Emergency braking

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DaveTheCanuck said:
Shouldn't the down-shifting follow the braking?

I was taught to smoothly apply both breaks while firmly gripping the bike. Once at a complete stop, check behind you while simultaneously "stomping down" the gears to first.
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problem is if you're already stopped it's hard to downshift to 1st, esp if you're in a higher gear like 5th or 6th. we were taught to be tapping the gear shifter constantly until stopped while braking (even if you think you're already in first) and that way you know you're in 1st ready to go if someone behind you isn't stopping.
 
kamikaze said:
problem is if you're already stopped it's hard to downshift to 1st, esp if you're in a higher gear like 5th or 6th. we were taught to be tapping the gear shifter constantly until stopped while braking (even if you think you're already in first) and that way you know you're in 1st ready to go if someone behind you isn't stopping.
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Taught the same thing. Get down to 1st incase you have to escape the car not stopping behind you.
 
2live&ride said:
Next time you're in your car, without pushing the brakes, take the gear shifter from D to 3...
You'll have better understanding of the concept then.
I would personally downshift and use both brakes simultaneously for maximum braking power.
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I know what you are saying... Use the engine to slow the bike down.

Same idea what you do in a manual transmission car
 
2live&ride said:
Next time you're in your car, without pushing the brakes, take the gear shifter from D to 3...
You'll have better understanding of the concept then.
I would personally downshift and use both brakes simultaneously for maximum braking power.
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if your downshifting is actually slowing the bike down when you are stomping on the brake. you aren't really emergency braking.

Gearing down while slowing down is just a good habit to keep you in a situation where you can accelerate again right away. But if youa re just talking about stopping ASAP. downshifting isnt' going to make a spec of difference.
 
2live&ride said:
Next time you're in your car, without pushing the brakes, take the gear shifter from D to 3...
You'll have better understanding of the concept then.
I would personally downshift and use both brakes simultaneously for maximum braking power.
Click to expand...

FYI, it is proven that combination of downshifting and releasing the clutch results to longer stopping distances.
 
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yea, I don't know how you'd be able to downshift during emergency braking anyway, i mean proper downshifting and letting the clutch out in each gear. easier and quicker to just hold in the clutch and bang the gears down as fast as possible while applying pressure to the brakes. gotta watch putting too much pressure on the rear tho, since you're hard on the front it makes the rear reallllly light and it'll lock up real easy.
 
kamikaze said:
yea, I don't know how you'd be able to downshift during emergency braking anyway, i mean proper downshifting and letting the clutch out in each gear. easier and quicker to just hold in the clutch and bang the gears down as fast as possible while applying pressure to the brakes. gotta watch putting too much pressure on the rear tho, since you're hard on the front it makes the rear reallllly light and it'll lock up real easy.
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Precisely the point.

When you bring the rear tire to the max amount of force it can hold (boundary with the skidding/locking point), there is nothing the engine break can help with. It will lock the tire (even if for the split of a sec), and the tire will skid ( loss of friction = less braking power).

The video that I watched (couldn't find) concluded that, because the rider has to multitask between the brakes and the clutch/downshift orientation, the rider will pay less attention to the brakes and will have hard time coming to that boundary, which results longer braking distances.
 
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whetaus-tr said:
because the rider has to multitask between the brakes and the clutch/downshift orientation, the rider will pay less attention to the brakes and will have hard time coming to that boundary, which results longer braking distances.
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This is what i was told as well
 
2live&ride said:
Next time you're in your car, without pushing the brakes, take the gear shifter from D to 3...
You'll have better understanding of the concept then.
I would personally downshift and use both brakes simultaneously for maximum braking power.
Click to expand...

i agree with dave. in my emergency braking scenarios... i slammed my brakes while down shifting, and then held those brakes as i continued shifting down through lower gears as speed went down more. i never waiting to downshift to start my braking.

i think the very first lever you grab should be brake. just because many people WILL freeze up in the situation, and engine braking,although effective, just isnt as effective as actual braking. and if i had to choose one, i not able to touch anything else... it would be my right hand lever.
 
cbcanada said:
I know what you are saying... Use the engine to slow the bike down.

Same idea what you do in a manual transmission car
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In a manual transmission car, the idea is slightly different since both the front and the rear brakes are controlled with the same lever.

And just because the braking force is less on the rear in a car (perhaps wrong to generalize), it would be useful to add a little bit of braking power from the hand-brake, IMO.
 
Worst one I had was last year - was accelerating out on to the highway so weight was back and there was car turning left from my lane in a dip......grabbed all the ABS - figured I was not going to stop and like the other rider above went around on a narrow strip of pavement.

One thing I think all riders should know is how their bike handles when they have to get off the pavement. I think that's more important than almost any other skill.

Get on the dirt roads and find out how your bike handles then - that's when the emphasis shifts to rear brake and confidence.

•••

BTW front brake only in the wet or less than ideal pavement can get you into trouble right quick. You do need that rear brake for direction control.

This trip down under with the KLR will be useful when I get back to the Burgman as it's giving me back a lot of off road skills that were rusty - directional braking with the rear being one of them and staying in control in uncertain conditions.

With the marginal brakes and relatively poor grip on pavement of the 80/20 tires - the best practice is not even get close to a panic braking situation here.

The ABS, low c of g and big brakes on the Burgman are a real feature - one reason I bought it- the exact opposite is true of the KLR - oil drum on stilts is the description that fits best.

Despite the "get on the gravel" comment - I do recommend panic braking practice under controlled conditions.
It will give you confidence where you have to make the hard brake versus go around split second decision.
 
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whetaus-tr said:
FYI, it is proven that downshifting results to longer stopping distances.
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In an emergency situation your not going to be able to release the clutch between downshifts to take advantage of the engine braking but if you need to accelerate back out of the situation you'll be in a gear that will work. You should be able to apply brakes/shift down/hold your clutch in without increasing your breaking distance. When you slow down to come to a stop you should be down shifting not rocking the bike and banging on your shifter after your stopped.

Not all directed at you but to this whole thread. Seems alot of people need to go to a riding course not just the one to pass your liscence (which is too easy IMO).
 
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Jayv said:
We should make riders training mandatory in this Country.
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Internet training and speeling training would be a start. But yes, you're right. Driver/rider training is a joke.
 
I love threads like this!

And people wonder why 1st year riders pay $4000/yr to insure a CBR125.
 
260km/h or so. Thankfully Calabogie has good pavement, because I zigged when I should have zagged. Then I ended up wheelying through the apex on corner 20 and lowsided. :(

And yeah........................ rider training is good, mmmmk?
 
Wow this is some funny ****.... I cant agree more with people saying New riders should all have to take a safety course of some sort... 1[SUP]st[/SUP] big newbie mistake is to grab a hand full of brake watching it fish tale behind you....
 
The problem is the one that the ministry offers to get your M2 is so easy that as long as you don't lay it down you pass so essentially anyone that can ride around a few pylons hit the brakes and cough up $400 gets a shiny card that says M2.
 
Yep corner 20 takes on to the front straight. Uphill left sweeper that goes off-camber just as you crest the hill. I'll be taking that at less than neutral throttle from here in and go for corner speed instead of acceleration.


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