable options. It's the judge who is fed up. I was a witness in a case that was delayed for two and a half years after the initial hearing date. Ultimately the final hearing to which I received a subpoena to appear became the trial. The accused threw himself on the mercy of the court. He stated that his family would undergo hardship, etc., etc.. The judge told him that he should have found remorse earlier, rather than continually inconveniencing 'these people' (myself and 4 other witnesses). Sympathy? He tossed the guy in jail.
Go. To. Your. Trial.
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Nope.
There is a REASON your lawyer told you you HAVE to be there. The trial date was likely set sometime ago. You should have booked the day off, LONG ago. If you don't attend the court will proceed with a TIA, (Trial In Absentia). this basically means that you don't get to hear what evidence is given by the other witnesses, (so if someone says something that is wrong, your lawyer can challenge them on it, after you advise her of the issue), etc.
Your lawyer also likely wants you there to "show the court" that your present and ready to proceed, (then say the crowns witness, the officer), doesn't attend your lawyer can ask the JP, for the charges to be dismissed. If your not there either the opportunity is gone. If the JP is ****** they will have the crown read into the record the alleged facts, of the case and can make a ruling based solely upon that.
I agree with Rob, a year and you haven't discussed strategy with your lawyer. now if it was because you couldn't get a day off work, then you have learned NOTHING. This should have been your #1 priority until it was finished with. If it is because your lawyer couldn't make time, you hired a crappy defence lawyer, who will if you don't attend likely just throw in the white towel and let you bend over.
You are going to be screwed once that insurance conviction is registered. Your going to the facility market for insurance, if as your name suggest you ride a 1000RR, it will EASILY be well in excess of $10,000 for the next several years. So either your going to a 250, or riding dirty, (which of course if caught again you will be totally screwed).
Hate to say it, but you have created a hornets nest for yourself and still appear to not be taking this as seriously as it is. So to me you haven't learned form your mistakes at all as you have let this get totally out of hand, and have done NOTHING, other than throw some money to a lawyer, to rectify the issue.
Is your bike NOW insured? How long has it been insured? Hopefully, you insured it RIGHT after, (as in the next day), to show the court you took responsibility. Once your convicted you MUST advise your insurer of the convictions, (Failing to do so, means they can deny ANY and ALL claims submitted), plus if they discover them, they WILL cancel your policy. If your convicted of both careless and insurance, you can expect a letter VERY soon advising your policy has been cancelled. Which again will mean HIGHER premiums IF you try to get insurance again.
Don't attend, the JP "could" issue a bench warrant, although HIGHLY unlike, as you are represented. Also if you fail to attend, you surrender your options such as a possible appeal etc.
Your lawyer also likely wants you there to "show the court" that your present and ready to proceed, (then say the crowns witness, the officer), doesn't attend your lawyer can ask the JP, for the charges to be dismissed. If your not there either the opportunity is gone. If the JP is ****** they will have the crown read into the record the alleged facts, of the case and can make a ruling based solely upon that.
I agree with Rob, a year and you haven't discussed strategy with your lawyer. now if it was because you couldn't get a day off work, then you have learned NOTHING. This should have been your #1 priority until it was finished with. If it is because your lawyer couldn't make time, you hired a crappy defence lawyer, who will if you don't attend likely just throw in the white towel and let you bend over.
You are going to be screwed once that insurance conviction is registered. Your going to the facility market for insurance, if as your name suggest you ride a 1000RR, it will EASILY be well in excess of $10,000 for the next several years. So either your going to a 250, or riding dirty, (which of course if caught again you will be totally screwed).
Hate to say it, but you have created a hornets nest for yourself and still appear to not be taking this as seriously as it is. So to me you haven't learned form your mistakes at all as you have let this get totally out of hand, and have done NOTHING, other than throw some money to a lawyer, to rectify the issue.
Is your bike NOW insured? How long has it been insured? Hopefully, you insured it RIGHT after, (as in the next day), to show the court you took responsibility. Once your convicted you MUST advise your insurer of the convictions, (Failing to do so, means they can deny ANY and ALL claims submitted), plus if they discover them, they WILL cancel your policy. If your convicted of both careless and insurance, you can expect a letter VERY soon advising your policy has been cancelled. Which again will mean HIGHER premiums IF you try to get insurance again.
Don't attend, the JP "could" issue a bench warrant, although HIGHLY unlike, as you are represented. Also if you fail to attend, you surrender your options such as a possible appeal etc.
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