Buying a property / cabin / cottage for 90% AirBNB. Anyone done it?

[Mad Mike]

there you go bud.....the boating life....

I've slept in cardboard boxes, vans and trucks. Now I live with my three dogs in a 25-foot sailboat in Humber Bay

Last month, Tate Hill's neighbours in Mimico raised more than $11,000 to help him take care of his dogs and dock his boat in a marina

torontolife.com

I actually knew a guy that lived on his boat. Was cheaper than renting in Toronto, and easier than coming to work from his farm near Barrie. Full year round.

It’s about $6000 for all year dock, wifi and 30amp hydro in Toronto. Boats are cold in the winter.

 

[nobbie48]

A friend sold his Haliburton cottage before Covid and even then he said he could cover his taxes and insurance with a couple weeks rentals. I can see cottager associations getting the politicians to ban excessive short term rentals. Even one or two bad rentals could make the owner undesirable on the lake.

As far as sharing bed linen and toilets one has to get over the germ phobia. In restaurants you eat off used plates with used forks.

If renting out on an occasional basis I would have a greater problem with people messing with my stuff and leaving it in the wrong place or the trunk of their cars. However the cottage my daughter rented a years or so ago was decorated quite nicely but when you really looked at the decorations they were items one could pick up at garage sales for next to nothing. Who cares if a book or knick knack is taken or broken if it only cost fifty cents.

 

[nobbie48]

It’s about $6000 for all year dock, wifi and 30amp hydro in Toronto. Boats are cold in the winter.

A friend and his wife lived aboard a 35 footer at Port Credit. Nice in the summer for him but not as much for her. She worked and two pair of jeans and a couple tee shirts wasn't enough wardrobe.

Condensation is a problem in the winter unless you can stop breathing and cooking. Condensation = mildew.

Need a poop in the middle of the night? It's a long cold walk.

Showers are worse.

 

[nobbie48]

Sure it wasn’t a panzorrati? LoL I was at that Polish restaurant a few times....so good!
Once again I’ll plug a friends restaurant for Polish food....Albatross Pub on lakeshore between Islington and Kipling.

only reason we don’t do takeout anymore from there is cause it’s too far door to door and food would be cold. Might try it next weekend or tomorrow when traffic is minimal.

Kovalsky's on the Queensway, east of Royal York has been our go to.

 

[Mad Mike]

A friend and his wife lived aboard a 35 footer at Port Credit. Nice in the summer for him but not as much for her. She worked and two pair of jeans and a couple tee shirts wasn't enough wardrobe.

Condensation is a problem in the winter unless you can stop breathing and cooking. Condensation = mildew.

Need a poop in the middle of the night? It's a long cold walk.

Showers are worse.

Need a better boat. Head and shower should be on board.

 

[GreyGhost]

Septic system is going to be a big issue in this plan getting approval will be next to impossible and many places you actually need your own treatment plant. I have a treatment plant in my front yard needs hydro and bi yearly inspection probably costs around 3000 a year to operate and maintain. A composting toilet will be a way simpler option. Also getting the building permits etc could be a hassle you will need to be big enough to meet all codes around 1200 sq ft in many places. I have a feeling most of these are done illegally with no permit or permission.

Sent from my K87CA using Tapatalk

I would go composting toilet if he has power to run it. This house came with one outside for the pool. Apparently it is good for 3 people full time. Try to keep people from dumping random garbage/tampons in and it just works. Requires cleanout every few months IIRC if being used full time. The downside in a rental situation is mine has a manual dial that you adjust based on load. If your rental load is reasonably constant you can just pick the right setting and leave it alone.

 

[FullMotoJacket]

or igloos,
I wondered about that one, is there no size limit or building standards on igloo construction ? I think we found a loophole.
Igloo Hotels

ah crap :/ gave away another billion dollar idea

You're a little late to the party.

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[Trials]

If you are on a big chunk of land and you can put an outhouse anywhere without a permit :/ why would anyone mess with anything else

I don't understand those big concerts in the farm fields that for the want of 1 weekend concert, bring in dozens of chemical ports-potty's. It's a farm field and the farmer is passing up on a chance to fertilize their fields for free


Potable water supply is a completely different thing, you can get into a lot of problems if you provide potable water and it's not good.

