Economic News

Dairy lobby in ON and QC has a magic spell on the feds.

They won't touch sour cream and stinky cheese.
 
GreyGhost said:
Lots of them. I don't think any have been in our favor.
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Unless you raise chickens, eggs, dairy cows or make fromage.

Trudeau bought them all new Escalades.
 
Mad Mike said:
Unless you raise chickens, eggs, dairy cows or make fromage.

Trudeau bought them all new Escalades.
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Would it be better if they made less than minimum wage like in the USA. Sure our prices are a bit higher but our farmers aren't living below the poverty line and getting screwed over by the big agri companies. For me we have a pretty good system currently.

Sent from the future
 
Scuba Steve said:
Would it be better if they made less than minimum wage like in the USA. Sure our prices are a bit higher but our farmers aren't living below the poverty line and getting screwed over by the big agri companies. For me we have a pretty good system currently.

Sent from the future
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I don’t really think it’s like that. Farmers with quota in those sectors have guaranteed profits, and it’s not chickenfeed.

I have to make my biz compete with the big world, I don’t get a 50% subsidy to guarantee me profits.

This is a very small number of farmers that live pretty well off the subsidy you and I pay (unless your a vegan). Beef, pork, corn, beans, cash crops, fish or any other farmers don’t get the deal… just the few with chicken and dairy ranches.

4l of milk costs 35% more at Walmart in Canada than it does in the USA. That doesn’t kill me, but a struggling family pays that subsidy to well to do farmers. Migh be hard on them.
 
I understand why farm quota exist. Without it we would have the US version of farming which is death to small producers. But our import tax on foreign cheese is retarded at 280% . You can make a lot of cheeses without caves and sea air and alpine meadows . Sure you can crank up cheddar anywhere , but give me a decent French blue without a second mortgage.


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DownUnder said:
Since Trudeau came into power, has Canada gotten a single favorable/fair trade deal?
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I consider CETA to be generally favourable, and negotiations for that concluded in 2014, just before Trudeau.

The only reason there was any discussion between the UK and Canada is that the UK Brexited. If they were unwilling to continue using the terms of CETA as before, that's on them.
 
Mad Mike said:
4l of milk costs 35% more at Walmart in Canada than it does in the USA. That doesn’t kill me, but a struggling family pays that subsidy to well to do farmers. Migh be hard on them.
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I'll gladly pay extra for milk without BGHs.
 
timtune said:
I'll gladly pay extra for milk without BGHs.
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All cow milk contains BGH. Perhaps you’re thinking of RBGH.

Walmart, and most retailers in the USA don’t have RBGH in their milk. The prices I quoted you were for RBGH free Walmart milk.

Anyway, the subsidies they get are a result of a strong lobby, eliminating them just makes a competitive market- nothing to do with hormones in milk.
 
crankcall said:
I understand why farm quota exist. Without it we would have the US version of farming which is death to small producers.
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I guess my question is why dairy and chickens ONLY. All the other farm commodities operate in a competitive marketplace.

We don’t subsidize mom and pop businesses, it irks me that these folks get to operate with full market monopolies.
 
I think your confusing quota with subsidies , dairy farmers do not get subsidies. They have a quota to produce which protects supply management, like eggs , so you get consistent supply and quality goods .
You pay for your milk in Canada , once , at the till , not again in taxes for a backs end like Scandinavia which everyone loves right now .
Milk prices are set by retailers , not by farmers .
Many think beef and wheat farmers don’t benefit from a farm subsidies, they do and it’s back ended . You rent out your land , but you ‘share crop’ and take a portion of product yield instead of calling it rent and you get a massive tax break. You pay less for truck permits , you get rebates on equipment , your property taxes are less if agricultural.
Marketing boards , which control quota were introduced for key products that were deemed needed to keep a population fed and healthy , the farmer knows he has a home for the product and can run a safe and clean operation.


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crankcall said:
I think your confusing quota with subsidies , dairy farmers do not get subsidies. They have a quota to produce which protects supply management, like eggs , so you get consistent supply and quality goods .
You pay for your milk in Canada , once , at the till , not again in taxes for a backs end like Scandinavia which everyone loves right now .
Milk prices are set by retailers , not by farmers .
Many think beef and wheat farmers don’t benefit from a farm subsidies, they do and it’s back ended . You rent out your land , but you ‘share crop’ and take a portion of product yield instead of calling it rent and you get a massive tax break. You pay less for truck permits , you get rebates on equipment , your property taxes are less if agricultural.
Marketing boards , which control quota were introduced for key products that were deemed needed to keep a population fed and healthy , the farmer knows he has a home for the product and can run a safe and clean operation.


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Supply management is a subsidy.

The farmers receive a guaranteed price for their goods which gets adjusted to reflect changes in farm input costs - it includes a healthy margin. As a result, the market forces that drive efficiencies and cost reduction are reduced.

These costs and guaranteed farmer profits are passed along to the consumer because the inflated price moves through the supply chain. The bottom line is the boards have their finger on the scale of supply and demand, with the winner being the farmer, and the loser being the consumer.

100 years ago when the country was developing, supply management might have been a good thing. As farming stabilized farm boards were dissolved -- all but chickens and dairy. Today its simply a protection lobby made up of of wealthy farmers. It would take a fair amount of political will and capital to break them down, but it is time to let chicken and dairy farmers stand on their own so the cost of their goods can find market value, which is great for consumers.
 
mimico_polak said:
Wasn’t sure where to post this…and not worth starting a new thread.

I’m no expert but this can’t be good…

apple.news

Posthaste: Bankruptcies are soaring, but especially in Canada — Financial Post

Business insolvencies in this country jumped the most in 36 years of records
apple.news apple.news
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I would have expected this. The pandemic weighed heavily on small businesses, particularly those in restaurants, entertainment, and hospitality.

But, this is also fun with statistics. In the 5 years prior to the pandemic, insolvencies were stable at approx 131K/year. Many teetering businesses got propped up with gov't funds during the pandemic and were able to stave off bankrupcy, which caused the bankrupcies to plunge by 25% to around 100k/year. Now those subsidies are gone, many of those businesses return to teetering and failing.

The 2023 number is a huge jump over the pandemic years, but it's still less than the prepandemic average. It will probably get worse as many of the the businesses that were propped up during the pandemic will fall on the dead pile without gov't support $$$.



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