Time for some new friends. Lol. We need more competitors. If there were 200 people racing more peeps would come to watch.
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2015 SOAR Rulebook including Ontario & Quebec Championship Point Structure
- Thread starter kneedragger88
- Start date
Time for some new friends. Lol. We need more competitors. If there were 200 people racing more peeps would come to watch.
Sundays seem to be really busy for the ~30 year olds. Between their activites, weddings, cottages and life in general I understand.
We need to get more track day riders to come compete or watch. They seem to have this idea that there's less track time or it costs more money to race. It's more fun especially when you actually race your buddies, not just play follow the leader at a track day.
We need to get more track day riders to come compete or watch. They seem to have this idea that there's less track time or it costs more money to race. It's more fun especially when you actually race your buddies, not just play follow the leader at a track day.
Snipes20
Well-known member
Back to the original point issue. With the points based and biased to those who participate (aka just finish), the championships will have much less value than before. I hope this will bring more people out but with this system but it will make me show up less. If there is no championship to chase then there is no reason to push. and thats what racing is suppose to be about. My style and many others style (hornblower, card) means that we will crash in some races. playing it safe is not the way I want to race and Im sure its not what people want to watch, if people even come to watch. my 2 cents.
BigEvilDoer
Well-known member
Yeah, but when we get biotched at because we're not racers, and the only reason we are there is to make the practice day financially feasible... it really dampens the spirits. I know of 2 groups of people who were completely turned off and cancelled their plans for separate endurance teams because of this.
So, either let track day only guys come and don't *****, or take the financial lumps and have it be racers only.
Every Friday practice I've been to has had a "track day" group for the last 3.5 years. I have no issue with it, it gives me a break. This is how it's been at Shannonville for as long as I've been racing.
I'm not on track with them so what difference does it make to me?
If your out there going 10s a lap slower I'll just go around you but it can get frustrating when your trying to put a few fast laps together and your constantly running into traffic. Even so I've never "biotched" at anyone for coming out.
I'm not on track with them so what difference does it make to me?
If your out there going 10s a lap slower I'll just go around you but it can get frustrating when your trying to put a few fast laps together and your constantly running into traffic. Even so I've never "biotched" at anyone for coming out.
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There was a young kid who did all the Endurance races last year on a 2 stroke dirt bike(100cc?). Add to that fact there is also a few 250's circulating around, you won't be getting bothered or ******* at by anyone from the endurance camp.
Track day riders who want to try racing are always welcome in my camp. Having made the transition from tracking to racing on my own, having someone to give assistance to new racers can make life a lot easier.
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atss2006
Well-known member
I'm not sure about the complaints about the points. yeah if you crash or out or miss a race or two, you might not win the SOAR championship. But if you're actually racing to be the champ, that's not the one you care about. It would be the Canadian (or whatever its being called) finals. SOAR just gets you to the final. Win the final and win it all. Crash, miss, screw up on the final and yeah, you're not the champ. If there's a guy that wins SOAR by being safe, he probably won't win the final and thus not be the champ.
no?
Side rant about attendance.
Nothing at the track for spectators (speaking more about GBM). They don't even have the concessions open! Crap spots for paying spectators to sit, and nothing else to see or do. If you're a casual fan or just stumbling on the race, you're lost and clueless. Friends and family is all that goes. With what few people go, it should be free or $5.00 donation. If you stay over then pay the camping fee. When they get enough people to make a difference then start introducing a fee.
The other thing is exposure....there is none. Even CSBK has none. Why no gorilla marketing? I can't believe there's no annual SOAR tee shirt, beer holder, hat, whatever being made. Plaster it with the track layouts, location, some sponsors. I know Ken is busy with a million other things but it could be done by anyone (John B's at the races all the time and his daughter is an artist) with Kens approval and SOAR getting a cut. BAM no work for Ken and you have shirts floating around. We'd all be wearing them at the bike show...maybe almost as many of us as the leather vest crowd...probably no. All the kids at Tims will want them and decide for once to actually ride their bikes..head to GB for the day and check stuff out. Grab a shirt, check out the races, the beach is 5 min away, double bonus.
done ranting..don't even remember what I was going on about..getting old sucks
no?
Side rant about attendance.
Nothing at the track for spectators (speaking more about GBM). They don't even have the concessions open! Crap spots for paying spectators to sit, and nothing else to see or do. If you're a casual fan or just stumbling on the race, you're lost and clueless. Friends and family is all that goes. With what few people go, it should be free or $5.00 donation. If you stay over then pay the camping fee. When they get enough people to make a difference then start introducing a fee.