 

[mimico_polak]

Kovalsky's on the Queensway, east of Royal York has been our go to.

Never tried it or heard of it. Will check it out thanks!

 

[48Connor]

I have a cousin who bought a cottage up near Muskoka that he uses as a full time AirB&B. Honestly can't remember the name of the lake its on or I'd post the listing. It is essentially an average sized house on the water that he bought for like $600k in 2015, and rents for $2000-3000/wk depending on the season. You get the summer season for people wanting the water, the hunters come in the fall, and the snowmobilers come in the winter, and it rented around 75% of the year.

All sounds good, but every Sunday he and his family drive 2hrs up there, and spend the 4hrs in between guests clean, doing laundry, cutting grass, fixing stuff, a then spend 2hrs driving home again. He's making good money, but its a whole other job. Plus the odd time when something breaks and its 7pm on a Wednesday and he's gotta drive up there and fix it.

The people next door live there fulltime, so anytime the renters make too much noise he gets a call. He's had to limit the number of guests, because he'd rent it out to a group of 4 and the neighbor would call and say there is 14 people there partying and its 12am. He's now gone so far as to only select renters who have children (mainly in the summer) since they are more respectful to the property/neighbors.

Putting up a <120sqft bunkie in the middle of a forest doesn't do anything for me though.

 

[Evoex]

I have a cousin who bought a cottage up near Muskoka that he uses as a full time AirB&B. Honestly can't remember the name of the lake its on or I'd post the listing. It is essentially an average sized house on the water that he bought for like $600k in 2015, and rents for $2000-3000/wk depending on the season. You get the summer season for people wanting the water, the hunters come in the fall, and the snowmobilers come in the winter, and it rented around 75% of the year.

All sounds good, but every Sunday he and his family drive 2hrs up there, and spend the 4hrs in between guests clean, doing laundry, cutting grass, fixing stuff, a then spend 2hrs driving home again. He's making good money, but its a whole other job. Plus the odd time when something breaks and its 7pm on a Wednesday and he's gotta drive up there and fix it.

The people next door live there fulltime, so anytime the renters make too much noise he gets a call. He's had to limit the number of guests, because he'd rent it out to a group of 4 and the neighbor would call and say there is 14 people there partying and its 12am. He's now gone so far as to only select renters who have children (mainly in the summer) since they are more respectful to the property/neighbors.

Putting up a <120sqft bunkie in the middle of a forest doesn't do anything for me though.

this is my concern going forward.

our lake community is pretty small, everyone knows each other. They stopped development on it back in the 80s when they found endangered species..so it's nice that is hasn't grown. i imagine I'll have to develop some criteria, or I'll get the neighbors calling to complain about drunk music parties at 4am and being on the lake you can imagine how that sound will travel...

the cleanup aspect is something I'm waffling on. my cousin lives in Belleville, so it's only a 45 minute commute there. i was thinking of offering her a bigger slice of the pie if she's down to manage the upkeep but i think we'll just hire someone relatively local to go up and cleanup/fix things.

 

[48Connor]

this is my concern going forward.

our lake community is pretty small, everyone knows each other. They stopped development on it back in the 80s when they found endangered species..so it's nice that is hasn't grown. i imagine I'll have to develop some criteria, or I'll get the neighbors calling to complain about drunk music parties at 4am and being on the lake you can imagine how that sound will travel...

the cleanup aspect is something I'm waffling on. my cousin lives in Belleville, so it's only a 45 minute commute there. i was thinking of offering her a bigger slice of the pie if she's down to manage the upkeep but i think we'll just hire someone relatively local to go up and cleanup/fix things.

Yeah its crazy on a calm lake at night how far sound travels. Someone could be 500yards away having a normal conversation and you can hear every word of it.

My parents have a cottage just East of Bon Echo. They thought about renting it out (mainly just to family friends, coworkers, friends of friends, etc.) on the weeks no one was there, but it's just not "turn key" enough to make it worth the hassle.

