Knee down + HTA | GTAMotorcycle.com

Knee down + HTA

Dayao12

Dayao12

Well-known member
Hello Good People,

Question about aggressive turns:

I like to take turns in the city, suburbs, and on/off ramps at quite an aggressive pace sometimes. I find myself "kneedowning" it, or atleast come close to it. Of course with a sense of caution to surrounding traffic; as in only attempting when there's no oncoming traffic or pedestrians.
Is there anything in the HTA that would consider aggressive leans as dangerous or reckless driving? Possible ticket if caught?

Thanks a ton!

Cheers & Happy Riding!
 
Ibt
 
i would think, you would atleast be speeding.get involved in some track days,ive got the crystal ball out again.rub,rub,rub.aint looking good.keep it off the streets.you will live longer.lol.im not making this chit up, thats what it says!ride safe.
 
If you ****ed up sure. If not I don't see why you'd get stopped. If you sail smoothly through without exceeding the limit(technically on a ramp you can go fast as you want, theres only a suggested speed limit)why would they say anything...but if you crash, now they gotta stop for you, write it up, call EMS which is all going to take up their time and resources. They compensate by giving you some stupid charge, which you probably deserve anyways for your little **** up.
If theres no one around pick your *** up and ride on outta there like nothing ever happened.
 
Although I think it is unlikely, I could see the possibility of a stunting ticket based on the fact that you wouldn't appear to be fully "sitting in the driver's seat". http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/regs/english/elaws_regs_070455_e.htm

Definition, “stunt”
3. For the purposes of section 172 of the Act, “stunt” includes any activity where one or more persons engage in any of the following driving behaviours:
6. Driving a motor vehicle while the driver is not sitting in the driver’s seat.
Click to expand...
 
I cant find the wording in the HTA anymore, but this is what you may be slapped with

"Driving a motor vehicle in a manner that indicates an intention to cause some or all of its tires to lose traction with the surface of the highway while turning."

or


"Driving a motor vehicle without due care and attention, without reasonable consideration for other persons using the highway or in a manner that may endanger any person by,

iii. driving a motor vehicle in a manner that indicates an intention to drive, without justification, as close as possible to another vehicle, pedestrian or fixed object on or near the highway"
 
LoneRonin said:
(technically on a ramp you can go fast as you want, theres only a suggested speed limit)

They compensate by giving you some stupid charge, which you probably deserve anyways for your little **** up.
Click to expand...
1st part is wrong, 2nd part...how is it a stupid charge if the person deserved it?
 
Ash said:
Although I think it is unlikely, I could see the possibility of a stunting ticket based on the fact that you wouldn't appear to be fully "sitting in the driver's seat". http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/regs/english/elaws_regs_070455_e.htm
Click to expand...

This is the section, that immediately comes to mind. Someone here has a letter form MOT, however, indicating that this is not their intent under the law. Cold comfort, indeed, if they decide to follow the letter rather than the spirit of the law at the roadside though.
 
Yep, half butt cheek fully sitting in. I guess I comply ... LOL
 
I would think stunting....cause it appears to look like a stunt, even to a rider cop, and your sole objective is to get your knee down, which establishes the act itself as your intention, rather than you arguing you got your knee down to feel the road to help gauge the correct angle at that speed to establish grip levels.

It's got too much razzle dazzle about it and is hard to support. On top of that....only racers do it!!!!! It reaks of racing culture and show boating.

It would be one hard as hell case to argue I think.....and I loves to argue!

Now that being said....a cop once pulled me over because he heard reports by local employees on a Sunday night that me and a buddy were racing. When I told him "no officer, we weren't racing at all, me and my buddy are doing an improvised cricuit but we are no where near each other, and keeping to the speed limits, while we are merely enjoying these tight corners within the law and enjoying the bike's potential to lean, where otherwise we don't get these oportunities".

Now this was all true, it was a Sunday night in an industrial estate, and I hadn't actually got my knee down. We were however loud with our after market cans and spent 45 mins going around in circles. BUT NOT RACING. We kept huge distances apart.

The cop seemed ok with it and said "Have fun and go easy. Just do me a favour and be on your way for now. You can come back later but at this point give these late workers a break from the noise".

