New Owner Won't Transfer Ownership | GTAMotorcycle.com

New Owner Won't Transfer Ownership

-Maverick-

-Maverick-

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Sold a bike lately and the new owner hasn't changed it out of my name yet. According to the MTO they have six days to do so. I'm concerned as if the bike is found downed in my name, I'm on the hook for it insurance wise. The best advice I can find from the MTO is after six days to go to Service Ontario and notify them that the bike has been sold. Does that cover me against insurance claims? Anybody ever faced this situation?

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
 
-Maverick- said:
Sold a bike lately and the new owner hasn't changed it out of my name yet. According to the MTO they have six days to do so. I'm concerned as if the bike is found downed in my name, I'm on the hook for it insurance wise. The best advice I can find from the MTO is after six days to go to Service Ontario and notify them that the bike has been sold. Does that cover me against insurance claims? Anybody ever faced this situation?

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
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I did that with a car sale...In some cases it's all you can do as if the new owner won't act you can't really force them to. Keep records of everything meticulously though.
 
When i have sold anything, it doesnt leave my property till in new owners name, always a must. Never had a problem
 
alpacaandy said:
When i have sold anything, it doesnt leave my property till in new owners name, always a must. Never had a problem
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Really?

If I buy a vehicle from you, I have to give you the cash, go to MTO and change ownership then show you proof of the change before you hand me the keys?

Really?
 
-Maverick- said:
Does this cover you with your insurance company tho? The insurance has been removed from the bike.

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
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How would insurance blame you? I could see if you were trying to do somethin retroactive (eg. bike crashed into a crowd and then you went to SO and said you sold it for cash to a random guy with no ID) but if you are pro-active it is hard for them to blame you.
 
Lightcycle said:
Really?

If I buy a vehicle from you, I have to give you the cash, go to MTO and change ownership then show you proof of the change before you hand me the keys?

Really?
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Nope, i have never let anything that could hold me liable. I had a buddy who had this happen along time ago, police showed up at his door asking about a car he sold years ago. It was a mess. Guy who bought was driving it for 2 years without transfer till he got into an accident. I have no problem letting anyone move on to another seller.
 
GreyGhost said:
How would insurance blame you? I could see if you were trying to do somethin retroactive (eg. bike crashed into a crowd and then you went to SO and said you sold it for cash to a random guy with no ID) but if you are pro-active it is hard for them to blame you.
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From the Google machine under MTO:

The vehicle will remain registered in the seller’s name until the vehicle transfer has been completed at ServiceOntario. Caution, if the vehicle transfer has not been completed, you may be pursued legally as the vehicle owner in the event of an infraction involving the vehicle.

A seller should follow up with the buyer to ensure that the vehicle transfer is completed. A seller should retain proof of the vehicle transfer. For record purposes only, seller may visit a ServiceOntario centre to notify the ministry that their vehicle has been “Sold”. However, this does not transfer the vehicle ownership.



The guy formerly known as Mladin.
 
-Maverick- said:
From the Google machine under MTO:

The vehicle will remain registered in the seller’s name until the vehicle transfer has been completed at ServiceOntario. Caution, if the vehicle transfer has not been completed, you may be pursued legally as the vehicle owner in the event of an infraction involving the vehicle.

A seller should follow up with the buyer to ensure that the vehicle transfer is completed. A seller should retain proof of the vehicle transfer. For record purposes only, seller may visit a ServiceOntario centre to notify the ministry that their vehicle has been “Sold”. However, this does not transfer the vehicle ownership.
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Legal infractions are not the same as insurance claims. Those are two separate things.

If you cancel your insurance policy, the insurance company is not going to investigate, pursue or honour any claims for that vehicle. No premiums paid, no payouts paid. That's the way their business operates.

It's got nothing to do with breaking laws.
 
Lightcycle said:
Legal infractions are not the same as insurance claims. Those are two separate things.

If you cancel your insurance policy, the insurance company is not going to investigate, pursue or honour any claims for that vehicle. No premiums paid, no payouts paid. That's the way their business operates.

It's got nothing to do with breaking laws.
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Ok, thanks. These threads are disturbing and the MTO needs to address this problem. If the new rider plows into a bunch of people and kills them the VIN will come back registered to me.

forums.redflagdeals.com

Selling vehicle privately. What if buyer doesn't register transfer? - RedFlagDeals.com Forums

I am selling a vehicle privately in Ontario and the Ontario Ministry of Transportation website states: The vehicle will remain registered in the
forums.redflagdeals.com forums.redflagdeals.com

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
 
alpacaandy said:
Nope, i have never let anything that could hold me liable. I had a buddy who had this happen along time ago, police showed up at his door asking about a car he sold years ago. It was a mess. Guy who bought was driving it for 2 years without transfer till he got into an accident. I have no problem letting anyone move on to another seller.
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I honestly don't know anyone who would give money to a total stranger for a vehicle and walk away empty-handed.

Hats off to you if you've actually gotten someone to jump through hoops like this.
 
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alpacaandy said:
Nope, i have never let anything that could hold me liable. I had a buddy who had this happen along time ago, police showed up at his door asking about a car he sold years ago. It was a mess. Guy who bought was driving it for 2 years without transfer till he got into an accident. I have no problem letting anyone move on to another seller.
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There is no liability once you call your insurer. Once it’s paid for you relinquish all rights to the paperwork and the vehicle.
 
@BrianP

Will do, thanks. The MTO needs to address this problem...nothing can (unfortunately) be left to trust anymore.

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
 
Government regulations as often as not are written to protect themselves, and to make sure that there is always an avenue to prosecute someone if things go wrong, as opposed to being a guide towards compliance.

Having it written the way it is, avoids someone being able to say "This can't be my Highway 407 bill (or speed camera ticket). I sold the car to someone a month ago, but I don't remember to whom!"

I know of someone recently, who sold a motorcycle to someone, the buyer never transferred the ownership, but the seller DID inform the MTO that the bike was no longer theirs, and then the cops came sniffing around a few weeks later because the bike was found somewhere crashed, no license plate, no insurance, rider nowhere to be found. The cops had nowhere to look but to the last registered owner ... they knew that the last registered owner had unregistered it some time before ... and had documentation indicating where the cops might want to start looking (buyer's name) ...
 
blackcamaro said:
No they don't, there isn't a problem. Keep a copy of a signed and dated bill of sale and notify Service Ontario you no longer own the vehicle. Done.
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You are not paying attention to the thread...you are relying on what we all think the law is. There is no way or law to force a buyer to transfer the purchased vehicle into their name..thus the paperwork must be re-written to indemnify the seller once the back of the ownership is filled out and signed. Currently under the MTO:

"The vehicle will remain registered in the seller’s name until the vehicle transfer has been completed at ServiceOntario. Caution, if the vehicle transfer has not been completed, you may be pursued legally as the vehicle owner in the event of an infraction involving the vehicle.

A seller should follow up with the buyer to ensure that the vehicle transfer is completed. A seller should retain proof of the vehicle transfer. For record purposes only, seller may visit a ServiceOntario centre to notify the ministry that their vehicle has been “Sold”. However, this does not transfer the vehicle ownership."

The guy formerly known as Mladin.
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