Dual Sport or dedicated off-roader???

mimico_polak

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Hey guys,
so I'm drooling over this new cb500 and then coming back from the cottage (wasaga) I see guys riding the trails and it looks damn fun! So of course I get sidetracked and now looking at other options....
Id be primarily interested in riding trails without any jumps or anything like that. Would you guys get a dual sport? Or would you recommend a dedicated off roader? I'm still interested in doing touring on roads so money would be an issue but I have space to keep a second bike up there....also any recommendations? I'm 5'7 so can't go for something very tall.
 
Dual Sport. Unless you want to add a truck and trailer to the equation as well...
Anything 250cc and up is gonnna start getting tall.
 
Or the KLR650 - fine on trails bit heavy for steep and rutty - tractor like pull and so many accessories.
What is you inseam tho?
it's 35" seat ( can be lowered )

This will tour at moderate speeds ( thats' my goal in Aus this year after mostly trail and forest track last year.
So a better windscreen and seat and I;m okay to go 500k + a day at 100 kph.

There is a balance for gearing but the front gear is easy to change.

Prices are stable and the motor bulletproof - I bought my first one for 4k and sold if for 4.1k a year later.

There is a huge fraternity of KLR650 riders around the world and really the weight is not that bad for a 650 but it's called the oil tank on stilts for good reason.

Big tank is nice 25 ltrs so range is excellent on road or off and you can find them tricked out with al sorts of goodies.

this is really nicely kitted out and that's the top of the price zone and the newer model

http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-cars-veh...sories-Excellent-condition-W0QQAdIdZ423691507

$T2eC16dHJF0E9nmFSz)1BQgL!-v6)w~~48_20.JPG


Strip the gear off and its a decent trail warrior weighing 386 dry. The differences from the pre 2008 are here and a good assessment.

http://www.klr650.net/2008_kawasaki_klr650_review/

You'll have no issue on stuff like this

shot2sm.jpg
and decent streams. And most of the accessible off road are like this. S Ontario sucks for legal off road so being able to enjoy the ride to the better areas in the north is important.

No question the 400 is a wickedly good offroad that can do on road but I think the KLR can be adapted better and if this is your first venture off road then not a bad choice.

You do need to learn to pick it up yourself :D

Add bark busters to it first thing. Tire choice is tricky - I'd tend to say go full 50/50 if you are intending to get into the trails and mud and some hills.

Of course as mentioned two sets of wheels is ideal but I'd say in S Ontario 50/50 or 70/30 ( currently I'm 50/50 on the front and 80/20 on the rear. ) Hwy/offroad.

Everything is decently priced on the pre - 2008 as there is 20 years of the same model as a market.

Screenshot2012-04-24atApr24201211305AM.jpg


my set up in Aus pre mud, bark busters and 50/50 front tire.

This river was simply too wide for us to cross so 110 km back in 35 degree heat - we were only 8 km from the pub on the hwy when I took this.
http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m269/macdoc/travel/australia%202012
/Screenshot2012-03-07atMar72012105232AM.jpg

The KLR had no issue with this
Screenshot2012-03-02atMar2201273022AM.jpg


Tho a muddy hill later taught me I still could take a fall ( tires mostly ), need new rubber AND bark busters - riding out with a broken clutch called on some rusty skills.
These guys were/are serious off roaders and so have bikes similar to the 400 mentioned - but they never tour them and the muscle guy on the right road most of the way home on the gravel shoulder at 100 kph to save his knobbies.

halfwaypoint.jpg


much fun tho.

Here's the KLR 650 thread
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=742912

and the Cairns area thread
http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=757409&page=15
The CREB track is legendary - I'm not likely to ever ride it as it's only accessible in the dry season.


This was the closest I got -
Crebclosedwithgoodreason.jpg


this is the same crossing in the dry season from the Cairns riders Creb run - the KLR650 would tractor through that easily but you would want to alter your gearing.

LionsDenSept124-MicksKTMcrossingtheDaintree.jpg


and this sign is to be taken seriously - some vehicles end up helicoptered out.

Crebclosedsigndetail.jpg


But all of this is just 30 min to an hour from my home in Cairns.

You'd need to get into Northern Ontario to find good riding and the legal aspects are a horror :(

But still being able to poke down some trails is very much fun. BTW there is a BMW off road course available and you get to ride their dual sports which are similar to the KLR650. but go on up to the 1200s dualies. Those are not my cuppa.
 
Last edited:
I rode the Honda CRF250L around for a whole day in the Ganaraska forest with Trail Tours!! Was tons of fun! http://motorcycle.honda.ca/dual-sport/crf250l

Super capable bike, tons of power, easy to throw around!

In case you want to rip around on the trails for a half day (recommended) or full day (if you want to not be able to move for a few days after): http://www.trailtour.com/

-Jamie M.
 