 

[Evoex]

Yeah its crazy on a calm lake at night how far sound travels. Someone could be 500yards away having a normal conversation and you can hear every word of it.

My parents have a cottage just East of Bon Echo. They thought about renting it out (mainly just to family friends, coworkers, friends of friends, etc.) on the weeks no one was there, but it's just not "turn key" enough to make it worth the hassle.

Oh where about? that's my area, just outside Cloyne (south east)

 

[48Connor]

Oh where about? that's my area, just outside Cloyne (south east)

Little Mississagagon. Small lake, ~15 cottages. Good spot for swimming/ATVing though. Also 5 min drive to Mississagaon or Kash boat launches to put the big boat in.

Where about are you?

 

[Evoex]

Little Mississagagon. Small lake, ~15 cottages. Good spot for swimming/ATVing though. Also 5 min drive to Mississagaon or Kash boat launches to put the big boat in.

Where about are you?

Shabomeka Lake, same road as Bon Echo camp ground, just further down. This cottage has road access, our last one here didn't.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Found a great representation this evening of what I envision setting up.



Simple, Rustic.

Found a nice sized chunk of wooded acreage about 20 minutes from my house on a fairly main road in an area not encumbered by any overbearing AirB&B municipal issues, nicely wooded with electricity at the road, just over $300K for the property.

In my head I see a straight shot road in to the woods with a number of different but nicely secluded "sites" cut into the woods with one of these on each and a place to park. All low voltage electrical, solar or wind. Both could be a challenge in a wooded area. Jury still out on that one (still just dreaming) but running in electrical from the road and feeding each cabin would certainly be a pricy venture.

Wish I was better versed on how much a basic structure like this would cost to construct. I've always loved A-Frames - they just speak quintessential "Cabin in the woods" to me. Done up simple but rustic inside (typical cabin decor), a fire pit out front, a couple of Muskoka chairs on the porch, and you've got a $150-$200/night AirBNB easily right there.

Dreaming indeed.

 

[GreyGhost]

Found a great representation this evening of what I envision setting up.

View attachment 46336

Simple, Rustic.

Found a nice sized chunk of wooded acreage about 20 minutes from my house on a fairly main road in an area not encumbered by any overbearing AirB&B municipal issues, nicely wooded with electricity at the road, just over $300K for the property.

In my head I see a straight shot road in to the woods with a number of different but nicely secluded "sites" cut into the woods with one of these on each and a place to park. All low voltage electrical, solar or wind. Both could be a challenge in a wooded area. Jury still out on that one (still just dreaming) but running in electrical from the road and feeding each cabin would certainly be a pricy venture.

Wish I was better versed on how much a basic structure like this would cost to construct. I've always loved A-Frames - they just speak quintessential "Cabin in the woods" to me. Done up simple but rustic inside (typical cabin decor), a fire pit out front, a couple of Muskoka chairs on the porch, and you've got a $150-$200/night AirBNB easily right there.

Dreaming indeed.

Cost could vary dramatically depending on construction used. For instance, you could build something gorgeous that would last for a long time (cedar deck, standing seam roof, stone hearth, cedar shake facade etc) or you could do cheap and cheerful (pressure treated, shingles, insert style fireplace, T1-11 facade etc). Cheap and cheerful will have a much better ROI. Who is plowing your network of driveways? Will the municipality let you construct multiple dwellings? I would be very surprised if they would that close to the GTA. You may get around this by building "storage sheds" or hunting blinds but you won't be allowed to have electricity or plumbing in them. How are you dealing with sewage? Will airbnb guests accept an outhouse or composting toilet? How are you dealing with water to all of these cabins? I assume Airbnb guests expect showers? I would hazard a guess that power, water and waste will add up to well into five figures for each cabin.

My parents garage runs off a generator as a Hydro drop would be ~20K + $$ a month as it would be a separate account. Running from the house is possible but would suck as it is hundreds of feet away and wire and trenching would add up.

If you were allowed to build multiple cabins, I would probably put a propane tank beside each one and use a gas fireplace as the heat source (also adds to the ambiance). Gas stove and potentially gas hot water heater and your electricity needs are minimal. Something for the composting toilet and a bit of house power for your guests electronics and some led light fixtures. You could probably get away with a setup from an RV or boat to power each cabin.

