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Mosports New Track

kneedragger88

kneedragger88

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Just back from Mosports new track some good some VERY bad. The last turn coming onto front straight looks like a third/forth gear turn 90 degree sweeper with a concrete wall all the way around it. I paced it off and its 9 paces or less than thirty feet at apex! Also where new track merges with oval you come down a fair size straight (think front straight Shanny) straight into a 90 right lined with concrete wall on edge of track. Also judging by the amount of switchbacks in the infield there will have to be seperation walls constructed, some of which appear to have been marked out. Here are pics I took today. BTW today was the last day for the DDT dozers tear it out tomorrow.














 
Walls??? nothing better for us motorcycle racers than a nice concrete wall on the right spot. Makes for a much more exciting race to know that if you make the slightest error, your life will flash in front of your eyes just before you crash into it at some ungodly speeds.

What's next, a fire pit and a Moat with crocs?

Thank god I never crash :cool:
 
Thanks for the pictures, my friends who race formula will probably love this over the long track. Motorcycles not so much.
 
walls for cars aren't the best either. Maybe they are planning safer barriers (or something similar). What happens when a rider crashes into these semi-rigid barriers?
 
Why do track builders use walls at all...Bike or car, they are a menace. WHo wants to run their Porsche into a wall instead of out into the weeds?
 
They have to use walls to stop cars/bikes from crossing one section of track to another because the track crosses into itself. Bigger problem is all these "expert" track designers just love having a pit on the outside with a long pit lane. This generally includes a tight wall. My belief is all tracks shought have pits on the infield. Car people just dont understand what these walls mean to us. I remember when I started at TMP and the conversation I had with the owner. Their reputation was in the toilet and we were taking alot of heat for daring to challenge the establishment. I suggested that we needed to deal with the wall. I was told the 10 yr old bales were enough and the wall wasnt a problem. It was left to me to design and apply protection which I did twice over two years. By the pics I have seen recently they havent touched it since, it needed replacement in 2011 when I left. Funny how the it doesnt matter returned so quickly and unless riders start screaming loud and protest with their wallets it will never change. Just as this wont. To answer the question I have spoken to management at the track and was assured it will be bike freindly. So far not seeing it but back to in a car mentality it isnt a problem :( Hopefully when the rest is laid out there will be a "bike" configuration that wont have these issues but time will tell.
 
GreyGhost said:
walls for cars aren't the best either. Maybe they are planning safer barriers (or something similar). What happens when a rider crashes into these semi-rigid barriers?
Click to expand...
SafeGurad in England makes a foam Barrier that is used for cars and bikes. But ,,really? A track buying soft barriers! Won't ever happen in Canada! One section is 6 feet wide is About $700 with shipping about $300. So $1000 per unit to cover the average corner of 100 to 150 feet would be $25,000. If the corner is as Ken describes air fence which is $7000 per unit,$42,000 per corner,,, would not work.
So if it's got resonable run off where some speed can be scrubbed off the new bottle system in place at Shuby might work. But it sounds like the normal "Band-Aid" motorcycles are forced to do just to ride a track.
 
I am already collecting bottles!

I can't really picture the flow of the track but I'd like to check it out. Maybe we could get some experienced racers there next year for some sighting laps (car or bike) to see how the track flows and potentially see what configurations are acceptable for bikes.
 
Well I sent this to Myles this morning.

I have tried calling a bunch of times. Guess email is likely best.I was up and took a stomp around yesturday on new track. I have a few questions.1. Will there be different configs available?
2. Is track clockwise or counter clockwise?
3. Costs?
4 Available to SOAR?
I must say I saw the corner right at what I am guessing is pit out, that wall is seriously close, a superbike will be hitting well into top gear and hard braking into essentially a third gear corner (if clockwise) with 9 paces of runoff and a concrete wall! If counter clockwise not much better you now have a corner coming onto old stock car track with a wall. An butt end wall at Pit in and 30 ft runoff at exit leading onto straight.
With all the infield switchbacks I can only imagine there will be incursion walls in between track segments?
Unless there is other configs eliminating the pit in/out turn this track will be deadly in its current layout. I will be setting our schedule for 2014 in the next month or so and would love to include Mosport if its feasible on either track. Can you please advise when you get a chance or let me know whats a good time to call or come out to discuss,
Regards
Ken McAdam

