GoldWing and FJR retiring?

Mad Mike

Mad Mike

Well-known member
"Big Red is also rumored to have Gold Wing variants and the Benly scooter on the chopping block too".

The FJR needs a new engine design to meet new emissions requirements, so it may be killed off due to low sales.

Honda, as per above, may reduce the number of GW models within the line, not kill off the whole line.

Touring Bikes > Honda Motorcycles Canada

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Do we really need 5 variations of a GW? I predict the GW and the GW DCT will go. How many GW Tour DCT Airbags models do they sell, maybe it's going as well.
 
If BMW can "technofy" their age-old flat twin motor to comply with Euro 5 standards, what is stopping Honda from doing the same with their flat six motor?

(waiting for Mike's response )
 
Article pertains to Japanese market only, although the situation is basically the same as Euro 5. US and Canada don't adopt the EU standards, and ours are lagging behind. USA is the main worldwide market for the Wing. This may not mean much...for now.
 
interesting they always axe jap bikes, its like no ones buying them
 
TK4 said:
WTF is that supposed to mean ? These last two years there hasn't been enough of any new stuff to go around.
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triumph, ducati, aprilia, ktm etc all released new models but ok

You might have to wait on an order but they're not cancelling anything.
 
Chris-CJ said:
If BMW can "technofy" their age-old flat twin motor to comply with Euro 5 standards, what is stopping Honda from doing the same with their flat six motor?

(waiting for Mike's response
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This is a tough question to answer. Prior Euro standards were as tested new, I believe the latest standards are like our old SMOG rules, the bike must be pass Euro 5 for the life of the bike regardless of age or mileage, and many countries now require the same periodic testing for bikes and cars.

I suspect Euro 7 may be factoring into this now. It's going to be tougher in several ways, first it includes Motorcycles, has lowered overall emission limits, but the most important thing for bikes is the switch from World Motorcycle Test Cycle (WMTC) to Real Driving Emissions (RDE). The difference is the new testing catches emissions under hard acceleration and spirited riding -- not a predictable range of dyno runs. Bikes currently get a break as rapid acceleration and aggressive riding are not part of the test cycle -- so bikes can spew when calling for max performance.

My guess is Honda can make GL1800s compliant, they are no stranger to VVT technology and have the expertise. More than likely they would keep the DCT as auto trannys should be easier on compliance. The question is whether it's worth an investment to upgrade the GL1800 motor if they can only bet on Canada and the USA. Going to come down to a business case.

Brian P said:
Article pertains to Japanese market only, although the situation is basically the same as Euro 5. US and Canada don't adopt the EU standards, and ours are lagging behind. USA is the main worldwide market for the Wing. This may not mean much...for now.
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Yes it does, but I'm guessing the Japanese standards are aligned with Euro... so whether stated or not it's likely the same set of obstacles.
 
Here is an overview written by Ricardo (combustion-engine research and development firm - well regarded in the industry). https://cdn.ricardo.com/motorcycle/media/events/rmc 7.0/motorcycle-emission.pdf

It is not suggested in there that Euro 7 is going to be applied to motorcycles, and I haven't seen any such indication from any official source for anything to be applied that is more stringent than Euro 5. This article is speculative, "what might happen if" ... The article doesn't specify which Euro 5 compliant bike that they tested. It seems that the "real driving emissions" problem is mostly NOx.

BUT. It's practically a certainty that "something" is going to happen.

In the automotive world, Euro 7 is the one that's expected to almost kill internal combustion engines by being essentially unachievable. There's some fleet-averaging stuff that might allow some combustion-engine models to be sold if there are enough zero-emissions models sold to offset it.

I found this article that makes a reference to including catalyst monitoring in the on-board diagnostics as of 2025 ... this means having a downstream O2 sensor. I'm not aware of any current production motorcycle that has one. But, the tech for doing this is well established in the automotive world. This shouldn't be a major obstacle. Still means retooling exhaust systems and changing wiring harnesses and ECU programming ... nothing earthshattering, just $. What You Need to Know About Euro 5 Emission Standards for Motorcycles
 
Chris-CJ said:
If BMW can "technofy" their age-old flat twin motor to comply with Euro 5 standards, what is stopping Honda from doing the same with their flat six motor?
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This was a presentation of the Honda Goldwing showing sales figures over the years (2018+ is projected, obviously did not meet sales targets)...

goldwing sales 2017.jpg

While sales of touring and sport-touring motorcycles have been declining year-over-year for a while now, BMW's GS practically invented and defined the ADV market, which is currently motorcycle's fastest growing segment.

It's no wonder they are pouring money into keeping that platform current, while all bikes in other segments are slowing or halting technical development. It's just too costly and doesn't present enough revenue opportunity to justify trying to keep pace with the ever-tightening Euro and California restrictions.
 
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The race to electrify motorcycles needs to get started. It's encouraging to see these promo videos, I'd like to see more!

I was hopeful that HD's Livewire would get more manufacturers charging toward a viable bike... Nothing yet by promotional videos and promises.
 
Viable for adv touring awaits battery tech to improve pretty dramatically.
Local rides are now practical, some off road and trials bikes...but range and charging speed still needed and to a degree charging stations.
 
Mad Mike said:
The race to electrify motorcycles needs to get started. It's encouraging to see these promo videos, I'd like to see more!

I was hopeful that HD's Livewire would get more manufacturers charging toward a viable bike... Nothing yet by promotional videos and promises.
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As usual with this sort of thing, companies will fit into one of three groups - as will consumers. Lead, follow, or get run over.

Any mention of EVs on social media reveals that there are an awful lot of consumers that will be in the "get run over" group.

Not me if I can possibly help it. At this point, I have no intention of purchasing another vehicle with a combustion engine. I know there's plenty of consumers in that group, too.
 
Lightcycle said:
This was a presentation of the Honda Goldwing showing sales figures over the years (2018+ is projected, obviously did not meet sales targets)...

View attachment 56211

While sales of touring and sport-touring motorcycles have been declining year-over-year for a while now, BMW's GS practically invented and defined the ADV market, which is currently motorcycle's fastest growing segment.

It's no wonder they are pouring money into keeping that platform current, while all bikes in other segments are slowing or halting technical development. It's just too costly and doesn't present enough revenue opportunity to justify trying to keep pace with the ever-tightening Euro and California restrictions.
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I think the current ADV focus is just motorcycles returning to their utilitarian roots.

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Is this an ADV? ST, or RR?
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