Accident scenario, who is that fault ?

[Ghostrider619]

Hey guys I just had a quick question, I haven't been in an accident or anything ( knock on wood) but I was wondering what would happen if you got into a crash because some guy swerved in your lane when riding, you try to maneuver so the car doesnt hit you but you lost control and crashed. The guy in the car just drives off since nothing happened to his car. Or any kind of scenario for that matter where you are not at fault when you are just riding following the law & get into an accident because of other cars but they drive off / or even stay at the scene of the accident since they caused the crash. How would this situation play out in the claim process. Thank you.

 

[JoeyB]

The other vehicle never touched your vehicle...so it's a single vehicle accident...you lost control of your vehicle (regardless of the actions of the other vehicle)...it's a single vehicle accident and all your fault. Life sucks, nobody said it was fair if they did they lied to you and you were probably a kid.

 

[GreyGhost]

^ Correct answer.

 

[Riceburner]

yep. They have to make contact with you to be your fault. It can be their fault if you hit them too. i.e. someone pulls a U turn in front of you.

 

[yodude]

Or any kind of scenario for that matter where you are not at fault when you are just riding following the law & get into an accident because of other cars but they drive off / or even stay at the scene of the accident since they caused the crash. How would this situation play out in the claim process. Thank you.

depends, i clipped a merging car (from my right), contact started at my right front wheel, they were charged with unsafe lane change and didn't have a choice about leaving, car was too wrecked

i was maintaining speed & lane position and going way faster,

had i hit the bakes and had contact at the front of my vehicle, prob woulda been my fault,

i think a percentage of blame can come into the picture,

i also got rear ended by a drunk who took off, but i got a license number

 

[Riceburner]

contact was made. They were at fault for changing lanes.

 

[yodude]

dude that rear ended me ended up rear ending a cop at the next light,

whole thing ended up in court where the lawyer was trying to get the charges ditched due to technicalities, or due process, one argument/claim was driver didn't speak much english and were his rights violated,

dunno what came of that

 

[Dilligaf0220]

The other vehicle never touched your vehicle...so it's a single vehicle accident...you lost control of your vehicle (regardless of the actions of the other vehicle)...it's a single vehicle accident and all your fault. Life sucks, nobody said it was fair if they did they lied to you and you were probably a kid.

HTA 172/Street Stunting law was born out of a trucker that died after he jack knifed his rig into a ditch to dodge a lane swerving Civic. They never touched either.

On a bike, just assume you'll always be 50% at fault. So if a Bramladeshi grandma runs a red while you're making a left turn, tears your leg off above the knee, then takes off and hits three other cars trying to run.....

...Be prepared to hear a judge tell you it was half your fault. And then your ins company only needs to pay out half your awards/bike replacement cost.

She gets a $180 fine and a boost in her ins payments.

Woot Ontario FTW.


Note to self, don't hit cars that are always trying to kill you.

 

[Bermuda]

you try to maneuver so the car doesnt hit you but you lost control and crashed.

Answered your own question. You don't get hit, you lose control. Sounds like a "you" problem.

It's a raw deal, but that's just one facet of the risk involved.

 

[Rob MacLennan]

I have, in fact, been involved in an incident that was the result of a car making an unsafe lane change, that did not result in contact between myself and the car. The rider behind me washed out his front wheel under heavy braking and hit my rear wheel while sliding, taking me out. Neither of us was charged, as there were sufficient witnesses to the incident who corroborated our story, that police were convinced.

Without such witnesses, you're hooped.

 

[Ghostrider619]

I have, in fact, been involved in an incident that was the result of a car making an unsafe lane change, that did not result in contact between myself and the car. The rider behind me washed out his front wheel under heavy braking and hit my rear wheel while sliding, taking me out. Neither of us was charged, as there were sufficient witnesses to the incident who corroborated our story, that police were convinced.

Without such witnesses, you're hooped.

What about the claim. Did the insurance company hold you liable for it ?

 

[GreyGhost]

What about the claim. Did the insurance company hold you liable for it ?

Rob would be fine, he was hit from behind by another vehicle. The rider that dumped behind him would probably be at fault in the eyes of insurance (if the insurance company were told about the crash).

 

[Rob MacLennan]

What about the claim. Did the insurance company hold you liable for it ?

I was not found liable for the incident. Despite police not deeming the other rider liable he decided to perform the repairs himself, rather than making a claim. He was somewhat ****** when the fire department sent him a bill for $400.00 (2 trucks @ $100.00/hour, each, for 2 hours), for attending the scene. Insurance would have covered that.

 

[Dresden]

HTA 172/Street Stunting law was born out of a trucker that died after he jack knifed his rig into a ditch to dodge a lane swerving Civic. They never touched either.

On a bike, just assume you'll always be 50% at fault. So if a Bramladeshi grandma runs a red while you're making a left turn, tears your leg off above the knee, then takes off and hits three other cars trying to run.....

...Be prepared to hear a judge tell you it was half your fault. And then your ins company only needs to pay out half your awards/bike replacement cost.

She gets a $180 fine and a boost in her ins payments.

Woot Ontario FTW.


