Construction flagman authority

[tiborgh]

I was wondering under what authority are the construction flagmen directing the traffic? I am not talking about the road maintenance projects, but rather about the private construction projects adjacent to a road (think downtown condos), when the guy with the stop sign decides to stop the traffic to facilitate the construction vehicles to enter and exit the site. What is the penalty and under which HTA section falls if you fail to obey his sign? Also what is the training they have or must have?

 

[49over]

They actually have to be certified to do it. If a person disobeys there directions I don't think they can do much except call the police and hope the cops charge the person.
But don't do it I work construction and I've seen the "consequences" of ignorant drivers and there vehicles have suffered those guys don't like getting run over , paint and windshields have suffered.

 

[174Racing]

I agree with 49ovrr, don't do it! They are there to provide safety to both the people working in the site and you! Show the flag men some respect, they have a REALLY crappy and tough job.

And the cops will side with them, we've had police sit in our jobs and they had no tolerance for drivers being d**ks in the construction zone.

I am actually a little curious why you would even consider this!

 

[Macs]

I am actually a little curious why you would even consider this!

Me too, I dunno about you OP but I won't be challenging a cement mixer/dump truck/CAT equipment any time soon, cause like it or not if there's a flag person they have the right of way and you need to treat it like a stop sign or red light. Not to mention the size difference

 

[nobbie48]

I try to show more patience for heavy equipment operators in congested areas but at the same time I resent their attitude when they think they're god. The "I'm driving a dump truck and will crush you attitude".

I know they usually get paid on the equivalent of piece work but that doesn't give the right to intimidate.

Re Certified flagmen: Major companies yes but I don't think little five man paving crews take safety courses at all. I just about got rear ended once because of their stupidity. Oddly I was in my cage but my M/C training made me look in my rear view mirror and avoid getting hit.
My attitude is to treat them all like morons but not to waste brain time trying to correct the impossible. Suck up the inconvenience. It's cheaper and faster in the long run.

If you're on a bike the situation is worse if due to their ignorance they try to herd you over wet streetcar tracks, steel plates, shifting planks or mud bogs.

 

[tiborgh]

I am actually a little curious why you would even consider this!

Though there was no ugly incident that triggered my question, while commuting to downdown Toronto I've came across several flagmen who where either disrespectful or ignorant about traffic pattern and/or traffic light status, creating sometimes dangerous situations.

I am not saying that all the flagmen are like that, but it's frustrating when two lanes out of four are already out due to construction and then you stumble across somebody with the attitude that they own the remaining lanes as well.

 

[Brian P]

Best thing is to suck it up and deal with it at the time, meanwhile find out what construction company is involved (you'll have plenty of time to do that if you are stuck in the construction zone ...) and call the construction company to complain, and/or call the city or the Ministry of Transportation, who issued the contract for the work. If what they are doing presents an imminent risk, pull over and call the cops and/or the Ministry of Labour.

From what I've seen, 99% of the time, they are doing the best they can under the circumstances.

 

[crankcall]

You'll encounter lots of idiots while driving around that deserve your scorn and loathing, the Flagman isnt one of them. Its a crappy hot/wet/cold/need to pee job. I give them all the room I can

 

[bunmanchi]

interesting question though.. do they have any Authority to stop you ?

same with Private police hired to help businesses with high traffic problems.

Ive had a Problem once, where a business was holding up traffic in both directions, so their customers could exit their lot.

i drove past them on the shoulder, and they didnt do anything.

 

[49over]

There job is to safely allow construction traffic in and out if job sites. They wouldn't be needed if ignorant drivers weren't rushing to the next light while talking on a phone, eating, checking make-up. It amazes me how every site I get sent to neibours and traffic ***** and complain how it is such an inconvenience for them unless it there job were working on. To all drivers out there we are building someone's home or business just like we did yours. Give them the same courtesy.

 

[Brian P]

Ive had a Problem once, where a business was holding up traffic in both directions, so their customers could exit their lot.

i drove past them on the shoulder, and they didnt do anything.

Remember that, the next time you are stuck for 14 hours in a parking lot that exits onto a really busy street because you can't get out. Might want to thank the person directing traffic for making traffic flow possible. Might want to follow their instructions to let them do their job ...

 

[bunmanchi]

Remember that, the next time you are stuck for 14 hours in a parking lot that exits onto a really busy street because you can't get out. Might want to thank the person directing traffic for making traffic flow possible. Might want to follow their instructions to let them do their job ...

what makes these people in the parking lots more important tha other people who are using the roads ?
the company that hires these cops might want to change the way their parking lot is setup.

