What have you learned?

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NealT said:
I agree that if the rider knows how to brake but that's not true enough for the vast majority of riders in my opinion. Given that I think the avg rider will not out brake the avg driver just because of a cars inherent stability and safety systems. All the driver has to do is hammer the brake with any foot that's it nothing else, on a bike there's far more to worry about and compensate for which to me anyway intimates a much higher level of avg skill to equal the avg driver.

Whether I can out brake a car is another issue, I don't have anti lock in my bike and to date I have not placed myself in a situation where I needed an instantaneous reflexive max braking action. It's one thing to practice in a safe parking lot another to have it occur as it would in a real life unexpected situation. I hope I would come close but to duplicate it or do better is asking a lot of any rider I think.
A lot of that opinion has come from reading a lot of articles with instrumented tests. I just ran across Motorcycle Magazine's 2010 article of the technologies and results of a comparo btwn 2010 M3 and same yr s 1000rr. Strictly looking at brakes the M3 was better than the bike around Willow Springs under braking (g forces were higher for the car under braking), interesting read.
http://www.sportrider.com/bikes/146_1008_bmw_s_1000_rr_m3_comparison/index.html
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In practice, I've always been able to outbreak my car on my bike (not driving/riding both at the same time :p). In real emergency situations I've tended to either underbrake or lock the rear on my bike. Now, I don't worry cause I have ABS even though it seems that I can pound the brakes as hard as I can and the ABS seldom needs to kick in.
 
Griffin said:
In practice, I've always been able to outbreak my car on my bike (not driving/riding both at the same time :p). In real emergency situations I've tended to either underbrake or lock the rear on my bike. Now, I don't worry cause I have ABS even though it seems that I can pound the brakes as hard as I can and the ABS seldom needs to kick in.
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I hope one day to get a bike with defeatable ABS (the new Bosch ones even better, KTM 990 SMT.....yum)
 
Two50noob said:
I learned that it's hard to accept when somebody you like whats to spend time with somebody whos not so nice. Though its impossible to controle who your freinds hang out with its possible to controle your own behavior. Just continue to be a good freind. In the end, the difference between a false freind and one who is true will surely come to light.
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Lol... not to make light of the lessons you've learned but are you sure you've got the right thread?
 
NealT said:
I agree that if the rider knows how to brake but that's not true enough for the vast majority of riders in my opinion. Given that I think the avg rider will not out brake the avg driver just because of a cars inherent stability and safety systems. All the driver has to do is hammer the brake with any foot that's it nothing else, on a bike there's far more to worry about and compensate for which to me anyway intimates a much higher level of avg skill to equal the avg driver.

Whether I can out brake a car is another issue, I don't have anti lock in my bike and to date I have not placed myself in a situation where I needed an instantaneous reflexive max braking action. It's one thing to practice in a safe parking lot another to have it occur as it would in a real life unexpected situation. I hope I would come close but to duplicate it or do better is asking a lot of any rider I think.
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Aside from articles and different combo of riders/drivers and bikes/cars - that's why you need to practice emrgency threshold braking so you know how the bike will behave. Not only applying both brakes in particular sequence but also knowing how to position your body and where to look. They teach it at level II of Total Control. By learning how to do it properly, what to do if front or rear locks up, practicing - it will become second nature and u will perform it with reflexes rather then brain which is slower.
From another threads I see that lot's of people do not use their rear brake and in my opinion - they should. Every inch of stopping distance will matter in emergency and it is silly not to use what your bike has to offer.
 
I've learned to never think I'm a good rider, but always one who strives to be better.
 
In my 2 days of ever riding a motorcycle( to get my m2) I have realized the following:

1. I tend to lock up the rear brakes on a 125cc. Almost to the point that it seems like fun. This will affect me later when I am on a supersport....
2. I tend to look down while I brake hard....this will affect me later....
3. I tend to keep my foot "just" above the rear brake pedal...this will affect me later
4. strange as it may seem, I've passed my M2...my instructor has said "with flying colours"..only I've managed to pick up these bad habits before my riding career can even start....

I intend to correct them all....
 
sid_for_speed said:
In my 2 days of ever riding a motorcycle( to get my m2) I have realized the following:

1. I tend to lock up the rear brakes on a 125cc. Almost to the point that it seems like fun. This will affect me later when I am on a supersport....
2. I tend to look down while I brake hard....this will affect me later....
3. I tend to keep my foot "just" above the rear brake pedal...this will affect me later
4. strange as it may seem, I've passed my M2...my instructor has said "with flying colours"..only I've managed to pick up these bad habits before my riding career can even start....