I am lusting after the upcoming KTM freeride 350- Road legal, 30 hp, 220 lbs, an awesome mix between a motocross, trials, and enduro bike. .... there is also a 200 lb electric version coming that is already on sale in Europe...[video=youtube;n2eUucG4gwU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2eUucG4gwU[/video].
 
It depends on what you really want out of your bike. I've thought of a dual sport but I couldn't go from a full mx bike in the woods to an overweight underpowered slug. If you want to just ride fire roads and the odd tight trail you'd probably be fine with one. If you have a truck then go with an actual dirtbike, they're cheap and fairly easy to maintain as long as its not a total pos to begin with and real dirt tires will give you awesome traction and confidence when the conditions aren't perfect.
 
Motocross bike if you want to hit the best trails. While I have no experience with dual sports I don't know how well they hold up on rocky/rutty terrain. But if you're just thinking dirt paths a dual sport would probably be fine
 
Hey guys thanks for all the great suggestions. As for my goals my primary goal is to do some longer distance touring and once in a while just explore some dirt trails. None of the heavy off road (rocks and cobble) but some regular light trails in the woods. Maybe some gravel and dirt trails in Ontario. I have a 30" inseam and can flat foot the CBR but bigger than that its one leg only or tip toe. I've looked at the KLR650 and its just too tall for me. The KLX250 seemed like a good dual when I test rode it but it was on road tires only. The BMW 650 interests me but not sure how well suited it is for off roaring or its primarily a touring bike. Maybe signing up for a trail ride like Jamie suggested is best to get familiar with it and see how much I like it.
Cottage is in wasaga so I'd primarily ride there.
 
Maybe signing up for a trail ride like Jamie suggested is best to get familiar with it and see how much I like it.
It's absolutely amazing! Great instruction, mind blowing trails. Just tell the leader what type of trail you want and boom, it's there. Want to try climbing the sand hill? Done (Warning: If you think you aren't gonna make it get her turned around before you bury it deep!). Want super tight slow technical trail? Done. Want fast hilly trails with lots of whops, done!!

Do it :)

-Jamie M.
 
I am lusting after the upcoming KTM freeride 350- Road legal, 30 hp, 220 lbs, an awesome mix between a motocross, trials, and enduro bike.].

That video was pretty awesome. Thats some serious single track.
 
Quote Originally Posted by mimico_polak View Post
Maybe signing up for a trail ride like Jamie suggested is best to get familiar with it and see how much I like it.

See if you can try a couple different sizes of bikes.
The BMW 650 is lower than the KLR but wider so no gain.
Both bikes can be lowered at least 3".

I'm 31" inseam and "okay" on the KLR once on it and can flat foot as they do sag as they are sprung softly with long travel. You get used to the taller bike so don't give up on the KLR as it's a good tourer as is the either version of the BMW 650 - there is a twin and a single.
Go to the KLR 650 forum and ask other riders with the same inseam.
You can gain a bit with the boots ( you need decent lugs for offroad anyways. I use my Gortex hiking boots and they gain me an inch.

If you are up at the Forks a rider named Shirley has the earlier 650 single and she's quite short and has it nicely rigged.
She's an instructor - ask around she may be on the board.

From your description and knowing Ontario you need something bigger than a 250 to "mostly tour" with a bit of off road.
Don't let the seat height get to you - most of the off road bikes are in the same range and all of the popular ones have lowering kits.

I just bought the Sargent seat for mine - more comfy and lower than the stock board.

Here are some links

http://www.klr650.net/forums/showthread.php?t=29578

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=213978

you know this one really has all the right gear including a proper offroad tire as an addition. Very good choice of bits.

2008 Kawasaki KLR, with just over 23000 kms on it. I'm the second owner.
It comes with Pelican Storm hard bags (one of which is slightly scuffed on one corner), a removable aluminium luggage rack with big tie down straps (seen in the photo), a Cee Bailey adjustable touring windscreen (The stock screen and a very short screen will also be included.), Cee Bailey headlight armour, and an SW Motech centre stand.
The "doo hickey" and its spring have been replaced with the Eagle Mike fix (details about that can be found on Google, or I can tell you more.) You won't see them in the photo, but I have the stock hand guards as well (I took them off for the summer.) Chain, sprockets and front brake pads were recently replaced and have about 4000 kms on them. I put a 16-tooth front sprocket on (the stock is 15) to improve highway cruising comfort. Tires are Continental Trail-Attack, with about 12000 kms on them. Still lots of meat left on both. I also have a Kenda off-road rear tire with less than 1000 kms on it, which I would include. I only use Motul full synthetic oil, and I change it regularly. I have never taken the bike off-road. It's always under a cover in the summer and garage stored in the winter

This is a great bike. The US Marines use a modified version for scouting, so you can bet it's tough and reliable. The 2010 version (which is basically identical to mine) was the Toronto Star Wheels section 2010 "best" bike of the year.