Why can cops be rented out anyways ? do they carry their weapons ? i know they use police cars, which shouldnt be allowed.

 

[nobbie48]

interesting question though.. do they have any Authority to stop you ?

same with Private police hired to help businesses with high traffic problems.

Ive had a Problem once, where a business was holding up traffic in both directions, so their customers could exit their lot.

i drove past them on the shoulder, and they didnt do anything.

I saw a biker do the same to let a ride out of a Timmie's parking lot en masse. Down in the US of Armed they will use guns to stop you (I AM NOT KIDDING)

 

[Brian P]

what makes these people in the parking lots more important tha other people who are using the roads ?

They are equally important. But for whatever reason under certain conditions, the traffic flow does not allow the vehicles in the parking lot to get in or out at any reasonable rate. Consequently ... someone is needed to direct traffic.

the company that hires these cops might want to change the way their parking lot is setup.

Sure, but that takes time and costs money. In some cases, for 99% of the year, there is no problem with traffic flow, but special events overwhelm the normal traffic controls from time to time. In these situations, it may be better to NOT build a new traffic signal, but just hire someone to direct traffic when there is a special event. Other times, a certain traffic flow is anticipated and the sign / signal arrangement is designed according to that, but the traffic flow increases beyond what the arrangement was designed for.

Why can cops be rented out anyways ? do they carry their weapons ? i know they use police cars, which shouldnt be allowed.

Why not?

This thread exists ... which implies that there are people out there who are inclined to disobey people directing traffic (and thus risk causing a collision by doing so).

If the person directing traffic is a cop ... they most certainly carry all of the legal authority that they normally do. And ... as a driver, you have to follow their instructions. Take note of section 134 of the Highway Traffic Act.

Drivers who don't follow directions need a cop present to ensure that they follow directions ... or they get a ticket. THAT is why the cops are available to hire for those special occasions. THAT is why there is frequently a cop present at a construction site where special traffic conditions exist on account of the construction work. And why shouldn't the cops be available to hire for those situations? If they weren't there, and people got used to disregarding the construction workers because they don't have legal authority, there would be no effective traffic control, and that would be unsafe for everyone involved.

Of course, it would be a whole lot better if people FOLLOWED INSTRUCTIONS, so that the construction site wouldn't have to hire the cops ... but some people are not good at following instructions unless there is a threat of a ticket if they don't!

 

[Biker32]

According to the Highway Traffic Act, there are Two groups of people who are allowed the direct traffic on a highway (under 90 k posted limit).
1) Police officer in the performance of their duties.
2) A Traffic Control Person as described in the Construction Safety Act.
Yes some of the TCP's leave much to be desired in the way they perform their duties, BUT
Look at all the A$$it drivers out there!!!!

 

[skip]

146.1 of the HTA 2005, c. 26, Sched. A, s. 23. And yes they have to be trained and how to do it is clearly outlined. I have the big *** manuals sitting on a shelf at work.

 

[250R-ICE]

When I started out my Civil Engineering field. I was asked to help out on a major road reconstruction site. Although I was the road designer at the time. They were short staffed in the field. I ended up helping out with the traffic flagging for a day. It was an eye opener at how impatient and stupid drivers are around construction sites. They have zero regard for the safety of others. The road we were building was reduced to one lane for about 500 m. So there were two of us (flagmen) one at each end of the site directing traffic. We would hold up traffic in one direction for abput 5 mins to let the other side clear, then do the same in the other direction. Well there was this one moron who decided he was more important than everyone else and decided not to wait when I had the stop shown in his direction. The idiot almost hit a couple of construction workers and almost caused a head on collision. Then he ended up backing up traffic for over an hour while the idiot tried to back up.

So in short , just be patient it's not worth risking the the life of the people working in the construction zone. I heard to many stories of Construction workers beong seriously hurt and killed because of impatient drivers near work zones.

 

[Zoodles95]

If someone is being a flagman there is a reason for it. Believe me the blind spots in large vehicles is immense. I drive truck and bus for a living. Cars and trucks disappear in no time. A motorcycle is invisible to me if they are right in front of me, right beside me on the right etc. Another reason to be careful where and when you change lanes on the highway. Try to learn where the blind spots are on large vehicles and do not change lanes into those blind spots or ride in those blind spots.