Question on (increased) fines for using electronic hand held device while driving

[micelli.i]

Now that the fines have gone up to $1k for getting caught while driving and using hand-held device, how does the accused prove s/he did not have one, to begin with? Does the officer make a note of the device? Otherwise, wouldn't a defendant just say, s/he had no device at all, at the time of infraction?

I mean, if you really think about it, how does the Crown prove the device the defendant was holding, existed? I'm sure the officer will testify to that effect, but how would a J.P. decide if the accused's only defence is that he had no device? It's not like the Crown can prove otherwise.

Just thinking out loud.

 

[FLSTC]

If police officer testifies you had one, and all you had was you saying you didn't have one, the JP would weigh the police officer's evidence over yours. They don't have to prove that you have a device, just testimony that you were observed holding one when driving.

 

[griff2]

I mean, if you really think about it, how does the Crown prove the device the defendant was holding, existed? I'm sure the officer will testify to that effect, but how would a J.P. decide if the accused's only defence is that he had no device? It's not like the Crown can prove otherwise.

Just thinking out loud.

How does the Crown prove that you were even on the given street on which you are accused of having run the stop sign or broke the speed limit? Cop's testimony on the stand, and that testimony appears to be sufficient to result in countless convictions for those charges.

Why would testimony about being caught using a hand-held device be any different?

 

[hedo2002]

The JP uses the same standard on all cases. They listen to all evidence produced and then determine which they believe to be the "most reliable", and base their judgements on that. It would also depend upon your description of not "having a device" does this mean the person is testifying they didn't have the device in their hand at the time, or that they don't even own one. Although niether would be sufficent to have the charge dismissed. A driver may not own a device but thta doesn't mean they didn't have one, (could have had their mother's, gf/bf, sister, aunt etc etc etc, device at the time of the offence.

Besides not sure how one would prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they don't own a device...other than verbally. Do you bring a bill saying you don't have a device??? lol

 

[Bagman]

If police officer testifies you had one, and all you had was you saying you didn't have one, the JP would weigh the police officer's evidence over yours. They don't have to prove that you have a device, just testimony that you were observed holding one when driving.

Indeed, and so long as the cop doesn't have a history of lying on the stand their word is still considered the truth - to put in simply.

 

[eljay]

I didn't want to start a new thread but one thing I didn't know until today is that if you are G1/G2/M1/M2 there is 30/60/infinite day loss of license for 1st/2nd/3rd offense. Starts tomorrow.

 

[griff2]

I didn't want to start a new thread but one thing I didn't know until today is that if you are G1/G2/M1/M2 there is 30/60/infinite day loss of license for 1st/2nd/3rd offense. Starts tomorrow.

Wouldn't be so sure about that. There are new reporting (to the Registrar) of ADSLs imposed on novice drivers as a result of alcohol screening tests detecting alcohol in your system, but nothing about automatic loss of license for ordinary traffic tickets that I saw.

 

[TorontoBoy]

...if you are G1/G2/M1/M2 there is 30/60/infinite day loss of license for 1st/2nd/3rd offence. Starts tomorrow.

Starting Tuesday, distracted driving will be answered with a set fine of $490, with possible fees reaching $1,000, as well as three demerit points upon conviction. Novice drivers face a 30-day licence suspension.

TorStar source,
Govt Ontario source

minimum 30-day suspension for novice drivers

If you are below a full license and get charged with distracted driving you will face a 30 day suspension. I'm unsure if it starts immediately or not.

 

[griff2]

TorStar source,
Govt Ontario source

minimum 30-day suspension for novice drivers

If you are below a full license and get charged with distracted driving you will face a 30 day suspension. I'm unsure if it starts immediately or not.

Ok, excellent. Break the driving and cell phone habit for new drivers even before they get a chance to develop one.

From the chart you gave, it does not start immediately. It will only start 2 minutes from now!

 

[Mango Rider]

I was on the Allen today and didnt see 1k$ fine, but a "495$ and 3 demerit points for distracted driving using a hand held", is that just based off of first offense or is the 1k the maximum fine?

 

[DemonPig]

They can fine a million dollars but since enforcement of this law is extremely difficult, nothing will change.

 

[Jimsun]

To answer your question its up to $1,000 fine

 

[meme]

I saw one of those digital licence plate holders that scroll messages the other day. Stopped at a light, car in lane beside/just ahead of me had one. It flashed a few times and then read "put the phone down!!!!". Look over and there is middle aged man on phone beside me and boy did he get mad. Fingers up and mouthing **** off to driver in front.

Public shaming doesn't work either it seems. Hopefully demerits will do it.

 

[Riceburner]

Wonder if the remote for the plate sign is handheld.....lol

 

[Blackfin]

I see this all the time on my bike and to a lesser degree in the car.

Given that distracted driving has been shown to be as much of a danger to the public as drunk driving but is far more prevalent, the police need to get out into traffic and get these people. It is a misuse of resources to focus so heavily on people going 10 kph over the limit with cops sitting at the side of the road as opposed to being out in traffic and observing drivers at zero relative speed, nailing those that are as much of a menace as drunks.

 

[Riceburner]

it's easier to sit there and give speeding tickets. yeah, I'm jaded.

 

[TorontoBoy]

I am amazed that a little box of glass, plastic and electronics can so addict us. Sex, drugs, alcohol, food, exercise, even music, all these I can understand, but a smartphone? A shrunken and portable boob tube for all? Nevertheless the smartphone addiction is here and we need a massive culture change. The kids have these things glued to their hips, and the rest of us are just about there.

Cops really need to enforce this just as strongly as alcohol or drugs, but they are addicted as well. We as riders are so at risk when car drivers are on their phones. If we can curb alcohol use in cars, there is hope for smartphones, but, like alcohol, it will be an ongoing battle. it is still socially acceptable to use your smartphone in your car, just as it is to consume alcohol and drive. I hope, for all of us, that there will be a blitz this weekend so that the general public gets the message: Do not use your smartphone in your moving car.

 

[robmack]

Given that distracted driving has been shown to be as much of a danger to the public as drunk driving but is far more prevalent, the police need to get out into traffic and get these people.

GTA needs more of this type of undercover police enforcement of cell phone use talked about in this thread. Good on those Kiwis!

 

[Blackfin]

If the police would accept video evidence I would gladly wear my GoPro and vid drivers on their phones and then get their license plates in the shot. They should set up a snitch website...

 

[cheekeebandito]

The unbelievable frequency of distracted driving is the very reason I gave up riding a motorcycle on the road.... licensed full M for 37 years .... have never seen anything like it ... be safe out there people ! Cheers , Les