 

[PrivatePilot]

You should spend some time looking around AirBNB in the "unique stays" section and see what's out there.

No electricity? "Off grid".
No water/shower? "Glamping".
Compost toilet? "Eco Friendly".

And most of these locations, if managed right (IE they're clean, in a nicely wooded area where people feel "Connected to nature" and the host is friendly) are insanely highly rated and often booked for months in advance.

There's lots of places exactly like this. Yes, no showers, no running water, no electricity...vault toilet or indeed... composting toilets. City people eat these places up as an alternative to camping.

Here's one (for example) that we have booked ourselves in March. I've mentioned it a few times in this thread. Checks all the boxes - no kitchen, no hydro, no water, no shower, compost toilet. $220/night. Sits at around 90% occupancy constantly and is booked months in advance. There was not a SINGLE day available through December and there's not a SINGLE day available in January. February and March are filling up by the day.

Treehouse in Blackstock · ★4.82 · 1 bedroom · 1 bed · 1 bath

Deluxe Tree House 1 Hour from Toronto

www.airbnb.ca

This particular cabin has been on AirBNB for many years (although when the property changed hands the previous listing with thousands of reviews had to be replaced by this new one) and years later here we are, still always booked...and a 4.85 star rating.

At 80% winter occupancy that little cabin in the woods is making the host a staggering $5500 every month. And in the summer it's basically 100% occupancy, solid, April through November. $6600/month.

 

[crankcall]

The cabin in your photo with steel 'roofing' running top to bottom solves so many issues, zero snow load, super fast construction, recyclable LOL, and will last an easy 50-80 yrs.
We had one as a cottage a million years ago, back half was a loft so bedroom up that was open, bedroom and compost toilet in back off to one side, kitchen in back next to back door. Front was patio doors level with deck.
It was on pilings and literally built in two weeks.

We ran the fridge and stove on propane, brought in 150lb tanks, one tank lasted most of the summer. It was at the base of a big slope so we had a gravity feed water system, pyramid of 10 -45gal blue plastic barrels cascaded to a hose that coming down a 35ft hill , 90 ft away provided 'city like pressure' at the taps. We did not drink it, it was shower and dishes.

electric was set of panels that powered a battery bank of used batteries we bough from a recycler that has a contract with Bell Canada, they have stations with massive battery banks that power the Bell system and those batteries are changed out on a schedule, whether they are cooked or not, 2 panels and 12 batteries got us enough juice for a 3-4 hour of DVD movies on a rainy day, lighting all evening, would not run a blow drier longer than 15 mins LOL

 

[mimico_polak]

You should spend some time looking around AirBNB in the "unique stays" section and see what's out there.

No electricity? "Off grid".
No water/shower? "Glamping".
Compost toilet? "Eco Friendly".

And most of these locations, if managed right (IE they're clean, in a nicely wooded area where people feel "Connected to nature" and the host is friendly) are insanely highly rated and often booked for months in advance.

There's lots of places exactly like this. Yes, no showers, no running water, no electricity...vault toilet or indeed... composting toilets. City people eat these places up as an alternative to camping.

Here's one (for example) that we have booked ourselves in March. I've mentioned it a few times in this thread. Checks all the boxes - no kitchen, no hydro, no water, no shower, compost toilet. $220/night. Sits at around 90% occupancy constantly and is booked months in advance. There was not a SINGLE day available through December and there's not a SINGLE day available in January. February and March are filling up by the day.

Treehouse in Blackstock · ★4.82 · 1 bedroom · 1 bed · 1 bath

Deluxe Tree House 1 Hour from Toronto

www.airbnb.ca

This particular cabin has been on AirBNB for many years (although when the property changed hands the previous listing with thousands of reviews had to be replaced by this new one) and years later here we are, still always booked...and a 4.85 star rating.

At 80% winter occupancy that little cabin in the woods is making the host a staggering $5500 every month. And in the summer it's basically 100% occupancy, solid, April through November. $6600/month.

I need to convince my parents to rent out their wasaga cottage....I’m sure it would do well.