Many people end up not needing the lowering kit.
I put it on my first one as it had zero KM and girl driven so was very stiff and I had not ridden in a while.
Was going to on the Aus bike but it was well ridden and had enough sag and I was limber enough not to need it tho I get the boot lugs stuck in the rear hand rail at times. ;)
 
Last edited:
Personally the DRZ is the best of both worlds imo. It's big enough to tour on, and it's small enough for the single track. It's neither the best or worst at both, but almost a perfect compromise.

OP, I am selling a buddy's KLX250 if you're interested hit me up.

Sorry Macdoc, I know you're a fan of the KLR650, but it's just too big unless you're just sticking to pavement and fire type roads. Yes it CAN do trails, but the DRZ is a MUCH better compromise.
 
Hey guys thanks for all the great suggestions. As for my goals my primary goal is to do some longer distance touring and once in a while just explore some dirt trails. None of the heavy off road (rocks and cobble) but some regular light trails in the woods. Maybe some gravel and dirt trails in Ontario. I have a 30" inseam and can flat foot the CBR but bigger than that its one leg only or tip toe. I've looked at the KLR650 and its just too tall for me. The KLX250 seemed like a good dual when I test rode it but it was on road tires only. The BMW 650 interests me but not sure how well suited it is for off roaring or its primarily a touring bike. Maybe signing up for a trail ride like Jamie suggested is best to get familiar with it and see how much I like it.
Cottage is in wasaga so I'd primarily ride there.

I'm pretty much in the same situation and after weeks of research I think its impossible to have both in the same bike, not if you want to really have fun in the dirt. I'm really into dirt riding lately, I've been riding with the Trailtours guys for the past 2 years, this year only went there 4 times. I highly recommend giving it a try. In terms of bikes, for me it came down to Kawasaki Versys for all around bike, even some dirt roads with proper tires (see Motorcycle USA long term Versys videos on youtube) and proly WR250R or CRF250X for dirt. If you want a bike for both, I'd say the best one would be the F800GS (still heavy though).
 
Wow thanks so much guys. I'll still need to do more research and start sitting on some bikes! I'll do the trails tours in the spring as there's only one ganaraska event left this upcoming Saturday and they're done for the season it looks like.
As for buying a bike I think I need to try out rising off road first before I commit to buying a bike. Would the NC700x be a suitable option for a dual sport machine?? I think I'm leaning towards dual of anything simply because I can actually ride to the trails instead of putting it on a trailer. Highly doubt wasaga opp would be very forgiving with me zipping around to the trails.

edit: thinking about this I can probably do a few trail rides with that company and still save money on trading in the 250 for a diff bike just to get a feel for this new type of riding...dammit why didn't I think of this during the summer!
 
Last edited:
Sorry Macdoc, I know you're a fan of the KLR650, but it's just too big unless you're just sticking to pavement and fire type roads. Yes it CAN do trails, but the DRZ is a MUCH better compromise.

We'll just disagree and it's actually light compared to many dual sport twins.
The OP has said flat out he's not doing serious off road and neither do I.

I come from a trials background - I know light and the capability of them and my son has owned all from a Honda 230 to the TZ250 and Honda 450 motocrosser which is a seriously scary bike..

Mimico is very likely not interested in doing the kind you enjoy - he wants to tour primarily and be able to go offroad on trails and tracks on moderate difficulty.

The KLR650 covers both touring and light to moderate offroad at slow speeds ( mind you the KLR was "okay" at 50-60 kph on single track where the footing was okay.
Would not want to take it in heavy ruts and hills like the CREB track.

I don't even think the OP has ever ridden off road so yes the 250 would be better from that standpoint but not for touring and the KLR650 is fine for local dirt roads and tracks - as I mentioned there are very few legal places to ride within 200 km that are not just back roads...and that's where some of the nice experiences are for a road rider.

ScreenShot2012-10-21atOct212012102220PM.jpg


I'm sure this is more what he has in mind. That road is fine on the Burgman when dry and squirmy as hell with road tires with any moisture ( was surprised today how slick it can get ).

Any of the dual sports with 80/20 or 70/30 tires would be fine and stable doing these kind poke around roads yet be fun touring, decent in the twisties and relatively comfortable for touring.
I'd love to have a dedicated off road in Aus but the the idea of buzzing along on a small displacement twoxfour for the 30-150 km to get to the offroad areas does not appeal and it's far worse in Ontario.

Even tire choice is problematic here given the distances. 50/50 is nicest but extended use on the highway will chunk them up.

This dual sport issue of weight versus comfort and touring has gone on for decades. Tens of thousands have settled on the KLR650 as reasonable compromise for dual sport.

There are tons of amazing offroad bikes - very few you can do distance on.
The KLR650 is 389 lb dry - perhaps 400 wet.
That is not bad and it IS a tractor - that helps. - so does the price.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom