Does the leader switch tire tracks in a group ride on multi lane roads? | GTAMotorcycle.com

Does the leader switch tire tracks in a group ride on multi lane roads?

Senshi

Senshi

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I just went for some rides with friends and ran into a question that is driving me crazy. In my 5 years of riding I have not been on that many group rides with strangers, so I just ran into this situation now. On our ride the leader maintained blocking position in multi lane roads which meant that when we switched lanes every bike would have to switch tire tracks to maintain staggered formation. With the people I ride with when I am leading I always stay in the left tire track as leader even if I move to the left lane.

I was always under the assumption that the leader stays in the left tire track when in a group, which is normal on a single lane road, but then on a multi lane road when the leader goes to the left lane do they stay in the left tire track or go to the right one and force all others behind them to reform the staggered formation so now the second rider is now in the left tire track. This would mean bikes are crossing over whenever lane changes on multi lane roads are made. (I am also not talking about changing into the lane to pass, I mean to ride in the other lane)

What does the actual motorcycle drivers handbook say to do in the situation. I lent mine out but the Saskatchewan drivers hand book says: "When group riding with multiple lanes, always maintain a staggered position with the lead bike in the left front corner of the lane."

I just want a definite answer so I can correct myself if I have been wrong. If someone can let me know what it says in the drivers handbook that would be great.
 
Senshi said:
I just went for some rides with friends and ran into a question that is driving me crazy. In my 5 years of riding I have not been on that many group rides with strangers, so I just ran into this situation now. On our ride the leader maintained blocking position in multi lane roads which meant that when we switched lanes every bike would have to switch tire tracks to maintain staggered formation. With the people I ride with when I am leading I always stay in the left tire track as leader even if I move to the left lane.

I was always under the assumption that the leader stays in the left tire track when in a group, which is normal on a single lane road, but then on a multi lane road when the leader goes to the left lane do they stay in the left tire track or go to the right one and force all others behind them to reform the staggered formation so now the second rider is now in the left tire track. This would mean bikes are crossing over whenever lane changes on multi lane roads are made. (I am also not talking about changing into the lane to pass, I mean to ride in the other lane)

What does the actual motorcycle drivers handbook say to do in the situation. I lent mine out but the Saskatchewan drivers hand book says: "When group riding with multiple lanes, always maintain a staggered position with the lead bike in the left front corner of the lane."

I just want a definite answer so I can correct myself if I have been wrong. If someone can let me know what it says in the drivers handbook that would be great.
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The lead rider assumes the appropriate lane position for whichever lane they are in, this position will change depending on the lane selection. The group then staggers off that position.
 
It's really up to the ride leader. When leading a ride I prefer to be in the proper tire track for the road we are on, but I will do my best to minimize the number of track swaps. For me and the people I usually ride with it comes down to communication mostly. When you ride with the same people a lot you will develop a feel for the group preference.
 
^ eventually you dont bother, everybody knows their place..

I dont go on group rides with strangers any more... I used to go on GTAM rides years years ago but not any more. I feel unsafe in a big group of bikes. People ride too close together, theres nowhere to escape if something happens, etc.
 
Leader Always remains in blocking position. Or should.
 
Acadian1974 said:
The lead rider assumes the appropriate lane position for whichever lane they are in, this position will change depending on the lane selection. The group then staggers off that position.
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Cool thanks for the responses. Still seems weird to me but I guess its right to stay in blocking and have everyone switch. I still don't understand the logic of doing that as the bikes would be crossing paths of the others that are only 1 second apart and it just seems like it creates the chance for more to go wrong or if something happened while everyone was focusing on switching tire tracks.

Maybe I just need to get used to it now.

Switching tire tracks then goes against the link in the sticky post on group riding here: http://www.sunsethog.com/groupRiding.html
 
First, I don't like group rides and the uncertainty of expectations clear from this thread is one reason.

Second, when I ride with another rider or group, the lead rider is on the left and stays there regardless of what lane you're in. To do anything else needlessly complicates an already risky and compliex situation. You should always know exactly where the rider behind you is. To shift this around every time you change lanes is foolish. A group of more than four would likely be shuffling about constantly on a multi-lane highway trying to figure out what spot each rider should be in. You should be spending your time maintaining position and looking for hazards (i.e. the pick up about to lane change into you) and not spend all your time trying to change your lane position to keep up with all the riders in front of you like some form of motorized syncronized swimming team.

Edited to add that the biggest hazard on the road should not be the bike in front of or behind you. With most group rides however, that is the case.
 
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CruisnGrrl said:
you will find as many answers as there are options for this issue.

for a large group of riders as long as you're staggered it's not as big a deal which tire track you're in though it can affect sight lines. in small groups blocking position is more important.
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Is there an actual rule written in the Ontario Motorcycle Handbook? If RTI or other courses train the leader to stay in their blocking position, forcing all riders to switch positions, what is the reasoning behind the teaching? I am particularly interested in the logic behind the rule if there is an official one as right now I don't understand.
 