I intend to correct them all....
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Same advice I give everyone. I know you want to hit the streets, but go out, get a used trail bike and learn to semi-agressively ride tight trails. You'll learn how to fix practically every single issue you stated.
You won't lock up the brakes so often as in slick conditions, that means you're going down (but, you'll learn how to max brake with the front and rear).
You'll learn to look up and where you want to go. If you don't, you either won't see that rock you're headed for, or you'll steer in to that tree you're trying to avoid.
You'll figure out how to stay on the balls of your feet. If your foot hits that rear brake at the wrong time, you'll learn to keep it away.

Aside from this you'll pick up great throttle and clutch control, you'll be better off at avoiding sudden situations, you'll have way more fun that you'll ever have on the street, likely it will get you in to better shape, and in my opinion, the dirt friends you will make will be way cooler and more interesting than those street bike guys.

This coming from a guy that's been in dirt for about 14 years and on the street for almost 5... I'd give up the street before I ever stopped playing in the dirt!
 
WoBblyCaT said:
For slow maneuvers, throttle and rear brake is much smoother than just throttle
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x2 on automatics like the Burg. Let the revs drop enough and the clutch will disengage suddenly. Tiny bit of gas + rear brake keeps it tidy.

--New tires and proper springs are worth every penny (I keep re-learning that one).

--Sometimes what you really need is a professional mechanic, not more incomplete DIY guides.
 
mongol777 said:
Aside from articles and different combo of riders/drivers and bikes/cars - that's why you need to practice emrgency threshold braking so you know how the bike will behave. Not only applying both brakes in particular sequence but also knowing how to position your body and where to look. They teach it at level II of Total Control. By learning how to do it properly, what to do if front or rear locks up, practicing - it will become second nature and u will perform it with reflexes rather then brain which is slower.
From another threads I see that lot's of people do not use their rear brake and in my opinion - they should. Every inch of stopping distance will matter in emergency and it is silly not to use what your bike has to offer.
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Definitely agree on the practice part. I also use both brakes on the street, and like you I would think the proportioning changes throughout the braking cycle.
 
NealT said:
Definitely agree on the practice part. I also use both brakes on the street, and like you I would think the proportioning changes throughout the braking cycle.
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Initially the rear can provide up to and over 30% of the braking (motorcycle dependant) and under extreme conditions when maximum braking has been achieved on the front wheel the rear will drop to 0% even with a bike equiped with an antilock system. As the bike slows to below a certain speed (not sure the exact number) the antilock system is no longer functional and you can actually leverage the rear wheel even on a bike so equiped in the last few feet of travel.
 
#1 get loose!!

every single thing from long distance touring to twisties on the bike seems to be much better and more controlled if i can remember and in some cases, just trust myself to STAY loose.

#2 couter steering. works wonders!
 
Outlaws Justice said:
Initially the rear can provide up to and over 30% of the braking (motorcycle dependant) and under extreme conditions when maximum braking has been achieved on the front wheel the rear will drop to 0% even with a bike equiped with an antilock system. As the bike slows to below a certain speed (not sure the exact number) the antilock system is no longer functional and you can actually leverage the rear wheel even on a bike so equiped in the last few feet of travel.
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At speed I usually will start with a very light rear brake application as I find that under sketchy situations the bike settles better in a straight line and allows a nicer front brake application. The reason is probably the initial rear application causes the front to lightly preload, the weight transfer is gentler than a initial front brake application only.

Didn't know that about ABS equipped bikes, but I vary my front to back braking on my bike (no ABS) depending on the conditions and/or situation.
 
#1 - I learned that I need to ride like I'm invisible
#2 - That I enjoy riding MUCH more than I had originally thought I would
#3 - A 250 is enough for most of my riding
#4 - Buying a bike to 'save' commuting costs doesn't really work...but it's a damn good justification to those that don't know any better ;)
 
jc100 said:
I've learned not to trust anyone around me when I'm riding.
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Ditto.....and this includes riding buddies. Expect the unexpected. I had a spill 4 weeks ago when my buddy who was leading inexplicably decided to stop dead in his tracks with me close behind him (admittedly too close). Couldn't avoid him....clipped his rear fender and went down, resulting in a broken collarbone, banged up knee and a messed up bike.
 
I've learned that underarmour compression heatgear (or similar stuff) + leather (perforated and regular) is awesome for hot days.
 
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