Note to self, don't hit cars that are always trying to kill you.

Insurance companies do their own fault determination. You can be found not at fault by the Judge and at-fault by the insurance company; it is mutually exclusive.

Where did you get this info about HTA 172 being born out of the trucker accident? IIRC there were a number of street racing tragedies that happened which brought it about. This one on ponytrail/burnamthorpe in Mississauga sticks out in my mind as it happened to a friend of a friend. The media BLEW this one up at the time.

http://honda-tech.com/drag-racing-3...ontario-canada-street-race-read-learn-224594/

 

[Flywheel]

The other vehicle never touched your vehicle...so it's a single vehicle accident...you lost control of your vehicle (regardless of the actions of the other vehicle)...it's a single vehicle accident and all your fault. Life sucks, nobody said it was fair if they did they lied to you and you were probably a kid.

Contact is key. Had a turkey pull an unsignalled U-turn from a dead stop in front of me. Hard left, hammered the brakes and slid into an illegally parked car. Would have stopped short but the brake lines burst (fairly common according to the TT driver). Missed the turkey, thankfully, since her kids were in the back. She got to drive away with no consequences. Cops didn't care about the mechanical failure (big puddle of brake fluid) or the illegal parker either (despite being a safety issue in front of a playground). Owners of that car were accusing me of driving without insurance or a license before I pulled my wallet out. Rich, eh? Result? 100% at fault for me!

 

[Rob MacLennan]

Contact is key. Had a turkey pull an unsignalled U-turn from a dead stop in front of me. Hard left, hammered the brakes and slid into an illegally parked car. Would have stopped short but the brake lines burst (fairly common according to the TT driver). Missed the turkey, thankfully, since her kids were in the back. She got to drive away with no consequences. Cops didn't care about the mechanical failure (big puddle of brake fluid) or the illegal parker either (despite being a safety issue in front of a playground). Owners of that car were accusing me of driving without insurance or a license before I pulled my wallet out. Rich, eh? Result? 100% at fault for me!

Pity that it happened in city limits:

7. (1) If automobile “A” is parked when it is struck by automobile “B”, the driver of automobile “A” is not at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is 100 per cent at fault for the incident. R.R.O. 1990, Reg. 668, s. 17 (1).

(2) If automobile “A” is illegally parked, stopped or standing when it is struck by automobile “B” and if the incident occurs outside a city, town or village, the driver of automobile “A” is 100 per cent at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is not at fault for the incident. R.R.O. 1990, Reg. 668, s. 17 (2).

(That's from the insurance rules of fault determination)

 

[Baggsy]

Pity that it happened in city limits:

7. (1) If automobile “A” is parked when it is struck by automobile “B”, the driver of automobile “A” is not at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is 100 per cent at fault for the incident. R.R.O. 1990, Reg. 668, s. 17 (1).

(2) If automobile “A” is illegally parked, stopped or standing when it is struck by automobile “B” and if the incident occurs outside a city, town or village, the driver of automobile “A” is 100 per cent at fault and the driver of automobile “B” is not at fault for the incident. R.R.O. 1990, Reg. 668, s. 17 (2).

(That's from the insurance rules of fault determination)

Brother in law got dinged for careless when he hit a parked car.

The basic premise is that you're not supposed to do something wrong to avoid a collision. e.g. drive on the sidewalk, wrong side of the road etc. It can be rough on a motorcycle.

 

[yodude]

the bottom line is the person who may be the main cause of an accident/incident, could end up driving away without any repercussions and from that, you can can end up with repercussions that include liability, money, financial ruin, maimed for life or dead,

on another note, in regards to ins at fault world views, it's my understanding that any private property parking scenario is automatically assessed at 50/50 at fault (or almost impossible to prove otherwise), even if you are sitting parked in your car and someone hits you,

in motion accidents liability/at fault on private property roadways, like at malls, is very different than on public roads, in terms of police charges (or even any involvement by them) and ins COs

 

[yodude]

one day i was in the middle lane westbound on hw#7, puttin' along with morning rush hour, when i glanced in my mirror and could tell right away someone was coming up on me way fast,

he passed to my right at the last second real close to the point that just thought wtf?? a..hole; fast is one thing, then last second lane change...

next thing i know he's on my right and slammed on his brakes when i noticed a second car also driving crazy fast, musta been following the first, ended up committed to my right side (again just missed getting rear ended) with no outs when the guy in front slammed on his brakes

that second car then with no other options slammed on the brakes, but too late (& close), smacked the first car, then lost control & went off to the right (over sidewalk or shoulder) into a grassy area & might'a been a lightpole there scenario, dunno exactly, all happened real fast to my right & few cars behind me seemed to be slowing/responding to the car that went off to the right,

so first car ended up getting rear ended, bumped forward somewhat but maintained control & continued forward speeding to the next light then turned right, from what i observed, no one would have caught the plate or make of that car & i wasn't about to drive fast/speed to maybe catch that info

with what played out figured something was going on with those 2 cars/drivers & that was that

 

[H4x0rz]

vehicle can be indirectly involved that made no contact.

As long as you are able to quantify it ..

Fault determined by insurance companies, so you do the math! Cheers.