The other thing is exposure....there is none. Even CSBK has none. Why no gorilla marketing? I can't believe there's no annual SOAR tee shirt, beer holder, hat, whatever being made. Plaster it with the track layouts, location, some sponsors. I know Ken is busy with a million other things but it could be done by anyone (John B's at the races all the time and his daughter is an artist) with Kens approval and SOAR getting a cut. BAM no work for Ken and you have shirts floating around. We'd all be wearing them at the bike show...maybe almost as many of us as the leather vest crowd...probably no. All the kids at Tims will want them and decide for once to actually ride their bikes..head to GB for the day and check stuff out. Grab a shirt, check out the races, the beach is 5 min away, double bonus.
done ranting..don't even remember what I was going on about..getting old sucks
That's a sad story. What happened? I guess I don't really go out of my way to welcome new racers or track day guys but I don't think I've ever shunned them either. If they ever actually want to ask me something I'm more than happy to offer my thoughts.
I don't think you really understand how the various series work. CSBK is a National series and it's not just a final race, it's a full season albeit only in three months. It's rare for someone to compete in a full season with CSBK series as well as a regional series like SOAR or RACE. The costs associated with racing in CSBK are quite high compared to regionals just because of the transportation costs. For many a regional championship is the only championship they'll ever seriously compete for. For some the regionals like RACE/SOAR are a stepping stone to CSBK or even AMA but for most the regional series are the highest level of competition they'll ever see.
Its a very complicated problem.
With no factory contingency and considerably less prize money there are fewer Pros who can afford to keep at it. With fewer Pros the two feature classes (Pro 600 and Pro Superbike) aren't as awesome as they really could be. Without the awesome classes and big grids there is lower fan turnout. With lower turnout there is less exposure for sponsors and lower spectator revenue for the track. With less exposure there is less factory contingency and tire money.... and the cycle continues.
So how do you fix it?
BigEvilDoer
Well-known member
Dricked - to clarify my point... everyone agrees that it would be great to see larger grids lining up. Where are these people going to come from? The track day riding community.
I personally have been to 2 race practice days (and a good friend of mine, also here on the forum) attended another. All 3 days began with a rant about how it would be so much better if track day guys weren't there, how it should really be racers only. (Since then, I have sent $0 towards that organization, and chances are, never will again.)
It's precisely this that made 2 teams of riders (7 guys in total) walk away from the idea of racing.
Now I'm not saying to kiss track rider's @ss's or anything like that, but treat them with a mutual respect. Without them, the practice days are a financial hardship, or nigh impossible from what I've heard.
I personally have been to 2 race practice days (and a good friend of mine, also here on the forum) attended another. All 3 days began with a rant about how it would be so much better if track day guys weren't there, how it should really be racers only. (Since then, I have sent $0 towards that organization, and chances are, never will again.)
It's precisely this that made 2 teams of riders (7 guys in total) walk away from the idea of racing.
Now I'm not saying to kiss track rider's @ss's or anything like that, but treat them with a mutual respect. Without them, the practice days are a financial hardship, or nigh impossible from what I've heard.
Caboose
It's usually the simplest stuff.
Our first race weekend:
- We had been there all day for a track day and I was met by a ****** racer with a "you are in my spot, you need to move your trailer and setup.
That is unique but everyone that is new asks:
- where do I register?
- how do I affix a transponder
- what do I need to do for tech
- how do I know when my sessions are?
- can I walk the track at the end of the day?
- "I paid someone to drill and wire my bike but tech says I fail since I missed one". What do I do?
- what do I need to do to get my tires changed at the vender?
- is there someone here who can patch my leathers? Sell me #s for my bike?
Etc
It is the small stuff.
Bike operation etc type questions come later once they "are" a racer.
It's usually the simplest stuff.
Our first race weekend:
- We had been there all day for a track day and I was met by a ****** racer with a "you are in my spot, you need to move your trailer and setup.
That is unique but everyone that is new asks:
- where do I register?
- how do I affix a transponder
- what do I need to do for tech
- how do I know when my sessions are?
- can I walk the track at the end of the day?
- "I paid someone to drill and wire my bike but tech says I fail since I missed one". What do I do?
- what do I need to do to get my tires changed at the vender?
- is there someone here who can patch my leathers? Sell me #s for my bike?
Etc
It is the small stuff.
Bike operation etc type questions come later once they "are" a racer.
James Peterson told me he had a really disheartening experience at his first RACE event too. I've been told that some folks there are pretty unfriendly, looking back I can see how some people were that way....... I think the jerks have left to be honest.
I guess when I first started going to RACE I already knew a few people there so luckily I was spared some of the growing pains that new racers experience. Where to pit, where is tech, how do I race, etc.
I apologize on behalf of the jerks. I feel like I am pretty easy to get along with and I like just about everyone on the track (but not everyone).
Some people actually pay for their spots. If you pay to sponsor a class for the season you get some perks, a reserved parking spot is one of them, and they used to hand out a parking map that showed where the reserve spots are. I think I only saw that at CSBK this year. FYI you're in Jodi's old spot.