So....TRYING to get your knee down on an off ramp in normal midweek day time traffic.....even on a good day I don't think it would fly.

Exploring lean angles (reasonably) in a safe remote area on off peak hours, and touching your knee down, in a controlled fashion....I would say that would be luck of the draw also, but better chances.

There are some dudes in this forum if they had a badge would be squirting 172 man juice all over your if they could, let alone bike hatin cops!!!
 
Actually, in my case, my sole objective is to lower my centre of gravity, thereby reducing bike lean and maintaining maximum tire contact patch. After riding on the track, for a while, it's hard not to do it.
 
Officer Bubbles said:
I'm charging you under 172 Ontario Regulation 455/07 section 3, subsection 8, clause iii) driving a motor vehicle in a manner that indicates an intention to drive, without justification, as close as possible to another vehicle, pedestrian or fixed object on or near the highway.

"Lowering your centre of gravity" is a clear attempt to get your centre of gravity closer to the fixed object (that is the asphalt) on the highway. I'm going to arrest you. Do you understand?
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I'm endeavouring to keep my motorcycle as far, as is physically possible, from 'on the roadway.' That my body is closer to it is purely coincidence :lol:
 
Oh jeez - dragging a knee.

The funny thing here is that for anyone that has spent a decent amount of time at the track, they know that getting a knee down can be done in a very safe manner with LOTS of room for error.... and still at or under the speed limit (depending where you are doing it).

But seriously - a cop sees you doing this and they have a hate on for bikes.... do you think they are not going to pick some law and ding you with it? Dangerous driving would probably be the worst one they can give you.

So it becomes a matter of perception. To someone who has no idea of what riding a bike feels like... dragging a knee looks ridiculous. But for a racer or even a trackday hack like myself, dragging a knee is no biggie.... I surprised myself the last time I was at the track because I dragged a knee with my hand in the air turning into pit entrance.... I had no idea my knee was anywhere close.... and I wasn't going anywhere near fast pace.... so it is all relative. However to the untrained.... dragging a knee is a thing only a LUNATIC would do, ya know?
 
Rob MacLennan said:
Actually, in my case, my sole objective is to lower my centre of gravity, thereby reducing bike lean and maintaining maximum tire contact patch. After riding on the track, for a while, it's hard not to do it.
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This. And it's not even an excuse. I also shift my weight over in case I do need to hang off (let's say that there's a dead raccoon around the corner and I gotta change my line; which has actually happened before).

I think it would have a decent fight in court. But like everyone says, even if you win, you still lose 'cause of the hassle & fees that you'd have to pay fighting it. Do everything you can to minimize the risks, and learn to accept the rest (or don't do it at all). Any time I go ramping, I always do one run through to check for cops. And as soon as a tow truck shows up, I limit myself to 2 laps before I peace.

But lately, I've been choosing not to do it at all. I got all the aggressive riding out of my system last year and I find myself cruising more this year. For some reason, I only find uphill curves fun now. :S
 
Officer Bubbles said:
I'm charging you under 172 Ontario Regulation 455/07 section 3, subsection 8, clause iii) driving a motor vehicle in a manner that indicates an intention to drive, without justification, as close as possible to another vehicle, pedestrian or fixed object on or near the highway.

"Lowering your centre of gravity" is a clear attempt to get your centre of gravity closer to the fixed object (that is the asphalt) on the highway. I'm going to arrest you. Do you understand?
Click to expand...

Your penchant to be a constant Debbie downer really makes me wonder how you managed to get through the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory (psych test in lay terms). Clearly you are bent on destroying other people's happiness because you are incapable of achieving your own. Just out of curiosity where your peers ALWAYS having more fun than you for all of your life or just your teenage years?

Your overdeveloped sense of self-righteousness will continue to alienate you from other people until such time as you resolve the underlying issue(s). If by some chance we meet under negative circumstances please don't take the complaint to your staff Sgt. personally I am doing it for the benefit of the community.

I think we've all had just about enough of over policing to last us for a while a while. So how's about you go ahead and worry about busting the real creeps.
 
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