The answer back was there likely isnt any dates available not a single answer to a single question. Same old same old at Mosport I am afraid. I can tell you for certain that in the current layout unless there is a alternate configuration we wouldnt be there anyway there is NO WAY to protect that wall let alone god knows how many others they will be doing. As usual no forethought to bikes. It would be refreshing to have some input BEFORE its messed up rather than trying to band aid it yet again. This corner in either direction I would safely say would be the most dangerous corner on any track I have ever been to. One direction it would be T12 at Shanny with a wall 30 feet from track. Other direction it has a butt end wall at entrance and probably same length straight as front straight at Shanny with a wqll 30 feet off track at exit. Also in a counter clockwise there is a left turn onto old oval also with a wall at track edge. This is coming off a small straight as well.
 
Oh Ken that's just too bad for Mosport.

A race weekend of me just eating Mcmosports would have paid for the construction.
 
omnivore said:
Why do track builders use walls at all...Bike or car, they are a menace. WHo wants to run their Porsche into a wall instead of out into the weeds?
Click to expand...

Because it allows them to fit more track in a smaller space.
 
Thanks for the update Ken. It's hard to tell what I'm looking at so if you can get a snapshot of the track plan that would be great.
Maybe they can place some kinks where those sweepers lead into a wall as an alternate layout for bikes. Would be cheap enough I think.
 
fastar1 said:
Thanks for the update Ken. It's hard to tell what I'm looking at so if you can get a snapshot of the track plan that would be great.
Maybe they can place some kinks where those sweepers lead into a wall as an alternate layout for bikes. Would be cheap enough I think.
Click to expand...

They wont share the plans. Dont hold your breath for a chicane. The track bed is already laid and they have shown loud and clear they dont give a crap about bikes. If they did they would ask before messing it up. Myles has shown his indifference to motorcycles. Wont even answer the simplest of questions regarding layout and safety. I will bet this will only get worse as further walls are added between segments. At this point the ONLY thing I can see be a possibility is a possible configuration that eliminates the pit wall but not sure thats happening or he likely would have offered that. Also if there is another how would you get to it from the pits? I will wait a couple weeks and pop over again I only live 15 min away and see what the RDT sections look like. But not hopeful :(
 
Mosports history is pretty repetative. When the car industry is at a high, or a new owner comes in,bike days drastically decrease. When the car industry hits a low or the new owner becomes an old owner,,the bike days incease. As about 2011 when they had so many bike days nobody could make any money. Great for the consumer and Mosport but not good for the trackday provider.
The RDT track was basically built for the Bridgestone school when they left Shannonville. It was never really thought out and made too narrow. But it worked as the runnoff and elevation changes were great for schools. But with the school now doing racing the old RDT sucks.
The one thing that we can hope for is that cars hate walls as well. Walls are put up to support a builders design. The builder looks at the track from a perfect world. Nobody crashes and with all the corners it's fun! But as soon as the cars start totalling themselves against these walls the school will have trouble financailly and then Mosport will have to bandaid it accordingly. Rather then just consulting with people from both sides of the fence and building to suit.
Bottom line is the track is built to rent,,motorcycle money has been proven to be better then car money in hard times. They just refuse to acknowledge it.
And I apoligize I should be saying Canadian Tire Motorsports Park!!!!:confused3:
 
Bickle Racing said:
And I apoligize I should be saying Canadian Tire Motorsports Park!!!!:confused3:
Click to expand...

Nope. Nor "Rogers Centre" either. Blech...

And this from a guy who probably spends about 10k per year in CT and drinks his morning coffee out of an "I LOVE CT" mug. Mosport is Mosport.
 
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