I've led a lot of group rides, IMO the leader should maintain track while switching lanes. The risk of having each bike switch track outweighs the risk of the leader being in a blocking position or not. A blocking position looses relevancy when multiple motorcycles are involved. The purpose of the blocking position is to prevent cars from doing a "cyclist style" pass. Once 2 bikes are occupying each track in a lane, a car is unable to do make such a manoeuvre.
 
the lead should ride in the position they would take if they were alone, everyone else is positioned according then
 
People who lead a group like that drive me bonkers, especially when riding at a spirited pace. A little common sense, for the most part let the group hold their positions, unless you're planning on staying in the lane for a while and it makes sense to shuffle the group. Lead riders who just switch to the other side of the dotted line are a pita to ride behind.

Solution, make friends with people who ride, and who you know are not squids. Only ride with friends, not random strangers.
 
If I have nothing more to contribute, thanks to the OP for the question at least. I always try to maintain blocking position, and I don't mind doing the big lane change when I'm riding in position 2 or 4. It's kind of fun, I think... but this year I have started riding with 2 friends who are rookies, so they always want me to go first. I am spending a lot of time watching them in the mirrors and trying to decide what style I should be using when it comes to blocking position in the fast lane. I guess at the end of the day my opinion is that if you're in an experienced small group of riders, using the proper blocking position is good, but if lesser experienced riders or a larger group comes into play, perhaps riding with the lead rider in the left track is best.
 
Lightcycle said:
Do you put your toilet paper roll on the holder with the paper facing out in front or behind the roll?

Pros and cons for each, but in the grand scheme of things, it's not really that important.
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There are no pros to having the paper hang in. Paper out all the time, POATT.
 
172Driver said:
There are no pros to having the paper hang in. Paper out all the time, POATT.
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Guess you have never owned a cat. Paper out = full on cat toy and massive mess to clean up. Paper in = mild amusement for cat for a few minutes and less/no mess to clean up.
 
Lunatic said:
Guess you have never owned a cat. Paper out = full on cat toy and massive mess to clean up. Paper in = mild amusement for cat for a few minutes and less/no mess to clean up.
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+1

As to the original question, I've been on or led many group rides and I have a simple solution: avoid motorways! Big roads with multi lanes in each direction and lots of traffic are not my idea of an enjoyable ride. Yes, sometimes they're unavoidable ...

As for whether the leader switches lane positions when switching lanes, I really don't care. I'll go with the flow. If I am doing the leading, I am riding my own ride, and people following behind ought to be riding THEIR own ride, too. If conditions warrant switching positions in the lane then I'm doing it. An artificial "rule" that says "thou shalt not switch lane positions" is not enough to make me want to ride over a piece of debris in the road, nor is it enough to put myself in a position where MY visibility to some other car driver is poorer than had I simply moved position in the lane.

The lead rider is the one that needs to be the most concerned about his own visibility to surrounding (and particularly, oncoming) traffic. The tail rider is second-most-concerned. The lead rider is the one who should be seeing road hazards first, too. Those riders SHOULD be granted the freedom to change lane position depending on the circumstances without having to be restrained by somebody's artificial "rule".

If the second rider is paying attention then they ought to be able to quickly see why the lead rider is changing lane position, and either switch sides (if it is apparent that the reason for the lead rider switching sides is going to persist) or not bother (because it is apparent that it is only going to be a momentary thing, to get the attention of a car driver or to go around a sketchy piece of pavement).

YES, if the second rider doesn't switch sides then the following distance is going to be shortened. If it's going to be shortened to the extent that it could actually cause a problem then the group is riding too tightly to begin with! Increase your spacing between riders.
 
Senshi said:
I just went for some rides with friends and ran into a question that is driving me crazy. In my 5 years of riding I have not been on that many group rides with strangers, so I just ran into this situation now. On our ride the leader maintained blocking position in multi lane roads which meant that when we switched lanes every bike would have to switch tire tracks to maintain staggered formation. With the people I ride with when I am leading I always stay in the left tire track as leader even if I move to the left lane.
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Annoys me too. If the leader keeps switching tracks I usually ask him to quit it at the next stop. It's especially harder for the noobs to keep switching position.

When I'm leading I never switch, left lane track for me.

-Jamie M.
 
Lightcycle said:
Do you put your toilet paper roll on the holder with the paper facing out in front or behind the roll?

in the grand scheme of things, it's not really that important. Do what you think makes sense to you and watch out for all the other idiots on the road.

.
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This ^

to quote another poster.... these are "first world problems" only on GTAM.
 
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