He's moved up to centre stage....jerk lol.
In all honesty I didn't know anyone my first race weekend other than John Bickle who I'd had clean my leathers over the winter prior to taking the school. Everyone I met at RACE seemed to be nice enough and all my competitors were more than willing to answer my questions especially the one where I started crapping my pants about qualifying being a heat race! That I was not prepared for lol.
In all honesty I didn't know anyone my first race weekend other than John Bickle who I'd had clean my leathers over the winter prior to taking the school. Everyone I met at RACE seemed to be nice enough and all my competitors were more than willing to answer my questions especially the one where I started crapping my pants about qualifying being a heat race! That I was not prepared for lol.
Well, if you judge the entire paddock by a few then that is wrong.
I will say this is a sport of sink or swim. Liabilities are easy to find at a race track.
When I raced I didn't work on my bike 20-30 hours a week so I could work my @33 off at the track.
But if you needed help and showed sincerity then I was there.
I know most people welcome new riders. Track day riders should be shown the red carpet.
If some of us are butt heads well then ask someone else.
You WILL NOT find a better bunch of people to help you in a time of need then at the track.
So don't judge the library by one book!
If you do,, you will miss out on the most fun you can have,,endurance racing with your buddies.
You owe it to yourselves to come back and pit beside others.
AND ,maybe we do need to show a bit more hospitality,,,
But we are trying to fix a lot these days,,,,sorry.
I will say this is a sport of sink or swim. Liabilities are easy to find at a race track.
When I raced I didn't work on my bike 20-30 hours a week so I could work my @33 off at the track.
But if you needed help and showed sincerity then I was there.
I know most people welcome new riders. Track day riders should be shown the red carpet.
If some of us are butt heads well then ask someone else.
You WILL NOT find a better bunch of people to help you in a time of need then at the track.
So don't judge the library by one book!
If you do,, you will miss out on the most fun you can have,,endurance racing with your buddies.
You owe it to yourselves to come back and pit beside others.
AND ,maybe we do need to show a bit more hospitality,,,
But we are trying to fix a lot these days,,,,sorry.
boyoboy
Well-known member
it cannot be that bad, is it? when i first went racing in 94(?) i was alone for most of the races. making friends at the track (RACE) came easily if you were willing to approach people. i was racing in lwt prod'n and 250gp, and the grid had fair numbers for the classes ~15. there wasn't a lot of big egos. colin fraser was cool and helped me out a bit, and by the 2nd or 3rd weekend i had befriended about 4-5 other racers. it was great! so good in fact that by seasons end a group of 3 racers made me an offer to go with them to daytona bike week the following march- they had room for my bike and had already rented a condo for the week!
today the emphasis is on 600's and 1000's. its expensive, highly intense (fast), and i think,-stress inducing. yes - sink or swim. perhaps this makes people less approachable? too few people look at the lwt bikes - an ego thing i think. want to have fun, race in a lwt class where people aren't intent on being the next SBK champion, and have some fun. i am really surprised at the lack of riders running in the lwt classes.
and thats all im going to say about that..
today the emphasis is on 600's and 1000's. its expensive, highly intense (fast), and i think,-stress inducing. yes - sink or swim. perhaps this makes people less approachable? too few people look at the lwt bikes - an ego thing i think. want to have fun, race in a lwt class where people aren't intent on being the next SBK champion, and have some fun. i am really surprised at the lack of riders running in the lwt classes.
and thats all im going to say about that..
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N3WMAN
Well-known member
I think it goes both ways. You met some racers who were ***** and it turned you off of racing. Most racers have met more than their share of trackday guys who were ***** and made them have a bad attitude and paint them all with the same brush. I wouldn't let what others do bother you and race because you want to.
The SOAR/RACE paddock are filled with the friendliest people you will find and most are more than willing to help you out any way they can. Some of the American riders who race in SOAR did a WERA round last year and said the atmosphere sucked because nobody in the paddock talked to anybody else, it was all serious business, and they liked SOAR because everyone is friendly and willing to help each other out.
Snipes20
Well-known member
I think you talking about the magic number you reach to get to the extra race to decide who wins over all the different "areas". But if that is the case and there are no real champions from regional racing then why would I race any more then to just get to that magic number?? Im sure the number wont be that high because what they want is large grid so it will end up being more of a meet for racer from all over to come and have a "fun race". And the faster guys will get to that number in 2 or 3 races.
The so called finals are a great idea and Im happy that ken is trying something to bring racing back to canada (very admirable). However, there are no real series that has a single race to decide it all. to many factors can go wrong and most of the time you will have a camp who is not the fastest. take am superbike at soar this year. if it came to the last race....the winner of the champion whould get nothing and the same with the 3rd place rider. in fact it would have been a rider that had half the points of the real champ that would have had the title. Not my idea of a good series
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